What will Colborne's new contract be?

[AC]

I've been a big proponent of Colborne's for a few years now.

That being said I don't want us paying him too much as I think his type of production can be replaced relatively inexpensively.

Getting rid of our excess contracts is the biggest priority for this team. Stajan, Bollig, Wideman, and Smid or Engelland. Those are the guys that should be gone ASAP.

[CalgaryFan1988]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

And? Losing those guys isn't a big deal. You have no clue how good teams build a contender. Do you think Chicago was happy to get rid of Byfuglien and Ladd? And the other good players they lost to the cap crunch?

Colborne is garbage which isn't blind disdain. Two teams gave up on him already and soon to be a third team.

Our 3rd best forward scorer is "garbage" and it's not blind disdain?

Chicago is good because they've had good forward depth for years. We clearly don't have good forward depth at the moment.

Sure we need to upgrade on certain players, but just letting an inexpensive RFA walk and replacing them with an inferior minor leaguer is Oilers hockey.

[druetetective]

When will fans start appreciating Colborne? 50 points?

Anyways its hilarious to me the same posters that want to ship Colborne out of town are the same ones gung-ho for acquiring Kevin Hayes.

Guess what? they are very similar players!

Colborne is 2 years older. Ill get that out the way.
Colborne PPG 0.52 Hayes PPG 0.46
Colborne's advanced stats are better
Hayes is luckier (PDO)
Most telling though IMO is that Colborne produces more yet he starts his shifts in the O-zone only 44% of the time. Hayes starts in the offensive zone a whopping 62% of the time.

Still not convinced?
Colborne has thrown 120 hits. Hayes has 67.
Colborne has 26 takeaways and 30 giveaways. Hayes has 22 TK to 39 GV.
Hayes plays Center enough to have 350 FO's taken. He is the worst faceoff man in the NHL at 35%. Colborne is at 57% with a smaller sample size of 150 draws. He can take and win important faceoffs for us like Iggy use to in his prime.

Joe Colborne is a better hockey player than Kevin Hayes

I feel like starting a new thread with this post to get it through peoples heads!!!

[polak]

Anyone with eyes knows that Colborne is not our 3rd best forward. How many of his goals are clean shots?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

And? Losing those guys isn't a big deal. You have no clue how good teams build a contender. Do you think Chicago was happy to get rid of Byfuglien and Ladd? And the other good players they lost to the cap crunch?

Colborne is garbage which isn't blind disdain. Two teams gave up on him already and soon to be a third team.

That's a lovely sentiment for a local kid who is doing quite well this year despite the detractors. Not everyone is Gaudreau, Monahan or Bennett. But after those three, and maybe Frolik and Backlund, no forward has been a model of consistency (hell - Bennett hasn't either for that matter).

Despite the criticism, Colborne has held his own points-wise all year, not just in the last month - ahead of pretty much everyone he would normally be expected to be ahead of. And I don't think he's bad defensively at all. And now I think he's finding his role where he can dig the puck and get it to guys like Bennett or Backlund - that's worked well. He was trying to do things he shouldn't before. He's improved his production each and every year in Calgary. That's in contrast to, for example, Bouma.

IMO signing Colborne would be a no-brainer if it wasn't for Bouma's precedent setting contract.

Oh, and two teams giving up one him? Boston traded him for Kaberle, who they figured they needed. And forgive me if I don't rely on the Toronto Maple Leafs as an assessor of talent, especially back then.

[CalgaryFan1988]

Originally Posted by polak

Anyone with eyes knows that Colborne is not our 3rd best forward. How many of his goals are clean shots?

Who cares? Statistically he is our 3rd best forward this season. Would you rather say he's a top 5 forward on the current team? Either way he isn't "garbage" and is an alright 3rd liner. Which we need.

Some People seem to think everyone should be knocking on the door for the 1st line or ship them out. It's a very short sighted way of thinking.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by polak

Anyone with eyes knows that Colborne is not our 3rd best forward. How many of his goals are clean shots?

I don't know. How many are from crashing the net and hard work? Just because a puck goes in off your ass doesn't mean you don't deserve the goal.

I won't say he's the third best forward, or even the fifth best. But we aren't talking about paying him what Frolik or Backlund make either.

[Fan in Exile]

Has it not occurred to anyone that when we improve team defence, and particularly if we get a system or coach that isn't so gung ho about our defense jumping up in the rush at every opportunity, that we might also see a drop-off in our scoring? I don't see how anyone looks at our forward group and figures we don't need to concern ourselves with secondary scoring. I understand why people are not overly excited about Colborne but we don't have any AHL prospects that are ready to fill his shoes and we already have three top-six forward positions to fill. Colborne has some value to this team, at least for the next two seasons or so. I don't see his cap hit being a problem even if it's double what it is now. Much bigger cap issues with other players.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Oh give me a break. I'm totally able to understand and comprehend just fine just think we don't need Colborne for our secondary scoring "concerns". He played like hot garbage when the games mattered and only stepped it up under zero pressure which I have no doubt Conroy was alluding to. He's soft, doesn't hit and I've never seen a player get so lucky with their goals as he has in the last month. I don't think the Flames will even re-sign him probably trade him for a fourth rounder.

I take issue with this particular part. He doesn't blow people up a lot, but he finishes his checks regularly. He's got 119 hits on the year, and has just as many as guys like Weise, Virtanen, Cogliano, Palmieri etc. Those are not really soft players IMO, and neither is Colborne anymore. I feel like this is a preconception that started when he first arrived and Burke made that speech about him not being a hard player, but he's changed a lot since then, and while he'll never be Milan Lucic, he's plenty physical enough for my liking.

