[PGT] Flames dominate, but lose 2-1 to the Sharks in OT.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I really like Jokipakka so far, every thing else we get in that trade might just be gravy if he keeps his level of play up.

They have been sheltering him a bit, and hasn't played a ton, but have liked him when he's on the ice.

Some said it last night, and I agree, that I'd be thrilled even if the trade was just Jokipakka for Russell straight up. Nevermind the pick and the kid. Just makes such cslm smart decisions with the puck

[nemanja2306]

Originally Posted by driveway

If the Flames had a team save percentage of .917 we'd be tied for the 10th best save percentage in the league. We'd have the 7th best defence in the league, having allowed only 160 instead of 205 goals and our goal +/- would be +16.

This would be a better +/- than Pittsburgh, St. Louis, Anaheim, Nashville, and Minnesota and we should absolutely expect to be in a playoff position.

Now if we're talking about a goalie with a .917 as opposed to a team's overall it starts to depend on the backup. Jones has played 55 games for the Sharks, leaving 11 games for our backup to play - assume Ramo's .909 as our backup's numbers and you get basically the same outcome. Jones would have faced 1611 shots this year, Ramo 322. Jones' .917 would result in 133 GA, Ramo's .909 would result in 29 GA for a total of 162 GA.

Hoever, if Hiller (god I hate Hiller) was our backup, his .883 SV% turns those 322 shots into 38 GA instead of 29 and our goal +/- would drop to 5 and we'd likely end up a bubble team.

So, the long and short of it is, having a number one goalie posting a .917 who we could ride for most of the season would totally get the Flames up into the playoff picture at the very least. Having even below-average backup goaltending would keep us there. Having the travesty that is Hiller as a backup would flop us out.

Now, of course, the argument about save percentage as a team stat as opposed to a goalie stat is a good one. But the point is fair, a .917 number one goalie who could start 80+ percent of our games would be huge for this team.

Worth mentioning: Ortio's save percentage since 2/23 is .914.

I hope you don't mind,but I copied your post to HF. There's an arrogant Oilers fan on there that he actually thinks we have a bottom 5 (league wide) d-core . And I was too lazy to type it myself.

[codynw]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Hathaway makes me forget Ferland even exists.

That's strange, because I think Ferland had another really good game last night.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by codynw

That's strange, because I think Ferland had another really good game last night.

Ditto.

Been a harsh critic of Ferland this season but he played well last night. Maybe he doesn't have that agitating game some wished, the game Hathaway plays, but he was going hard to the net last night, being messy, creating chances. Thought he played well.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by Split98

Loved the guy coming into the game, hated him during the game, and have mad respect for him now.

Guy goes in, battles with Hathaway (very viciously, mind you) and walks away from the field of battle with a nod. Gotta love a guy like that.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I have a hard time believing Jones' SV% would be much better than Ramo with the way the team defence has performed this season

Ramo was crappy at the beginning of the year (and obviously so were the other two), and it wasn't all about the team D then - there was a reason it was him sent down. Nor was it suddenly better team D that got him better stats in December.

Nope, Jones and Talbot are simply better goalies and IMO their better save % is not about team defence - remember we are talking about the Sharks, who allowed 40+ shots to the Flames (!) and the Oilers, who are obviously not team defence specialists (this guy scored).

[Travis Munroe]

Lets also keep in mind games played... Ferland was Hathaway upon entering the league. Can Hathaway keep it up? Probably not. Very few if any players can.

Ferland has value in the fact he is a solid power forward with great speed and doesn't think twice about going into a corner to retrieve a puck. It is why I like him with Johny and Monahan. Johny doesn't go into corners and Monahan seems to be more of a stand on the perimeter and retrieve the scrum. Having a guy to retrieve those pucks and has the strength to crash the net and win battles is crucial.

The playoff Ferland is a different version and best saved for the playoffs. The guy still hits everything in his path but much of it goes unnoticed because he doesnt try to kill the other player. Such a style throughout the season would have him on the IR in no time.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Realtor 1

Ferland has value in the fact he is a solid power forward with great speed and doesn't think twice about going into a corner to retrieve a puck. It is why I like him with Johny and Monahan. Johny doesn't go into corners and Monahan seems to be more of a stand on the perimeter and retrieve the scrum. Having a guy to retrieve those pucks and has the strength to crash the net and win battles is crucial.

Wrong.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by codynw

That's strange, because I think Ferland had another really good game last night.

Same.

I think some people expect Ferland to be something else for some reason. But even when he's not throwing highlight reel hits I love the little plays he makes. His decisions about when to dump it in, when to carry it in, when to pass, when to drive the net, etc. He makes a lot of smart decisions. He has the hands to play with skilled players but doesn't mind doing the dirty work. Even when he doesn't finish his checks his forecheck forces the opposition into making poor passes. Against PIT he had a shift where he forechecked and forced them to ice the puck, they couldn't get it past him.

Ferland isn't a flashy guy, he isn't a fancy guy. If you aren't watching him closely you won't see the little things he does. But IMO he's playing well and developing. I still think he has top two line power forward upside. He isn't an agitator, and he isn't just a grinder.

