High Flying Defense: Good or Bad?

[SuperMatt18]

If the Flames moved from where they are in shots against (13th - 2231) to the very best in the league (1st - 2091). It would mean they would have only given up 16 fewer goals this season, while maintaining a .890 save percentage.

If this team would move from the worst save percentage in the league (.890) to league average (.910) while giving up the same amount of shots (2231) they would have given up 44 fewer goals this season.

Pretty clear to see where this team has more opportunity to improve, and what was the bigger issue this season.

Also when it comes down to Scoring Chance For/Against differential the Flames are pretty much exactly at 50%. So not like we give up a ridiculous amount of high quality chances compared to what we generate.

Lots of room for improvement on this team when it comes to suppressing shots and shot quality but the defensive issues this year have really been magnified by how truly terrible our goaltending has been.

[DJones]

I say keep the defense pressing. If anything I don't like how our 3rd pairing can't push the pace enough. Hopefully someone will come up and fill in there soon.

Goaltending and forwards helping out on defense can solve a lot of the problems. I find our defensive lapses have nothing to do with being too offensive anyway. It's more a lack of awareness of positioning. It's a different problem.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I don't think anybody thinks that the teams defensive zone and special teams play isn't a problem. People are just arguing that goaltending is clearly the biggest problem right now.

Ramo has a .909 save percentage on the season (.910 adj) - no one wants him back.
Ortio has a .903 save percentage (.905 adj)

Neither of these two goalies are "the problem". The reality is though that high save percentages seem impossible for this team due to the quality of chances they give up.

Hiller is more of a side show and no one is seriously using him to judge this team's play.

Last game was 27-26 anaheim. Hardly a shooting gallery either.

That is a lazy analysis. When the game was tied, the Ducks dominated. When the Ducks led by one, the Ducks domianted, when the Ducks led by two, the Ducks dominated. When the Ducks led by three, the Ducks sat back. There were at least five, maybe six goals scored last night that I would not put on the goalies, they were just **** coverage. At that point you can't even worry about the two softies and one "maybe shoulda coulda" goal.

[DJones]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Ramo has a .909 save percentage on the season (.910 adj) - no one wants him back.
Ortio has a .903 save percentage (.905 adj)

Neither of these two goalies are "the problem". The reality is though that high save percentages seem impossible for this team due to the quality of chances they give up.

Hiller is more of a side show and no one is seriously using him to judge this team's play.



That is a lazy analysis. When the game was tied, the Ducks dominated. When the Ducks led by one, the Ducks domianted, when the Ducks led by two, the Ducks dominated. When the Ducks led by three, the Ducks sat back. There were at least five, maybe six goals scored last night that I would not put on the goalies, they were just **** coverage. At that point you can't even worry about the two softies and one "maybe shoulda coulda" goal.

We had a fine save percentage last year with a worse team. If we get better goalies I don't see why we can't improve.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Also when it comes down to Scoring Chance For/Against differential the Flames are pretty much exactly at 50%. So not like we give up a ridiculous amount of high quality chances compared to what we generate.

When Games are tied, the Flames High Danger Chance differential is 46.5%. They give up 12.8 high danger chances against per 60 minutes. The Panthers, for instance, give up 9.4 high danger chances against per 60 minutes when tied.

There's a clear difference in which team is likely to get scored on regardless of goaltending. The FLames chase every game and compensate their stats. But they don't play well when the game is actually in the balance.

[dino7c]

Plenty of goal tenders put up decent numbers on bad teams...again its not the only issue just the biggest issue...Management knows it, reporters know it, fans with any sense know it

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

That is a lazy analysis. When the game was tied, the Ducks dominated. When the Ducks led by one, the Ducks domianted, when the Ducks led by two, the Ducks dominated. When the Ducks led by three, the Ducks sat back. There were at least five, maybe six goals scored last night that I would not put on the goalies, they were just **** coverage. At that point you can't even worry about the two softies and one "maybe shoulda coulda" goal.

