[News] Jagr surpasses Gordie Howe for 3rd all time in points. 1851 points and counting.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

did they do the math for the seasons that Howe or Gretzky were in the WHA?

We don't talk about those lest the NHL overlords hear it and banish us.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I don't think anyone can really make a case for Gretzky in terms of stats for his time in the WHA. He played one single season - it would have been his rookie year. He was 17! He wouldn't have turned 18 until January of 1979.

Fair point with Howe. I just don't see it being much of a factor with Gretzky.

[Komskies]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

I don't think anyone can really make a case for Gretzky in terms of stats for his time in the WHA. He played one single season - it would have been his rookie year. He was 17! He wouldn't have turned 18 until January of 1979.

Fair point with Howe. I just don't see it being much of a factor with Gretzky.

Gretzky could've had another 100+ points if he played that first season in the NHL. Bobby Hull played 6 full seasons in the WHA. I wonder how many goals he would've had if he spent his entire career in the NHL.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by Komskies

Gretzky could've had another 100+ points if he played that first season in the NHL. Bobby Hull played 6 full seasons in the WHA. I wonder how many goals he would've had if he spent his entire career in the NHL.

Gretzky was 17 when he played in the WHA so his WHA numbers don't really factor.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Robbob

Gretzky was 17 when he played in the WHA so his WHA numbers don't really factor.

Turned 18 in January. Got over 100 points in the WHA, which probably would have equated to 70 or 80 points in the NHL.

[Calgary4LIfe]

It is tough to say how many points Gretzky would have achieved (if he was even allowed to play at 17 in the NHL) in the NHL vs the WHA. How watered down was the WHA? IIRC, the WHA had a lower draft age (18?) and the NHL was higher - or was this in a different era I am thinking of?

I would just like to see the Goals per game average in the WHA vs the NHL before we can at least make a closer assumption of how productive Gretzky would have been.

It is a bit of a moot point anyways - I don't think anyone is going to dispute that Gretzky was better than Jagr. Howe is a more valid argument anyways concerning his WHA time. Always tough to compare different eras as well.

In my opinion - which is my opinion only - I would rank Lemieux first, Gretzky second... and then I have a tough time between Orr, Jagr, Howe and maybe even Lidstrom. I think at any rate, he is definitely in that ballpark.

It is just nice to see history unfolding at any rate. I really do hope he passes Messier (though of course, next season - come back Jagr!). Getting to 3rd is a huge achievement that we may not see again in our lifetime, and perhaps getting to 2nd. Bonus year with Holtby possibly doing something that has never been done before would be special too.

[MoneyGuy]

I'm a big Mark Messier fan (one of my all-time favourites) and think it's unfortunate that Jagr will likely pass him. I like Jagr, too. He's deserving.

[Locke]

Look its just all in good fun, you cant compare everything because the eras are completely different.

Comparing Gretzky's rookie season at 17 in the WHA from 1978 is a lot less relevant than attempting to estimate Jagr's potential production from 2010-2013.

[codynw]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

I'm a big Mark Messier fan (one of my all-time favourites) and think it's unfortunate that Jagr will likely pass him. I like Jagr, too. He's deserving.

[Calgary4LIfe]

You have to be a die-hard fan of one of the teams he played for (and not a Canuck fan) to like Messier and his dirty elbows.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Locke

Look its just all in good fun, you cant compare everything because the eras are completely different.

Comparing Gretzky's rookie season at 17 in the WHA from 1978 is a lot less relevant than attempting to estimate Jagr's potential production from 2010-2013.

Here is another what if scenario. What if Gretzky didn't play in the WHA, but stayed in the OHL and then was drafted in 1979 by Colorado Rockies who held the 1st pick in the draft.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

I'm a big Mark Messier fan (one of my all-time favourites) and think it's unfortunate that Jagr will likely pass him. I like Jagr, too. He's deserving.

The door is right over there.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Buff

Here is another what if scenario. What if Gretzky didn't play in the WHA, but stayed in the OHL and then was drafted in 1979 by Colorado Rockies who held the 1st pick in the draft.

Then he'd probably have ended up starting his pro career with a franchise that relocated instead of one that folded. Not even Gretzky could have kept the Rockies in Denver.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

Then he'd probably have ended up starting his pro career with a franchise that relocated instead of one that folded. Not even Gretzky could have kept the Rockies in Denver.

The same franchise that he later called a Mickey Mouse club!

[hwy19man]

Jagr gets two assists in tonight's game against the Devils. I just received an email saying that Jagr is the oldest player to hit 60 points in a season and is now only 26 points behind Messier.

[getbak]

I really hope he comes back for one more season just so he can pass Messier.

[gvitaly]

That's very impressive, especially if we consider that the entire Flames roster for tonight's game vs LA has 1762 regular season points!

[tvp2003]

So what award will Jagr be named after when he retires?

Longevity/lifetime achievement?
Best European player?
Best hockey hair?

[Muta]

Jagr is a beast. He spits in Father Time's face and I love it. Dude looks like he's having so much fun out there, which is fricking awesome.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by tvp2003

So what award will Jagr be named after when he retires?

Longevity/lifetime achievement?
Best European player?
Best hockey hair?

Lidstrom to me may actually be the best European player ever.