1st Line Right Winger

[Teroy]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

Let's trade for Iggy!

Spoiler!

No thank you. Rather have Jagr.,,,,,,,,,,,,

[sureLoss]

This is why offer sheets that have high chance of being matched are pointless.

On July 1st, 2008 the Vancouver Canucks signed David Backes to a 3 year 7.5 million offer sheet. Blues matched.

7 days later the Blues retaliated by signing Steve Bernier to a 1 year 2.5 million offer sheet. Canucks matched.

Net result. Both teams ended up getting their own players at a higher price when they could have signed them for a lower price without outside interference.

Futility.

Offer sheets are only effective if budget or cap reasons will prevent a team from matching.

[Sylvanfan]

Yeah if you want to sign a 3.6 million dollar offer sheet and get the player...it needs to be a guy like Joe Cobourne that you sign. Not worth it.

[stemit14]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

Let's trade for Iggy!

Spoiler!

Yes!! 25+ goals per year. Still gritty. Still a great shot. Still helps the powerplay. Right handed shot. Yes please.


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[Conroy4Mayor]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

My point is if Monahan got a 4 year $28M offer sheet he likely signs it and the Flsmes almost certainly match. He gets paid top $ and gets to be a UFA at 25 which gives him the best chance to cash in.
Flamea sign Strome to a $3.6M citizen tract that gets matched and pisses Snow off. So perhaps he doesn't sign Monahan to an offer sheet but lines one up for Sam Bennett next year.

Like I said a GM does an offer sheet if they think they can actually get the player they sign or it is a desperate move by a bad GM (Feaster). Offer sheets would be used if they worked but they never do. Basically if a team knows they can't sign a player they will do what Boston did and trade Hamilton for picks instead of getting handcuffed by an opposing team.

I also don't mind the right players getting paid on their second contract but offer sheets can get the wrong players paid way too much and further push the guys like Glencross out of the league.

I think if you presented it correctly as part of the legitimate rules of the NHL, it wouldn't be that offensive. For example...

"Hey Garth, we really like Strome. We badly need a guy on RW, and we think he'd be a good fit with Johnny. Seeing as he's a free agent, we're thinking of doing an offer sheet. Would you be open to a trade instead?"

"Brad, I'd rather you didn't do that."

"Look Garth, I know it ratchets up the pressure on you guys, but our fans want to see us going after some better players and putting a competitive team on the ice. We only have two forwards that shoot right. We need a player like Ryan. If you like him as much as we do, by all means feel free to match."

He either steps up and signs the guy himself, negotiates a trade, or waits to see what the offer is (or compensation will be).

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by stemit14

Yes!! 25+ goals per year. Still gritty. Still a great shot. Still helps the powerplay. Right handed shot. Yes please.


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Not to be a buzzkill, but Jarome barely hit 25 last year, and barring a sudden hot streak it doesn't look like he'll hit that mark again in his career, seeing as how he turns 39 on July 1st. At $2.5 - 3 million, I'd say maybe, but his salary is what, $5.5 million a year? No thanks.

[Ashasx]

If only he was making David Jones money.

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

If only he was making David Jones money.

Maybe David Jones in 2016-17 money.

[stemit14]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Not to be a buzzkill, but Jarome barely hit 25 last year, and barring a sudden hot streak it doesn't look like he'll hit that mark again in his career, seeing as how he turns 39 on July 1st. At $2.5 - 3 million, I'd say maybe, but his salary is what, $5.5 million a year? No thanks.

Barely? He scored 29 goals last year and had 59 points. He's a fitness freak who still produces even at this age. He will likely finish this season with at least 25 goals. If the flames could somehow trade wideman+ for iggy it would be a great trade for both teams... And a wash in terms of salary.


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[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by stemit14

Barely? He scored 29 goals last year and had 59 points. He's a fitness freak who still produces even at this age. He will likely finish this season with at least 25 goals. If the flames could somehow trade wideman+ for iggy it would be a great trade for both teams... And a wash in terms of salary.


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29 goals is 4 more than 25. Four goals is not a lot.

However, he will not finish this year with 25 goals. He has 19 in 67 games. Sure, he has strong finishes, but that's a 23 goal pace. I doubt he gets more than that. I'd trade Wideman for Iginla + a 4th rounder. Anything more, no deal.

[Machiavelli]

29 goals is "almost 30," not "barely 25"

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by driveway

There aren't many UFA's who fit that description: if you're talking about a 20-goal scorer right-now that's pretty much Doan and Jagr.

If you stretch it to include guys who have ever scored 20 goals: Vrbata, Purcell, Jones, Brouwer, Grabner, Parentau, Stempniak, and Boyes get added to the list. Out of that list, to me Brouwer and Parentau are the only two who look at all interesting. Though Purcell does have really good fancy-stats. However I don't think any of those three are the answer for that 1st-line right wing, which I see being either solved by a draft pick this year, or being something of a revolving door until someone is developed from within.

