2015-2016 Blue Jays Off-Season Thread - Page 55 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Jason14h · 02-23-2016, 02:18 PM

Quote:

He picked a number he knew the Jays can't pay. Planning his exit.

I get the feeling he dislikes Rogers and the whole AA thing was easily the nail in the coffin for Jose to leave. Well plus the Yankees will outbid the Jays next season anyways!

dino7c · 02-23-2016, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by East Coast Flame

I love Bautista, and have no problem with his negotiating stance. The Jays got one hell of a deal for the last 5 years and this is the guys last chance to really cash in. All the power to him. We were lucky to have him.

They also took all the risk...had he not played well would he have given some back? Anyway he is going to be a terrible contract moving forward and they should move him...pretty sure the franchise will survive without him

868904 · 02-23-2016, 03:41 PM

Maybe this is also Bautista's way of telling Rogers, that he's not coming back next year, so they better go all-in this year and win a championship?

I'd be okay with them moving on from Bautista next year. Love his clutch hitting, but his constant arguing of calls is tiresome and I think hurts the team on border line calls when it matters.

zyzz · 02-23-2016, 03:46 PM

Bautista was clutch as it gets down the stretch and in playoffs. He's got a pretty piss poor attitude tho, that interview regarding his contract was pretty weak. Mr cool guy acting all tough. It was a miracle season anyway, trade him while you can. 30 million a year going into his 40's?!?! HA!!

Dan02 · 02-23-2016, 04:15 PM

Another thing to keep in mind here is as mentioned on TSN analysis, both EE and Jose essentially have no trade clauses by virtue of the 10x5 rule. They have to consent to any trade.

Fire · 02-23-2016, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayP

It's more than a stretch. The Jays were 6 games ahead of the Yankees for the division and 7 games ahead of the Astros for the second wild card. And that includes resting players in the final week of the season.

David Price isn't worth that many wins on his own over the course of an entire season - let alone a two month period after the trade deadline.

The acquisition of Price gave the entire team a bunch of confidence and without that I doubt they make the playoffs. I think it's very fair to say the Jays don't make the playoffs without Price.

browna · 02-23-2016, 07:07 PM

Saw somewhere last night (Stoeten's new site, I think) that if Bautista got paid proper value for his last contract, that would've been equivalent to $165m over the 5 years.
So asking for $130-$150 with the baseball inflation factor isn't out of the realm.

And yeah, I think all the players hate Rogers. Look no further when players were willing to defer salary at the beginning of 2014 to address that starting pitching, and the team took too long and the player was gone. To make up for it, Rogers told the team that there'd be money at the trade deadline if the team was in it....the team made a run in June and July and was knocking on the door, and Rogers didn't step up. At all. Going against the promise. The team lost the next 8 of 10 after the trade deadline.

AA played his full hand last trade deadline, knowing he was burning his bridge for the frugal owners by making the push. With him out, and some new, corporate speaking like execs, hired by the frugal owners, players know what's up and where this is headed. Rogers knows they can live off of last season fully for this season, with a second chance next season if things don't work out, before fans start to get mad. At that point, then throw in a change at manager with Gibby out the door (he doesn't last past a few months next season if the Jays don't make the playoffs this year), and then the message will be "give him a year or two".

Any hint of loyalty JB has went away with AA, and he full well knows that EE is also on his way out too.

So, the Jays window is closing tight. IMO, the only hope is that the pitching gets them to around the same point it did last trade deadline, keeping within 5-7 games of a playoff spot. Rogers will green light money for pitching, to try and recreate last year (if only for marketing purposes), which is in no way going to have the same instant effect, but, by hope and luck, some of the same magic rubs off, and the Jays hopefully snag a wild card spot.

bluejays · 02-23-2016, 07:37 PM

If he is actually asking for $30M for the duration, I agree with everyone else - let him walk. Donaldson's younger and that money will be needed down the line. I don't like Rogers as a company, but Jose isn't worth that in the long term. If anything I'd give him a 3 year contract like $30M, $22M, $20M, but even then it may be a manageable overpayment.

savemedrzaius · 02-23-2016, 07:52 PM

Who first reported this 150 million contract? I don't know why management needs to be so combative with its players. Look at how they dealt with the Travis incident when they made him pay for the suit.

dino7c · 02-23-2016, 10:33 PM

lots of speculation he is asking for amounts no team would give him

TheAlpineOracle · 02-23-2016, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayP

It's more than a stretch. The Jays were 6 games ahead of the Yankees for the division and 7 games ahead of the Astros for the second wild card. And that includes resting players in the final week of the season.

