'The Walking Dead- TV show ONLY! Only spoilers allowed are about PAST TV episodes!

[Radio]

Wonder if Morgan is making a cage for Rick? To break him, to bring him back?

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Locke

I hear what you're saying but the fact of the matter is that this is a world where the value of life has dipped to zero if not lower.

He wants to give people the benefit of the doubt and allow them to prove their good intentions.

We've seen it, 9 times out of 10 that that ain't happening. You give someone that chance and you'll be picking their knife out of your ribs.

Morgan is just lucky, hes only experienced this on a very small scale, at the personal level. Hes holding an ideal higher than life or death practicality and hes endangering himself and moreover hes endangering others.

He isnt dealing with the world as it is with any responsibility to anyone or anything other than his ideal.

I agree with that last sentence especially. You might be right on the rest of this, and yeah, he hasn't encountered extremely large groups, but that's easier to do when you're going solo. That's the thing with Morgan. He's been alone for so long that his ethics and survival approach has been born out of that solo lifestyle, and much like the way Michonne was standoffish and skeptical at first, he'll likely have to adapt his approach if he's going to stay in this group. Otherwise, I can see him going on his merry way again.

And the fact of the matter remains that right now his ass gets to live because someone else is willing to get their hands dirty so that he can keep his clean. Eventually Rick and Co. are going to get tired of saving his ass despite his kicking and screaming.

I disagree. I think Morgan would survive longer than anyone else by themselves in this world. He's been on his own for a very, very long time, and he's figured out how to survive that way, but it causes problems for him in groups where there is accountability to someone other than yourself, as I made note of above.

No one is going to make it unless everyone makes it?

Thats just not going to work. I see it more as 'no one is going to make it unless only the right people make it.'

And the wrong people? They have to be removed like a cancer. Surgically if necessary.

Interesting ethical paradigm you've created. Who gets to decide who the wrong people are? How long until the right people become the wrong people? I think your scenario creates quagmires that one cannot extract themself from should they go down that line of reasoning.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

I agree with that last sentence especially. You might be right on the rest of this, and yeah, he hasn't encountered extremely large groups, but that's easier to do when you're going solo. That's the thing with Morgan. He's been alone for so long that his ethics and survival approach has been born out of that solo lifestyle, and much like the way Michonne was standoffish and skeptical at first, he'll likely have to adapt his approach if he's going to stay in this group. Otherwise, I can see him going on his merry way again.



I disagree. I think Morgan would survive longer than anyone else by themselves in this world. He's been on his own for a very, very long time, and he's figured out how to survive that way, but it causes problems for him in groups where there is accountability to someone other than yourself, as I made note of above.



Interesting ethical paradigm you've created. Who gets to decide who the wrong people are? How long until the right people become the wrong people? I think your scenario creates quagmires that one cannot extract themself from should they go down that line of reasoning.

But again, being solo removes responsibility, and thats fine but then he cant exist as part of a group like Rick's.

Being alone abdicates him from responsibility so its easy to have moral superiority without worrying about the practicality.

You beat off a couple of guys with a stick and its all good. But if he comes up against that group of Negan's bikers hes dead.

Who is to decide who the 'wrong people' are? Rick is. Thats the whole point of 'the questions.'

[undercoverbrother]

What a great episode.

It has been a long time since I felt angst during an episode.

The "base" is clearly a FOB or Satellite location (couldn't be more obvious, IMO).

I think that Morgan might be building a Strong Hold, thinking that this will reap nothing good.

I am also interested to see where Carol's character goes. Clearly she is troubled with what she has done. Counting the number of living people she has killed (18). The belief that Maggie should be "someone else. I think her character is struggling with what she had become, which would support her avoidance of Morgan.

I could not hear some of the dialogue between Carol and Rossita. Specifically, when she mentions to Carol they should have tattled on Morgan. Carol, responds with something which I missed.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Yeah, I think Carol justifies her actions by telling herself, "I do it so no one else has to".

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Yeah, I think Carol justifies her actions by telling herself, "I do it so no one else has to".

Did you catch the exchange between C & R?

[habernac]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Did you catch the exchange between C & R?

Rosita: “I almost told everyone at the meeting”
Carol: “We are not telling them.”
Rosita: “Morgan stood up in that church and tried to talk us out of this.”
Carol: “What’s wrong with that?”
Rosita: “Maybe that he didn’t know what he’s talking about. That he should take the win that we didn’t kick his ass out for hiding that psychopath…”
Carol: “If we told everyone, they’d find out about Denise, you know that.”
Rosita: “That…xxxx tried to stand there and act like we didn’t know what we were…”
Carol: “He doesn’t want to kill.”
Rosita: “We don’t want to kill. We dont like it. It happens…Not telling anyone.”

[Locke]

Originally Posted by habernac

Rosita: “I almost told everyone at the meeting”
Carol: “We are not telling them.”
Rosita: “Morgan stood up in that church and tried to talk us out of this.”
Carol: “What’s wrong with that?”
Rosita: “Maybe that he didn’t know what he’s talking about. That he should take the win that we didn’t kick his ass out for hiding that psychopath…”
Carol: “If we told everyone, they’d find out about Denise, you know that.”
Rosita: “That…xxxx tried to stand there and act like we didn’t know what we were…”
Carol: “He doesn’t want to kill.”
Rosita: “We don’t want to kill. We dont like it. It happens…Not telling anyone.”

