May 2015 Provincial Election Thread v2

[Resolute 14]

Exactly. Notley's continual attempts to blame past governments rings increasingly hollow the longer she goes. And while Clark was clearly taking aim at Alberta's overall governmental record, she also took a direct shot at Notley in arguing her province isn't using a Carbon Tax as a cash grab.

So Notley's deflections are even weaker in this case. At some point very soon, Notley will have to choose between continuing to support her special interests, or starting to support the people she is paid to represent. It is becoming increasingly obvious she cannot do both.

[IliketoPuck]

Had lunch with a senior industry exec this week that was present at the Trudeau/Notley talks in Calgary.

FWIW he came off as impressed by Trudeau's knowledge of the industry and the current economic pressure, although he did say that the PM stopped far short of making any promises. He thought Notley came across as weak, hesitant, and uninformed about the industry.

[Locke]

Lets be fair to the NDP here, never in the history of time and human achievement has one government ever taken office after a previous one.

They are in completely uncharted territory.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Locke

Lets be fair to the NDP here, never in the history of time and human achievement has one government ever taken office after a previous one.

They are in completely uncharted territory.

You know, if there was a CP Poster's hall of fame, you'd be a first ballot inductee.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

Had lunch with a senior industry exec this week that was present at the Trudeau/Notley talks in Calgary.

FWIW he came off as impressed by Trudeau's knowledge of the industry and the current economic pressure, although he did say that the PM stopped far short of making any promises. He thought Notley came across as weak, hesitant, and uninformed about the industry.

did he talk about rebuilding Alberta's energy industry from the Heart out?

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

As far as the people running for office, we're not getting qualified people for the most part that are engines of industry for example, and especially with the NDP where we're getting a lot of rubes and inexperienced students and people that really shouldn't be in any position of decision making. Is it time that there is a requirement put on things like Cabinet positions? Like an actual job description with experience and educational requirements.

Being an MLA is the best job most of our MLAs are ever going to have, and by a mile. That's scary.

One of the interesting things the NDP have done is make cabinet largely a symbolic position. i originally thought out of necessity, but I am not so sure anymore. Ministers don't take a leak without checking with Topp. To the extent this looks like a winning formula you can bet other parties will copy it. That's only going to make it harder to get good people to run. If someone is actually capable and accomplished they'll be thinking Hmm let me see...pay cut, get to be a public pin cushion, and no say in the direction. Sign me up.

[IliketoPuck]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

did he talk about rebuilding Alberta's energy industry from the Heart out?

He basically said that Trudeau came off as knowledgeable about the industry (statistics, trends, etc.), but that he played all the discussions like a politician; listening, empathizing, not committing.

He also said his hair smelled of cinnamon.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

He basically said that Trudeau came off as knowledgeable about the industry (statistics, trends, etc.), but that he played all the discussions like a politician; listening, empathizing, not committing.

He also said his hair smelled of cinnamon.

So a whole lot about nothing.

Roger

[Locke]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

You know, if there was a CP Poster's hall of fame, you'd be a first ballot inductee.

I am merely a humble servant but I'll take a bow.

[IliketoPuck]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

So a whole lot about nothing.

Roger

Yes. But the encouraging thing was that he actually seems to understand the industry, the macro picture, and what Canada needs to do to be competitive globally. But admittedly, no commitments on any front.

Notley sounds like she was just there for the free lunch.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

Yes. But the encouraging thing was that he actually seems to understand the industry, the macro picture, and what Canada needs to do to be competitive globally. But admittedly, no commitments on any front.

Notley sounds like she was just there for the free lunch.

Yeah, the crazy part to me is that while I feel we should be more environmentally conscious we have to reasonable about it.

Canada could literally revert back to the stone age and eliminate our emissions by 100% and it would make the tiniest difference.

Nothing matters until the big players play ball and they are refusing to play.

[Travis Munroe]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

You know, if there was a CP Poster's hall of fame, you'd be a first ballot inductee.

Way off topic but something like a hall of fame for CP would be pretty awesome.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Realtor 1

Way off topic but something like a hall of fame for CP would be pretty awesome.

Also way off topic, but I disagree.

I think honors like that would take away from the forum. Its like a sports team, you've got to do your bit and keep it up or be replaced.

If someone were to be awarded as some sort of forum royalty I'd worry that someone would be hesitant to call that poster out.

We all need to be branded as CDC Paste eating trolls from time to time.

The tree of liberty occasionally needs to be watered with the blood of patriots.

I was literally called a troll last week.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The argument is that it's already difficult to get qualified people to run for office. And by qualified, what's usually meant is professionals with experience managing budgets and large organizations. How do you get seasoned lawyers, or executives in the private sector, or the owners of successful businesses, to quit their jobs, move to Edmonton, and become MLAs? They're quitting a good job already to make less money. Disrupting their lives and their careers.

The answer has been pensions and transition allowances. And yes, they got out of hand (as did private compensation in this province, if we're being honest). But I don't know that we should do away with them altogether.