David Price isn't worth that many wins on his own over the course of an entire season - let alone a two month period after the trade deadline.

You live in a fantasy world if you believe that. There's no stretch at all. Price went 9-1 with the Jays with 3 wins over the Yankees (went 7 innings in one game but didn't get the win), 1 win over Texas, 1 win over the LA Angels, 1 win over Minnesota, and a win over Tampa who is a notorious Blue Jay killer.

Go look at that those teams in the standings and tell me again how the Jays would have won the division or made the playoffs without those wins, and as someone else has already pointed out, that isn't even considering the adrenaline boost and complete mindset change the Price acquisition gave to the team. Without Price the Jays do not track the Yankees down and likely don't even get a Wildcard. The Jays weren't even in a wildcard position when Price was acquired and catching the Yankees was a pipe dream.

Mathgod · 02-23-2016, 11:20 PM

Jays have got the best years out of B&E. Trade 'em.

Cortez · 02-24-2016, 10:10 AM

We can all calm down- he's not asking for 150 mil over 5 years.

He's asking for more.

http://www.thescore.com/mlb/news/966740

Parallex · 02-24-2016, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

You live in a fantasy world if you believe that. There's no stretch at all.

No, he's right.

David Price's Wins above replacement with the Jays was 2.7 which is fantastic but the Jays almost certainly would have made the playoffs without him.

If you want it on a more micro-level...

Price Starts (Run Support) with Toronto: 5, 6, 3(L), 9, 12, 2(L), 5, 11, 9, 4, 10. The L denotes a loss. That is a hell of a lot of run support. Let's assume that instead of Price we had... say... Drew Hutchison making those starts. Hutch had an ERA of 5.57 last year so let's assume in those starts that's how many runs they'd give up (which is a pessimistic view) the Jays would have lost 3 more games then they actually did. The Jays won the division by 6.

David Price is an excellent pitcher but he wasn't the messiah of the Jays 2015 Season.

InBurkeWeTrust · 02-24-2016, 12:45 PM

Over 150 mill+ hah..

mrkajz44 · 02-24-2016, 05:07 PM

I heard it was more than $150M but less than $30M per year, so is he seriously looking for more than 5 years?

I doubt the Jays keep both Bautista and EE. Considering EE is already DHing and can handle 1B, he's the better option for two guys that are getting late in their careers.

Hockey Fan #751 · 02-24-2016, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrkajz44

I heard it was more than $150M but less than $30M per year, so is he seriously looking for more than 5 years?

I doubt the Jays keep both Bautista and EE. Considering EE is already DHing and can handle 1B, he's the better option for two guys that are getting late in their careers.

I heard 5 years, $110 million. I wouldn't do it.

Caged Great · 02-24-2016, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hockey Fan #751

I heard 5 years, $110 million. I wouldn't do it.

I would. That's not that bad of a contract. 22 million per. He only would need to contribute 15 WAR over the 5 years to make it work. Last year he contributed 5.1 and that's with a -1.1 defensive WAR rating.

Even if he slows down, he should hit that mark and the 22 million isn't a huge problem. If he moves to 1B, you can remove Smoak's 4 million and he'll be replaced by a league min guy in either Pompey or Alford.

Not a huge deal at that cost.

Parallex · 02-24-2016, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hockey Fan #751

I heard 5 years, $110 million. I wouldn't do it.

If that's it then pay the man. Good deal.

Jason14h · 02-24-2016, 09:35 PM

Quote:

I heard 5 years, $110 million. I wouldn't do it.

I just want to know where you heard it! Since it hasn't been reported anywhere!

I'm guessing its 6 years 155-160? If we are to believe that he asked for more then 150 but not 30 a year.

The problem (I guess problem?) is that he could actually be worth 150 million on a cost per WAR basis, even factoring in his age. He could post a .380 OPB in his sleep.