All of this narrative you've provided happened on the first five shots. It's not lazy at all.

I can't believe you're serious. Did you even watch the game?

And here come the "high danger" numbers

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

All of this narrative you've provided happened on the first five shots.

I just can't believe you're serious. Did you even watch the game?

Are you seriously suggesting leaving Corey Perry on an Island with Hiller, and letting Silfverberg tap in a cross-ice freeby off the cycle were just "shots"?

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Ramo has a .909 save percentage on the season (.910 adj) - no one wants him back.
Ortio has a .903 save percentage (.905 adj)

Neither of these two goalies are "the problem". The reality is though that high save percentages seem impossible for this team due to the quality of chances they give up.

Hiller is more of a side show and no one is seriously using him to judge this team's play.

That is a lazy analysis.

It's an even lazier analysis to just say Hiller is a side show and you can't use him to judge the teams play. He has played more games than Ortio this season, so if you can use Ortio to judge the teams play then you can also use the 27 games that Hiller played.

When Ramo got injured the team was actually looking pretty good and had battled back to within reaching distance of a playoff spot. Then Hiller became the starter again and we are where we are now.

Also last night the shots were pretty much even all night. Goal 1 was a bad turnover (by a forward), but goals 2 and 3 were purely on goaltending. At that point the game is already pretty much over. 3 goals on 5 shots, with 2 of them being weak. Can't really blame the team play on any of that.

[GioforPM]

Last game was very bad D (in the first period at least) and bad goaltending (from both goalies). It also happened to be against one of the best teams in the NHL right now. But this topic is about the team and the season as a whole. Let's not project last night's game play onto the entire season.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Are you seriously suggesting leaving Corey Perry on an Island with Hiller, and letting Silfverberg tap in a cross-ice freeby off the cycle were just "shots"?

Goal 2 wasn't a cross ice freebie - it was a bad angle/low danger shot that Hiller failed to catch, then trickled through his pads, hit the post and then laid on the goalline for Silfverberg to tap in.

A real goalie catches the first shot and the play is dead.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Are you seriously suggesting leaving Corey Perry on an Island with Hiller, and letting Silfverberg tap in a cross-ice freeby off the cycle were just "shots"?

8 goals on 27 shots.

I repeat. 8 goals on 27 shots.

I would MAYBE expect 8 goals to go in if there were 27 break-aways in the game.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

goal 2 purely on goaltending.

This is purely on goaltending:



Right.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

This is purely on goaltending:



Right.

After Hiller failed to stop the initial shot on net. From a "low danger" area. Post the entire clip, this is lazy.

[DJones]

Edit; Unneccesary

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

This is purely on goaltending:



Right.

Watch the whole play leading up to that and not just a screenshot.

Why did the puck end up wide open at the back post - because Hiller failed to catch a bad angle shot, then let it get through his pads somehow, and it hit the post to lay there for Silfverberg.

The only reason that play happens is because Hiller fails to control his crease and doesn't handle the first shot cleanly - which he should of.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

After Hiller failed to stop the initial shot on net. From a "low danger" area. Post the entire clip, this is lazy.

No, it's lazy to blame the goalie purely for that. He should have had that shot but there's no way Silfverberg should be the only guy in the vicinity.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

No, it's lazy to blame the goalie purely for that. He should have had that shot but there's no way Silfverberg should be the only guy in the vicinity.

You're absolving him of any blame man. If Hiller stops that, Silfverberg isn't a threat. Monahan is in the correct position.

I'm done, you don't get it.

[Mister Yamoto]

Things were so much more fun at this time last year.

I blame Sportsnet. They really have ruined hockey.

[DJones]

https://gfycat.com/RegalDamagedCoypu

That's all Hiller. Hits him in the chest and it ends up behind him. Engellend followed his man a bit too much. But if Hiller makes the easy save it's a nothing play