My one issue with Colborne has been, and continues to be, on-ice awareness. He lacks great vision, in both the offensive and defensive zones, which makes him a liability defensively, and weak link for his line offensively. With experience he's slowly gotten better, but it's taking quite a while. However, considering his tool-set, I'm totally fine keeping him for another short contract (2-3 years) and seeing where he goes. That combination of size, speed, and skill is not found very often. Plus, he's an amazing shootout specialist.

[polak]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

Who cares? Statistically he is our 3rd best forward this season. Would you rather say he's a top 5 forward on the current team? Either way he isn't "garbage" and is an alright 3rd liner. Which we need.

Some People seem to think everyone should be knocking on the door for the 1st line or ship them out. It's a very short sighted way of thinking.

Oh man how quickly we forget all of the horrible plays that Colborne was responsible for in the least two years. He is as talented as Mason Raymond but has been lucky in his last few weeks.

If we resign him he will revert back to the whipping boy in short order. ESPECIALLY if he's put back into his actual role where he's not getting lucky points here and there by having backlund and monahan use him as a backboard. Once he's put back in the bottom six he becomes a timid giant that plays like a small guy and has a low hockey IQ which makes him prone to terrible mistakes.

[Itse]

I think relying on our defensemen for scoring is in part a necessity turned into virtue, and it's hurting our defense. That's why we IMO need better depth forwards. (Although they need to do more than put up points.)

This is only somewhat related to Colborne though. He's obviously more of a one-way forward. (Which is a reason why he's being used on the PP. Only Brodie and Giordano play both PK and PP, everyone else essentially plays one or the other. With Backlund, Bouma and Frolik being our main PK forwards, that leaves Colborne as the next best option on the PP.)

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by polak

Oh man how quickly we forget all of the horrible plays that Colborne was responsible for in the least two years. He is as talented as Mason Raymond but has been lucky in his last few weeks.

If we resign him he will revert back to the whipping boy in short order. ESPECIALLY if he's put back into his actual role where he's not getting lucky points here and there by having backlund and monahan use him as a backboard. Once he's put back in the bottom six he becomes a timid giant that plays like a small guy and has a low hockey IQ which makes him prone to terrible mistakes.

Were you a Flames fan 5 years ago? If you were then you'd know how many bad plays Brodie was responsible for just about every game.

But guess what? Players learn and develop in the NHL. They don't regress at the age of 25, especially if they are considered late bloomers, which Colborne most definitely is.

He's a solid 3rd liner and if you can get him for 3rd line money then why not?

By the way, I hope you Colborne haters know that the Flames wouldn't of made the playoffs last season if not for Colbornes shootout success. He was responsible for 4-5 points which would of been the difference between making it and not.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

This logically makes no sense. He's been trending up ever since we acquired him and this will likely continue.

Colborne is big, skilled and starting to use his recently filled in frame. This is the exact type of player you keep as a solid 3rd line option. He is the type of player who can also fill in on the top-2 lines if necessary.

Also a shootout specialist which is just a bonus.

I'd be happy to offer him 2-2.5 mil for 2-3 years.

You think he's going to keep trending up?

I don't think he'll be as good next year when his sh% falls down to earth.

[Demetric]

500 K Euro per year ...

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

You think he's going to keep trending up?

I don't think he'll be as good next year when his sh% falls down to earth.

I think if he smooths out the kinks hampering his game - lacking a bit of physicality, making the simple plays rather than look for the highlight reel feed, consistency in general, he can at least hold pat as a 40 pt bottom 6 winger even if his shooting % regresses.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

I think if he smooths out the kinks hampering his game - lacking a bit of physicality, making the simple plays rather than look for the highlight reel feed, consistency in general, he can at least hold pat as a 40 pt bottom 6 winger even if his shooting % regresses.

I don't know, I think we are seeing the start of peak Colborne right now. 15 goals and 30 points should be the most anyone should expect in spite of his totals this year. Just because they made a mistake with Bouma, doesn't mean they should repeat it with Colborne.

[GranteedEV]

Arbitration is the biggest concern with Colborne. Will he be qualified or will they turn him UFA and try to re-sign him without the RFA leverage?

[polak]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

Were you a Flames fan 5 years ago? If you were then you'd know how many bad plays Brodie was responsible for just about every game.

But guess what? Players learn and develop in the NHL. They don't regress at the age of 25, especially if they are considered late bloomers, which Colborne most definitely is.

He's a solid 3rd liner and if you can get him for 3rd line money then why not?

By the way, I hope you Colborne haters know that the Flames wouldn't of made the playoffs last season if not for Colbornes shootout success. He was responsible for 4-5 points which would of been the difference between making it and not.

You're comparing 20 year old defenseman Brodie making mistakes to 26 year old forward Colborne making mistakes.

I don't think he's a solid 3rd liner because he can't be counted to make the sound defensive play. His shooting percentage has been brought up already but that needs to be emphasized again since it was only 12% the last two years and now it's sky rocketed to 18% which is even more suspect when combined with eye test and the rather unanimous opinion that a lot of his recent scoring has been lucky.

[saillias]

I don't know about the "he did it in meaningless games" argument. There are 82 games a year, playoffs or not they play all of them and are paid for all of them. Colborne didn't just choose to start scoring now.

His first half was god-awful (also applies to half the D, half the forwards and all 3 goalies) and he improved a lot after the healthy scratch.

An arbitrator would ignore that argument because 35+ points is 35+ points.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

You think he's going to keep trending up?

I don't think he'll be as good next year when his sh% falls down to earth.

The only thing Colborne has really struggled with is consistency. He's been more consistent this season and the stats back it up.

You can use sh% to say he'll fall back down, but literally everything else indicates that he'll continue to trend up.

It's always a safe bet that young players get better the more time they spend in the NHL. Colborne is still young. Math checks out. Not sure why you're surprised by this.