Seems typical of a lot of stars from the QMJHL (Not all) Hard time moving up... Look at Anthony Mantha in Detroit... same deal... ??? Still have high hopes for him...
While I'm not any where near calling him a bust, my optimism that he was a bonafide top 6 player on a contender is a gone. He's come back to earth after an amazing first season. Could be the surgery as well.
I guess we'll see where he stands next year before "bust" talk comes in to the fold. Hopefully he gets some playing time with the Flames now that this season is a write off.
I don't watch AHL games other than highlights so my opinion is not that informed. But his 2nd year production is disappointing and he looked invisible in his NHL call-up last year. He seemed to score a lot of breakaway goals in junior where he was able to outskate the defenseman. That won't happen in the bigs so hopefully he is able to find ways to score.
Way too early to call him a bust and hopefully he is learning a complete game. But I am slightly concerned at the lack of production.
Seems typical of a lot of stars from the QMJHL (Not all) Hard time moving up... Look at Anthony Mantha in Detroit... same deal... ??? Still have high hopes for him...
In general, not a lot of players from Quebec make the NHL these days.
ex. There are 9 defencemen from Saskatchewan, and 10 from Quebec. Quebec has 8 times as many people.
But Porier has enough heart and skill that is seems unlikely for him to completely miss the NHL
Was encouraged by his AHL production last year but did nothing to impress during his call ups.
This season, he has been very disappointing.
In the games that he has played at the NHL level, he just isn't involved enough. He needs to play an Alex Burrows in-your-face type of game, minus the ######baggery.
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I wonder how much of the Porier is a bust, or disappointment in his progress to date that we see in here is simply due to false expectations of this fan base and our young players.
We see it all the time in threads when we are discussing the NHL roster or future moves this club should make. Tones of folks complaining about roster spots "being taken by vets" like Jones, Bollig, etc... and tones of comments about how easy these guys would be to replace with assets we already have on the farm (followed by complaining about the coach or management not showing faith in young players and how we will put off prospects from wanting to play in the org. cause we don't treat them right etc...).
Porier is certainly one of those guys who falls into (or at least used to) the category of player that people wanted to pencil into the roster as made it, or one of the guys many felt could do what a vet like Bollig or Jones does no problem, even be an upgrade. But when rubber hits the road, it becomes evident that he's not ready yet.
Which is then followed up with all this "bust" talk about a 21 year old that simply isn't fair. Porier was never a prospect any of us should have expected to have an "easy" road to the NHL like Johnny or Monahan or Bennett. On draft day, I don't think anyone did expect this guy to make an instant impact, or at least people shouldn't have. He's always been someone we should have expected to have to slug it out in the AHL for a bit before he became ready. Fair to say maybe this year hasn't progressed (at least obviously) as much as we'd wanted, but I think our feelings on him not meeting expectations have less to do with his actual progress, and more to do with the unrealistic expectations many put on how quickly the majority of our prospects should advance, and also the ridiculous hate on people develop for veteran players in this org.
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Hard to say when most of us have never watched him play a single game in either juniors or at the pro level.
I'm pretty sure this isn't accurate. I'd guess that 90% plus at least watched the 6 games he had in the NHL. Certainly not a large sample size, but more than nothing.
I am going go out on a limb here and say that he shows lots of promise but there is a lot of uphill battle to go.
This does need to question the Calgary Flames player development model. I have ZERO evidence of this but it does seem that the Flames have problems graduating players from the minors to the NHL on a regular basis. Our current crop of young stars like Monahan, Bennett and Johnny G haven't touched the minors at all. Other players though haven't seen the type of growth that maybe they should have?
I understand that not ever player will be an NHL regular, but we do seem to have plenty of first round "busts" and plenty more in later rounds. Part of the problem might be drafting but I have long held the belief that if a player is projected to be in the 1st or 2nd round by MANY scouts, then the organization needs to take some of the heat for not developing that player into an NHL regular. Just because a player is selected by a team at 15 instead of say 25, doesn't mean that player needs to accept all responsibility for their development. Players can always do more but teams need to as well.
- Potential to be a secondary playmaker i.e. Tanguay / Monahan with the right teammates. The higher his teammate quality the more he feeds off of that.
- He's visibly progressed his game this year, the stats aren't an issue.
- Still a WIP physically and defensively. I'd like to see him at ~208lbs as an NHLer, I think he's still listed around 200lbs.
- Not the best shot in the world, so he'll probably top out as a 15-20 goal guy in the NHL but I think he will be able to be a second line forward.