I'll have to re-watch that part, but find out what about Denise? I must have missed that.

[Radio]

That the Wolf tried to take her. Rick would more than banish Morgan for that.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Radio

That the Wolf tried to take her. Rick would more than banish Morgan for that.

Ah yes

thank you.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Radio

That the Wolf tried to take her. Rick would more than banish Morgan for that.

Thank you! I did not put that together.

I was thinking: "What? That shes a lesbian? I dont think thats a secret...and even if it was who cares? Tara is very clearly a lesbian and no one seems to mind."

[Alberta_Beef]

I'm not sure why it took me so long for this to click, but I am pretty sure Negan's people are the ones that were trying to kill those 3 people (w/ the diabetic girl) and had torched their entire camp, they would also be the ones that shot at Darryl, Sasha & Abraham before they got separated. So the group's experience with the saviors would be significantly more than just the RPG incident.

[Rubber Ducky]

Originally Posted by Inglewood Jack

one more thing...are the Wolves done? or are they gonna come back and be a wild card? they seemed to be some sort of weird feral group that doesn't participate in the local economy, yet they're organized enough to set up elaborate zombie truck traps. I'd be perplexed if they ended up being nothing since it took so long to set them up.

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think someone on The Talking Dead (Greg Nicotero?) confirmed that 'W' was the last of the Wolves. I don't think we're going to see the Wolves any longer. A shame, because, as you say, having a weird feral group around is creepy and dark.

On that note, I don't ever remember seeing how Rick escaped the broken-down motorhome. He shot all those Wolves creeping down the side of the motorhome, and then as he was trying to start the vehicle with walkers pouring out of the forest, it wouldn't start. Looked like he was about to bawl.

[Rubber Ducky]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

I'm not sure why it took me so long for this to click, but I am pretty sure Negan's people are the ones that were trying to kill those 3 people (w/ the diabetic girl) and had torched their entire camp, they would also be the ones that shot at Darryl, Sasha & Abraham before they got separated. So the group's experience with the saviors would be significantly more than just the RPG incident.

I'd have to watch again, but when dude came roaring out at the end on the motorbike, Darryl got pretty upset and demanded 'Where did you get that bike?'

Maybe that was his bike that the lost campers took? Perhaps his crossbow isn't far behind...?

[Radio]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

I'm not sure why it took me so long for this to click, but I am pretty sure Negan's people are the ones that were trying to kill those 3 people (w/ the diabetic girl) and had torched their entire camp, they would also be the ones that shot at Darryl, Sasha & Abraham before they got separated. So the group's experience with the saviors would be significantly more than just the RPG incident.

Absolutely, they kept talking about how they had given up everything for "protection" and that things weren't what they seemed when they first went into protective custody.

Then after the one guy cut off the other's arm he said something to the effect of "Forget her, he only wants ones that are willing." So obviously he's (Negen) taking more than just supplies as payment for protection.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by Rubber Ducky

I'd have to watch again, but when dude came roaring out at the end on the motorbike, Darryl got pretty upset and demanded 'Where did you get that bike?'

Maybe that was his bike that the lost campers took? Perhaps his crossbow isn't far behind...?

Exactly, it was definitely his bike.

Originally Posted by Radio

Absolutely, they kept talking about how they had given up everything for "protection" and that things weren't what they seemed when they first went into protective custody.

Then after the one guy cut off the other's arm he said something to the effect of "Forget her, he only wants ones that are willing." So obviously he's (Negen) taking more than just supplies as payment for protection.

It really goes to show how ruthless the saviors are

[speede5]

Originally Posted by Rubber Ducky

On that note, I don't ever remember seeing how Rick escaped the broken-down motorhome. He shot all those Wolves creeping down the side of the motorhome, and then as he was trying to start the vehicle with walkers pouring out of the forest, it wouldn't start. Looked like he was about to bawl.

This one bugs me too. They never did show what happened. The next episode started with him returning to Alexandria. I wonder if that kind of continuity error is due to multiple directors and some miscommunication in the cutting room.

There was another a few seasons back, where the episode ended with Daryl and some others driving a car and coming across about 1000 walkers, and then some voices came over the car radio. They never went anywhere with that.

[ken0042]

The voices on the car radio were from the broadcast from Terminus. When they dropped in at Terminus, they caught them in the middle of recording the radio message.

[Locke]

And in regards to the new episode and the transition of the theme of TWD Ernie Pyle said it best:

“The most vivid change was the casual and workshop manner in which they talked about killing. They had made the psychological transition from their normal belief that taking human life was sinful, over to a new professional outlook where killing was a craft. No longer was there anything morally wrong about killing. In fact, it was an admirable thing.”

[FlamesAddiction]

The part of the episode that confused me was when Abraham said he was leaving. It just seemed out of place. Was it a flashback...? Because he didn't leave. And if it was a flashback, why did they show it? It didn't add anything.

I may have been distracted and missed the context though.