[News] Bettman upholds 20 game Wideman suspension. NHLPA files appeal to neutral arbitrator

[Cycling76er]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

You are missing him trying to avoid Henderson at the last minute, an indication he didn't see him until then and that therefore it was an accident. That's how I saw it even before his story.

I was in agreement here that it looked "somewhat" deliberate until I paid attention to his feet. He pushes away from the boards at the last second in an attempt to get out of the way (where before I never noticed any intent to avoid). Never really noticed before but to me it looked horrible until I caught onto that detail. What really makes it odd for me is that his head doesn't even flinch. He doesn't look down or back at what he just streamrolled. He just sort of auto-pilots onto the bench.

I think 15 to 20 is probably correct though I'm thankful I'm not the person that has to make that determination.

[schmaaadm]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

Interesting because it would appear the opposite happened to Wideman. He recalled the event in discussion with media shortly after the incident, but it was days after he was talking to the expert and his memory seemed to fade.

I guess after all this time I knd of forgot the timeline with his stories. I was more getting at the fact concussions can screw with your memory of the incident.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

My buddy said it the other day and he's not a flames fan, that if the Flames expect to get a favorable call for the rest of the season they're kidding themselves.

Originally Posted by starseed

Through 55 games, the Flames are the 4th least penalized team with an average of ~7.7 PIMs a game. However, they have had an average of ~11.1 PIMS a game since Wideman was suspended for a 45% increase in penalty minutes. That would move them from 4th, to 23rd least penalized team.

If this trend holds, it should be the biggest scandal in this whole saga.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by photon

Where does he say this?

Can't link right now but I posted the quote in post 137. It's what his expert testified Wideman told him.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by N-E-B

That decision should not have taken this long. That's a joke. I couldn't agree more with Burke on this one.

Oddly, the CBA dictates that an appeal to the arbitrator be handled on an "expedited basis", but I don't recall any language that dictated the speed of a decision from Bettman. I'd think the union will want to clarify this process on the next CBA.

[Strange Brew]

Sorry to rehash this issue but I really don't understand the argument that because he turns his skates at the last second, he was trying to avoid the collision. That totally ignores the obvious fact that he reached out and crosschecked the guy square in the back. To me there are two possible explanations for him turning his skates:

1) He was initially going to get out of the way but then decided to pulverize the linesman.

2) By turning somewhat to the side, he actually got a better angle to cross check the guy so he would not have to skate right over his limp body afterwards.

In any case, it was no accident. He might have lacked "impulse control" but whatever. Lack of impulse control probably accounts for a healthy percentage of all violent crimes.

Time for Flames to move on from this train wreck.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by mrkajz44

Just read that report from Bettman. It is basically a position paper about why 20 games is correct. Doesn't show the other side of the story really. The concussion stuff is mentioned, but only in the capacity that he didn't agree with it. He barely touches on how Wideman appeared to be startled right before contact, and basically said that Wideman deliberately brought his arms up in advance to make sure he could cross check the official.

Not surprised, but disappointed to see such a one sided story being told.

This.

As someone who regularly reads Court decisions (particularly Supreme Court tax decisions) this one doesn't even meet the smell test - it's positively foul.

The language used is somewhat less-than-even-handed at the outset and the management of the argument simply fails from that point forward. Bettman reiterates comments from the experts, then simply says that they didn't actually examine Wideman and so they can't positively state that he WAS concussed and, even if he were, that he positively WOULD do the kind of action he did. Of course not; each individual is different and each reacts to concussion - particularly in the moments after the incident - differently. There is simply no credence provided to this.

Then - to take the Wideman text and somehow state that it shows lack of remorse is lacking in all logic. He can be remorseful and resentful at the same time.

The arbitrator can have a field day with this one. Will be interesting to see how he handles it. I assume that in all cases like this, the person doing the hearing gets to be both "finder of fact" and "interpreter" at the same time, much like an original trial judge in the judicial system.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

This.

As someone who regularly reads Court decisions (particularly Supreme Court tax decisions) this one doesn't even meet the smell test - it's positively foul.

The language used is somewhat less-than-even-handed at the outset and the management of the argument simply fails from that point forward. Bettman reiterates comments from the experts, then simply says that they didn't actually examine Wideman and so they can't positively state that he WAS concussed and, even if he were, that he positively WOULD do the kind of action he did. Of course not; each individual is different and each reacts to concussion - particularly in the moments after the incident - differently. There is simply no credence provided to this.

Then - to take the Wideman text and somehow state that it shows lack of remorse is lacking in all logic. He can be remorseful and resentful at the same time.

The arbitrator can have a field day with this one. Will be interesting to see how he handles it. I assume that in all cases like this, the person doing the hearing gets to be both "finder of fact" and "interpreter" at the same time, much like an original trial judge in the judicial system.

Bettman isn't a acting as a jurist in this instance, however, and there is no reasonable expectation of him to report on the case in an even or even entirely accurate manner.

I am not sure how it works between supreme and appellate courts, but this is almost like the supreme court confirming an earlier appellate decision.

Colin Campbell was appointed by Bettman into the position he has. Bettman is simply put his stamp of approval on Campbell's work in this instance. It is the NHLPA who represent the interests of Wideman and if they disagree with the accuracy of Bettman's statements, I believe they are more than welcome to say so.

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by Hyde

H1N1 scare and the team getting the vaccine in the states.

They did not get the vaccine in the States. Had they done so, there likely would not have been any issue then at all.

[Dr. Doom]

Pretty clear to me they took his text message to send a message...

Don't mess with the league on this subject.

And by "this subject" I can't tell if it's referees or concussion. Maybe both?

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by SebC

If this trend holds, it should be the biggest scandal in this whole saga.

Not if they are actually calling penalties. Tough to argue on the calls that were made last few games.

[sureLoss]

News Update

NHLPA @NHLPA
NHLPA will appeal Bettman’s decision upholding 20 game suspension of Wideman to the Neutral Discipline Arbitrator

The National Hockey League Players’ Association (NHLPA) issued the following statement this evening regarding the National Hockey League’s (NHL) decision to uphold Dennis Wideman’s suspension for 20 games:
“We are extremely disappointed but not surprised that Gary Bettman upheld the decision of his staff to suspend Dennis Wideman for 20 games. This decision completely ignores the effects of the concussion that Dennis sustained when he was driven into the boards eight seconds before colliding with the linesman. We will appeal to the Neutral Discipline Arbitrator in order to have this decision overturned.”

[saillias]

Hamilton clearly orchestrated this whole thing by leaking Bettman the text so Hartley would keep him on the PP.

The whole subpoena thing is a bluff and Bettman is having a laugh over this I bet.

[dash_pinched]

Originally Posted by saillias

Hamilton clearly orchestrated this whole thing by leaking Bettman the text so Hartley would keep him on the PP.

Well, he is a loner and standoffish

[MarkGio]

On what legal grounds can the league subpoena personal text messages?

[GioforPM]

I don't think the statements he made were inconsistent. What I won't say is that there's no way one side or another is wrong

[nik-]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

On what legal grounds can the league subpoena personal text messages?

It's likely a part of the CBA.

[harmony]

MOD EDIT: No insults please.

[Ashasx]

MOD EDIT: No insults, please.

[nik-]

no ur