- Good puck skills especially on the rush.
- Not at all concerned about him busting, but I was never as high as others on here as far as him being a Hudler replacement. Sven might have been a Hudler replacement, not Emile.
Quote:
Originally Posted by curves2000
Our current crop of young stars like Monahan, Bennett and Johnny G haven't touched the minors at all. Other players though haven't seen the type of growth that maybe they should have?
When I think of our 1st/2nd rounders... I usually start at 2007 because Darryl pretty much outright said it was a mess before then. And then when I think of guys who couldn't figure the skating part out, I'm a lot more optimistic as the new move to the Pacific Division has a power skating coach with dedicated skating days.
- Backlund worked out
- Nemisz/Wahl had concussion issues. Maybe they were bad picks but we can never say that definitively due to injuries.
- Erixon never played for our farm.
- no 1st or 2nd in 2010
- Baertschi is an everyday NHLer now. Look where he is now compared to three years ago, he's a much better player. He was never going to win a selke but he definitely developed. Hartley just had it in for him.
- Granlund isn't quite an everyday NHLer but he's shown enough at the NHL level that we should be happy with his development/selection. Some guys just max out.
- Sieloff isn't ready to be written off just yet. His actual game experience since his draft has been hit hard by injuries.
- Jankowski, Klimchuk, Poirier, Smith still have two years of waiver-exemption after this year. That's a long time. Smith is also a bit of a long shot anyways which is fine for where he was chosen.
- 2014/2015 drafts aren't even in the A yet.
Basically the only top 60 pick I'm unsatisfied with is Wotherspoon (cue Wotherspoon getting called up and having his best NHL showing of his career).
Top 60 picks aside, I would say Brodie, Bouma, Kulak, Jooris, Ferland, Byron have all had growth in the minors through our system. I'm gonna bet on Culkin also being that kind of riser. And of course there's Kylington, who's taken huge strides even since September.
Last edited by GranteedEV; 02-18-2016 at 04:26 PM.
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I would say there is little evidence the Flames have a successful player development model. There are very few younger players on the roster that have come though the "system" (Brodie, Ferland, Bouma, Jooris come to mind). But interestingly, none of those had 2 full seasons in the AHL which is basically where Poirier is now.
Not to say the organization hasn't turned the corner but the evidence is lacking right now at the NHL level.
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He ha got back to .5ppg after an awful slump to start the season. I hope he gets and extended look if Trelivng is able to dump Hudler, Jones, Colborne, Jooris or other pending UFA/RFA's at the deadline
I actually really like this post, but cannot agree with this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by GranteedEV
...
- Baertschi is an everyday NHLer now. Look where he is now compared to three years ago, he's a much better player. He was never going to win a selke but he definitely developed. Hartley just had it in for him.
No. Baertschi plays an entirely different kind of game today than he did last year with the Flames. Hell, his game is different from how he played in his first month or two of the season.
The reason Baertschi struggled in Calgary, the reason why Hartley only gave him limited minutes, the reason Desjardins would only play he sporadically to start the season is because he was a perimeter player who did nothing exceptionally well. For whatever reason, Baertschi has changed his game. He is MUCH more confident skating down the wing than he ever was in his time with the Flames, and he has now started to go to the net, and to fight his way into the slot for scoring chances—also something that he didn't do in Calgary.
I believe the reason why he struggled with the Flames was mostly due to injuries he suffered in his second and third year, which really looked to sap his confidence. He has gotten over it with time, and now slightly resembles the player that scored in three of his first four NHL games.
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Originally Posted by woob
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I would say there is little evidence the Flames have a successful player development model. There are very few younger players on the roster that have come though the "system" (Brodie, Ferland, Bouma, Jooris come to mind). But interestingly, none of those had 2 full seasons in the AHL which is basically where Poirier is now...
That is fairly interesting. But I am curious about your claim regarding "very few younger players on the roster." Including Backlund, that's five NHL players on a 23-man roster. If you add Granlund—who I would put in the same bracket as Jooris and Ferland—that's 26% of the roster. Is that actually comparatively low from a league-wide perspective? How many "system graduates" does each NHL team boast? What is the average, and how do the Flames compare?
This is just an instinctive response, but it doesn't seem to me that 6/23 is all that out of the ordinary—and is certainly not to be characterised as "very few." I would guess that it is actually about average, or perhaps a little below average.
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Originally Posted by woob
"...harem warfare? like all your wives dressup and go paintballing?"
