[Trade] Hudler traded to Florida for 2016 2nd + 2018 4th round picks

[codynw]

Originally Posted by sharkov

considering sharks got Nick Spaling for a 2nd rounder, its hard to believe the current Lady Byng trophy winner was traded for little more than a player who had only 1 goal

One GM making a dumb trade doesn't mean they all will.

[dieHARDflameZ]

I just don't understand why there's a handful of people upset about this trade. Hudler becomes a UFA on July 1st and he's reportedly looking for $7,000,000 per season.

The Flames would be stupid to sign Hudler to anywhere close to that kind of money. In their current position, on the outside looking in by a large margin, they're better off dealing him away for something than get nothing for him.

I get the fact a lot of people wanted a first rounder but maybe it's just not there this year. Hudler is after all a 32 year old rental. But let's be honest, up until the past ten or fifteen games, he has been a ghost this season.

[SebC]

As expected, Frolik pushed Hudler out.

[FBI]

Yup I wonder if hudler bombs in Florida if he will sign on the super cheap.
Either way I'm cheering for losses the rest of the way for Florida.

[dieHARDflameZ]

Originally Posted by sharkov

considering sharks got Nick Spaling for a 2nd rounder, its hard to believe the current Lady Byng trophy winner was traded for little more than a player who had only 1 goal

Maybe teams going to the playoffs don't value the "nice guy award" as highly as some people think.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by sharkov

considering sharks got Nick Spaling for a 2nd rounder, its hard to believe the current Lady Byng trophy winner was traded for little more than a player who had only 1 goal

Spaling was a throw in, he's worth maybe a 4th.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Sure.

But if we had this conversation prior to the trades and asked: where does Hudler fit on a scale of 1 to 10, where 1 is Schultz and 10 is Ladd, I think most people would say 8 or 9, not 5.

That's my point. Hudler's return shouldn't be halfway between Ladd and Schultz, it should be about 80% towards Ladd.

Well if Schultz is 1, Hudler is 8 and Ladd is 10, then it's not Hudler's trade value that we were wrong about, it was Schultz's. Looks like Schultz was a 5, Hudler was an 8, and Ladd 10.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by SebC

As expected, Frolik pushed Hudler out.

Rightfully so, I'd rather have Frolik for the next 4 years or w/e it is than Hudler for that same term and money.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Sure.

But if we had this conversation prior to the trades and asked: where does Hudler fit on a scale of 1 to 10, where 1 is Schultz and 10 is Ladd, I think most people would say 8 or 9, not 5.

That's my point. Hudler's return shouldn't be halfway between Ladd and Schultz, it should be about 80% towards Ladd.

But clearly that is not the case, as all we were hearing up to this point was that the Flames were asking a 2nd (mirtle) and that the Flames were likely to get a 3rd (Francis, Shannon).

There is a lot of scouting history on Hudler and he's had a very down year. He is not difficult to play against and if you are already a smallish team he is going to make your play style even smaller.

There is always an 'Oiler factor' with guys coming from crap environments that haven't played anywhere else. The same will likely happen with Yakupov if he is dealt. Like the reverse of Olli Jokinen, you really don't know what you have in a cesspool like that. If you're a team that thinks you can transform Schultz into something and the cost is only a 3rd rounder, that can be an easy sacrifice to the right team.

Unless we think all of a sudden Brad Treliving, the wizard who turned a Glencross into a 2nd and a 3rd was suddenly unable to get even bare minimum return a year later.

That was the market for Hudler and I'm glad the Flames got something/ anything, for him because in the end he isn't part of the solution in Calgary.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

But clearly that is not the case, as all we were hearing up to this point was that the Flames were asking a 2nd (mirtle) and that the Flames were likely to get a 3rd (Francis, Shannon).

There is a lot of scouting history on Hudler and he's had a very down year. He is not difficult to play against and if you are already a smallish team he is going to make your play style even smaller.

There is always an 'Oiler factor' with guys coming from crap environments that haven't played anywhere else. The same will likely happen with Yakupov if he is dealt. Like the reverse of Olli Jokinen, you really don't know what you have in a cesspool like that. If you're a team that thinks you can transform Schultz into something and the cost is only a 3rd rounder, that can be an easy sacrifice to the right team.

Unless we think all of a sudden Brad Treliving, the wizard who turned a Glencross into a 2nd and a 3rd was suddenly unable to get even bare minimum return a year later.

That was the market for Hudler and I'm glad the Flames got something/ anything, for him because in the end he isn't part of the solution in Calgary.

You just quoted Francis and Shannon to try and make a point.

You should spend the rest of the evening in your skivvies in the basement

[GioforPM]

Francis and Shannon must have heard "3rd" from someone so it's not irrelevant. On the other hand maybe their source was Treliving and he was just lowering expectations, ��

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

You just quoted Francis and Shannon to try and make a point.

You should spend the rest of the evening in your skivvies in the basement

I've been there all day and it's been amazing.

Anyway, the point is, maybe the fact that the Flames dealt Hudler for a 2nd and a 4th indicates that his perceived value from the perspective of fans may be different than his perceived value around the league.

This would coincide with his signing in free agency when Calgary was offering the best deal at 4 x 4 and many posters felt it was an overpayment after Detroit let him walk.

I think this is an indication that his value just isn't what Flames fans thought and that a Lady Byng trophy might not matter much in trade value discussion.

[PeteMoss]

Re: Leafs/Sharks trade - The leafs took on Torres to give the Sharks cap room, that has value.

Re: Schultz - The Pens GM has made tons of terrible moves. The fact that he sent a 3rd for Schultz makes no difference to what Hudler received. If Schultz had went for a 7th rounder does Hudler's return suddenly seem better?

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

Re: Leafs/Sharks trade - The leafs took on Torres to give the Sharks cap room, that has value.

Re: Schultz - The Pens GM has made tons of terrible moves. The fact that he sent a 3rd for Schultz makes no difference to what Hudler received. If Schultz had went for a 7th rounder does Hudler's return suddenly seem better?

the way you evaluate prices is by comparing them to other prices

when you don't want to compare to other trades, it's usually a bad sign with respect to how you feel about your own trade

[Roof-Daddy]

Was hoping for more, but I guess this is about all Hudler could return. Is what it is. I'm pretty sure Treliving didn't leave any stones un-turned.


Anyways, hopefully stockpiling 2016 draft picks to snag another young right handed D-man that starts with H-A-M at the draft again. Might as well go back to back on that.

[Flame$4Ever]

We got ripped off...####ty trade

[codynw]

Originally Posted by Flame$4Ever

We got ripped off...####ty trade

Based on?

Up until about the all star break, Hudler was playing like complete garbage and most would have been happy to get anything at all for him.

Other than the fact that the 4th is in 2018 (which is annoying, but not a huge deal) this is about exactly what I was expecting.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Flame$4Ever

We got ripped off...####ty trade

I bet Treliving took the first offer.

[codynw]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

I bet Treliving took the first offer.

I bet he asked for less than the first offer.

"We'll give you Crouse and a 1st"

"I only want a 2nd and a 4th"

"Done!"

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

the way you evaluate prices is by comparing them to other prices

when you don't want to compare to other trades, it's usually a bad sign with respect to how you feel about your own trade

I have no idea how a trade of a defenseman with years of control left compares to a rental. Its like saying you got ripped off on buying car because someone else got a good deal on an apple.