Hathaway on the other hand is an agitator and grinder 1st class. Loved his game in the preseason and am still loving it.

Both useful players, both with slightly different roles. Both important for next year IMO.

[DynastyEra]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Wrong.

Johnny battles hard but he rarely wins puck battles along the boards. He is usually bodied off the puck with ease. His strength is retrieving pucks on the back of guys like Ferland, Colborne, even Monahan. The Hathaway/Ferland types are the grind em up type. Completely different type of board play (often more effective) compared to Johnny.
It simply is not asked of Johnny to go digging in the corners for the puck, he often retrieves it and gets the pass off before needing to engage in a puck battle.

[heep223]

Originally Posted by DynastyEra

Johnny battles hard but he rarely wins puck battles along the boards. He is usually bodied off the puck with ease. His strength is retrieving pucks on the back of guys like Ferland, Colborne, even Monahan. The Hathaway/Ferland types are the grind em up type. Completely different type of board play (often more effective) compared to Johnny.
It simply is not asked of Johnny to go digging in the corners for the puck, he often retrieves it and gets the pass off before needing to engage in a puck battle.

I actually disagree with this. Johnny often comes out of scrums with the puck because he's so quick with his stick and reflexes, I've noticed.

[DynastyEra]

Originally Posted by heep223

I actually disagree with this. Johnny often comes out of scrums with the puck because he's so quick with his stick and reflexes, I've noticed.

I'm not saying he doesn't. He just excels at a different style of retrieval, which isn't bodying guys off the puck.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[Plett25]

Playing physical, hitting, doing the dirty work and playing with an edge has to be done by committee. One player can't do it all every game, they'd constantly get injured.

Bouma, Ferland and Hathaway could be the Flames' committee.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Plett25

Playing physical, hitting, doing the dirty work and playing with an edge has to be done by committee. One player can't do it all every game, they'd constantly get injured.

Bouma, Ferland and Hathaway could be the Flames' committee.

Agreed. Up front those guys plus Jooris and Bollig are our committee. Hathaway has kind of out-Jooris'd Jooris and he may be expendable now. On the backend though its only Engelland and Jokipakka.

Still lacking a top 4 d-man with edge unless Jokipakka develops into that. We don't really have one in our system either. Still lacking a top two line forward with an edge unless Ferland develops into that.

We still have a ways to go to get tougher to play against but Hathaway is a nice step in the right direction.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Same.

I think some people expect Ferland to be something else for some reason. But even when he's not throwing highlight reel hits I love the little plays he makes. His decisions about when to dump it in, when to carry it in, when to pass, when to drive the net, etc. He makes a lot of smart decisions. He has the hands to play with skilled players but doesn't mind doing the dirty work. Even when he doesn't finish his checks his forecheck forces the opposition into making poor passes. Against PIT he had a shift where he forechecked and forced them to ice the puck, they couldn't get it past him.

Ferland isn't a flashy guy, he isn't a fancy guy. If you aren't watching him closely you won't see the little things he does. But IMO he's playing well and developing. I still think he has top two line power forward upside. He isn't an agitator, and he isn't just a grinder.

Hathaway on the other hand is an agitator and grinder 1st class. Loved his game in the preseason and am still loving it.

Both useful players, both with slightly different roles. Both important for next year IMO.

Ferland's has been invisible in 80% of the games the Flames have played this year. He's basically been Josh Jooris - which is fine but also completely replaceable.. He's 23 years old - not all that young in terms of developing. He needs to bring it much more often than he has this year or else his career highlight is going to be that one playoff series.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

Ferland's has been invisible in 80% of the games the Flames have played this year. He's basically been Josh Jooris - which is fine but also completely replaceable.. He's 23 years old - not all that young in terms of developing. He needs to bring it much more often than he has this year or else his career highlight is going to be that one playoff series.

I don't agree with that assessment at all. I like his game more often than not. He hasn't been invisible in 80% of the games I've watched so I guess we're watching different guys.

[Plett25]

Compared to the Ferland we saw vs the Canucks in the playoffs last year, maybe he's been invisible. But he couldn't keep that up for a while season

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

I hope Bob reassured Hathaway that his misconduct penalty was a BS call. Just like he publicly said he saw nothing wrong with McGrattan's salute to the crowd upon his return to the dome.

Being a young callup like that, Hathaway might be worried that he upset his coach or GM by getting the misconduct, and start over thinking things and perhaps play with less edge. Hopefully they heap praise on him for his good game last night.

After Hathaway came out of the box Hartley made his way down the bench to give him a pat on the back and say something.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

I don't agree with that assessment at all. I like his game more often than not. He hasn't been invisible in 80% of the games I've watched so I guess we're watching different guys.

Its fine to like his game but right now he's putting up the offensive numbers of a 4th line player which is better than nothing but right now he's looking more like a Jordin Tootoo than a Milan Lucic.

[nik-]

Only saw a bit of the first and all of the third, but that was the best I recall the team playing in a while. Shame to lose, but it's not a loss that bothers me, sometimes goalies turn on god mode.

Hopefully Hathaway can maintain that hunger.