The other approach is that we should expect just average Albertans to run for office. Looking at the provincial NDPs, and their difficulty in filling cabinet positions with qualified candidates, I'm not sure that's a persuasive argument.

I don't trust seasoned professionals or lawyers as Politicians any more than I do shoeless Joe off the street. There have been countless ineffective or inept or corrupt Politicians coming from professional roles.

Some of the best Politicians that I have seen or that I personally know do actually get into the environment because they really care about the process and aren't necessarily attracted by the benefits and golden parachutes.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Some of the best Politicians that I have seen or that I personally know do actually get into the environment because they really care about the process and aren't necessarily attracted by the benefits and golden parachutes.

That's fine. But it's harder to find people who care about the process if they have to give up their career and take a 50 per cent pay cut for eight years.

And why not apply that principal to the private sector? Your credentials are excellent, Mr. Smith, and we'd be happy to have you join our executive team. You should be aware, however, that we want people who really care about our business, and are committed to doing the right thing. This isn't about money. That's why we pay half what our competitors do and offer no stock options. Also, we're going to publicly disclose what we do pay you. How does that sound?

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Locke

Yeah, the crazy part to me is that while I feel we should be more environmentally conscious we have to reasonable about it.

Canada could literally revert back to the stone age and eliminate our emissions by 100% and it would make the tiniest difference.

Nothing matters until the big players play ball and they are refusing to play.

Why not be a leader though? Honestly with the way our country is setup and the obstacles involved, if we could meet our Paris targets it would probably show a lot of innovation that other countries could copy to reduce their own.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Why not be a leader though? Honestly with the way our country is setup and the obstacles involved, if we could meet our Paris targets it would probably show a lot of innovation that other countries could copy to reduce their own.

Because all we've got is resources to sell.

We shouldnt be shooting ourselves in the foot while trying to sell them.

It would be great to be a leader in environmental concern but we've got to take care of ourselves first and honestly, if none of China, India, Russia or the US do a damned thing about reducing their emissions then nothing we do matters.

So why are we taking one on the chin for the team when none of the major players seems to care?

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Why not be a leader though? Honestly with the way our country is setup and the obstacles involved, if we could meet our Paris targets it would probably show a lot of innovation that other countries could copy to reduce their own.

the only way to meet the Paris Targets is to destroy Canada's economy.

And not just the energy based economy either.

Plus you would pretty much have to take every car off of the road.

Oh and cancel winter, we would need to do that too.

And do you really think that if Canada did this that every one would

a) hang their heads in shame and clean it up

b) take advantage of Canada's actions economically by ramping their resource selling to take the place that Canada would leave?

Isn't it time for countries like China, and the US to maybe stop being the biggest hypocrites on the planet and actually lead instead of demanding that everyone else do it first?

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Locke

Because all we've got is resources to sell.

We shouldnt be shooting ourselves in the foot while trying to sell them.

It would be great to be a leader in environmental concern but we've got to take care of ourselves first and honestly, if none of China, India, Russia or the US do a damned thing about reducing their emissions then nothing we do matters.

So why are we taking one on the chin for the team when none of the major players seems to care?

Oh this is simple, because we (Canada) are the easy target for environmental groups and the people that are so vested in climate change.

If they did the protesting that they do in Canada or fund groups like they do in Canada, not only would the Chinese not give a crap, but they would probably increase their carbon signatures with all of the firing squads.

The saudi's at least have a clean method of execution, beheadings are carbon free.

America would make a pretty speech about change and keep on moving on.

I could drop carbon emissions in one foul swoop. No more gatherings like Paris. Make them do it by phone.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Locke

Because all we've got is resources to sell.

We shouldnt be shooting ourselves in the foot while trying to sell them.

It would be great to be a leader in environmental concern but we've got to take care of ourselves first and honestly, if none of China, India, Russia or the US do a damned thing about reducing their emissions then nothing we do matters.

So why are we taking one on the chin for the team when none of the major players seems to care?

But that's a big part of our problem isn't it? If we keep going on with this mentality of focusing entirely on our resource industry, we're just going to keep repeating the same mistakes we've been making for the last 40 years. Furthermore, what do you think the economy and job situation is going to look like if we continue to do nothing and the more cataclysmic effects of climate change finally come home to roost? We seem to have a big problem with passing economic debt onto future generations, but no problem passing ecologic debt onto them.

I agree that the big players need to do their part, but I disagree with sitting on the sidelines until they do. If everyone has to take it on the chin eventually, and they will one way or another, why not get the train rolling and aggressively search for alternative solutions? I can almost guarantee any short term pain now is going to pale in comparison to what's coming down the line in the future.

And this just from a personal perspective for me, but I think waiting on others to do the right thing before you do is just poor form ethically speaking. For instance, I don't check to see how much others are donating to charity before I decide how much to donate. I'm aware we're talking very different scales here, but I think the principle should still stand.