The irony of the Calgary Flames being on the hunt for a 1st line right winger...

Ugh, this reminds me of the days when the Flames were full of ex-20 goal scorers

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by edslunch

Ugh, this reminds me of the days when the Flames were full of ex-20 goal scorers

Remember 2009?

We had:

Iginla
Cammalleri
Jokinen
Bertuzzi
Phaneuf
Conroy
Lombardi
Langkow
Aucoin

all of whom were former 20-goal scorers.

Moss (!)

scored 20 that year, and

Glencross
Bourque

went on to become future 20-goal scorers, with

Giordano
Backlund

potentially joining them in the future.

[stemit14]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

29 goals is 4 more than 25. Four goals is not a lot.



However, he will not finish this year with 25 goals. He has 19 in 67 games. Sure, he has strong finishes, but that's a 23 goal pace. I doubt he gets more than that. I'd trade Wideman for Iginla + a 4th rounder. Anything more, no deal.

It's semantics... But scoring 4 goals more than 25 is still closer to being a 30 goal scorer than a 25 goal scorer. Either way... How many scoring wingers in the NHL actually produce the way they're supposed to when signed to a contract?? I would argue iginla is one of the very few that consistently lives up to his contract in terms of scoring production. I think it's more than likely he finds a way to score at least 6 goals in the remaining 13 games.


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[T@T]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

This is why offer sheets that have high chance of being matched are pointless.

On July 1st, 2008 the Vancouver Canucks signed David Backes to a 3 year 7.5 million offer sheet. Blues matched.

7 days later the Blues retaliated by signing Steve Bernier to a 1 year 2.5 million offer sheet. Canucks matched.

Net result. Both teams ended up getting their own players at a higher price when they could have signed them for a lower price without outside interference.

Futility.

Offer sheets are only effective if budget or cap reasons will prevent a team from matching.

Yipe, offer sheets are stupid and need to be changed.

I would make the matching team pay 10% more on the contract offered to match.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Conroy4Mayor

I think if you presented it correctly as part of the legitimate rules of the NHL, it wouldn't be that offensive. For example...

"Hey Garth, we really like Strome. We badly need a guy on RW, and we think he'd be a good fit with Johnny. Seeing as he's a free agent, we're thinking of doing an offer sheet. Would you be open to a trade instead?"

"Brad, I'd rather you didn't do that."

"Look Garth, I know it ratchets up the pressure on you guys, but our fans want to see us going after some better players and putting a competitive team on the ice. We only have two forwards that shoot right. We need a player like Ryan. If you like him as much as we do, by all means feel free to match."

He either steps up and signs the guy himself, negotiates a trade, or waits to see what the offer is (or compensation will be).

Isn't that pretty much what happened between Edmonton and Boston, so Boston traded Hamilton to rival Calgary. If you want Strome going to Edmonton, follow that plan.

[driveway]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

29 goals is 4 more than 25. Four goals is not a lot.

Four goals is more than you think. Four goals is the same number of goals the following players have scored this year: Brodie, Leddy, Phaneuf, Goligosky, M. Green, Pietrangelo, Russell, Glendening, Winnik, Stajan, Del Zotto, Ferland, L. Schenn, and Jooris.

Four goals is the difference between Gaudreau and Eberle, or between Kopitar and Sam Bennett. It's the difference between Joe Thornton, Milan Lucic, and Markus Johansson and Jussi Jokinen, Jason Pominville, and Joe Colborne. Four goals is more than 398 players who've laced up skates have scored all season.

Four goals is the difference between the Flames' offense and the Lightning's; or the difference between the Leafs' defense and the Canucks'. Four goals is 2.3% of our total offense this season. Four goals over 65 games should add at least one win (based on Pythagorean projections).

I'd happily add 4 goals to any Flames total this year and call it 'a lot.'

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Not to be a buzzkill, but Jarome barely hit 25 last year, and barring a sudden hot streak it doesn't look like he'll hit that mark again in his career, seeing as how he turns 39 on July 1st. At $2.5 - 3 million, I'd say maybe, but his salary is what, $5.5 million a year? No thanks.

You mean the same Jarome that was barely 16th in the league in goals scored both in 2013-14, and 2014-15? That does seem a little low he must be really slowing down. Now on a more serious note, he does have a couple less goals this season; however, what bothers me more is his +/- of minus 20 this season.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Another thread derailed by the bring-back-Iginla crowd. He's gone. He's moved on. Why can't you guys?

[Poe969]

Well if we can't bring back Iggy, can we bring back David Jones?


I don't think this team needs an older player on his way out on our top line, if anything they need someone either in their prime or just entering their prime so they can develop chemistry with the young guys we have.