Jian Ghomeshi no longer with CBC

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

I mean, I've never been asked to punch a girl in bed but it can be interpreted that her trying to get back to him multiple times after that the punching was either consensual at the time or exaggerated after the fact.

I don't know if you want to praise Jian's lawyer or dress down the crown for being so painfully duped.

It's far from over with this many complainants and as long as the second witness hasn't totally dropped out, they could bury him under their testimony but what a dumb hole the crown has put themselves in off the bat.

I'm sure it can be interpreted that way, but people stay in abusive relationships all the time. I can see the argument that the defense was stating was that she wasn't traumatized by hearing his voice or seeing him on TV. But she didn't even touch on or ask about the punching.

EDIT: or what Ernie said.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by ernie

Happens all the time in abusive relationships. Just because a person stays with someone or tries to get back together with someone or various other things it doesn't mean the event in question didn't happen or is being exaggerated after the fact.

I agree. That's why I said "it can be interpreted." It can also be interpreted as an abusive relationship where this girl feels like she's not allowed to leave. But her "I was trying to trap him," response to her reasoning for the contact doesn't come off that way to me. It comes across as an off the cuff response to getting caught lying.

[Kjesse]

Correct me if I misunderstand, but since when is someone staying in a relationship (ie. where they date for a while, or may live together, or have financial ties, or children etc.) comparable to two dates as far as that phenomenon? I can understand where females (or males) stay in a relationship despite being abused, and have read a few things about it, but I've never heard it applied to a date or two.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Delgar

Correct me if I misunderstand, but since when is someone staying in a relationship (ie. where they date for a while, or may live together, or have financial ties, or children etc.) comparable to two dates as far as that phenomenon? I can understand where females (or males) stay in a relationship despite being abused, and have read a few things about it, but I've never heard it applied to a date or two.

Which is my other issue with it.

If that is the case it is more likely that she felt reporting him could damage something else, not a personal romantic relationship but a work relationship or her own personal or professional standing. So she just had to eat it and accept it in her mind. More than likely though is that she was just not a good witness to put on the stand.

[Kjesse]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Which is my other issue with it.

If that is the case it is more likely that she felt reporting him could damage something else, not a personal romantic relationship but a work relationship or her own personal or professional standing. So she just had to eat it and accept it in her mind. More than likely though is that she was just not a good witness to put on the stand.

I agree, I think we're on the same page on this witness. Sad thing is, I tend to believe her regarding the main claim, that he assaulted her, but with all the rest of it, I don't think her testimony could result in actual proof. Too much embellishment, and even not telling the truth to the police.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Delgar

I agree, I think we're on the same page on this witness. Sad thing is, I tend to believe her regarding the main claim, that he assaulted her, but with all the rest of it, I don't think her testimony could result in actual proof. Too much embellishment, and even not telling the truth to the police.

Like I said: with this many complainants, who seem to have had very little prior contact with one another, it is incredibly unlikely that he isn't going beyond his stated "consensual" interactions with these women into a territory that would be physical and sexual assault.

But this witness puts the Crown in a hole to start and has to have them re-vetting every single witness to make sure this doesn't happen again. I think their case becomes irreparably damaged if a second instance like this comes up.

I think this is the case of the Crown not doing anywhere near the amount of work needed on this case, likely assuming it wouldn't be this hard. They pooched it and this is going to be solely on them if he gets off or gets a light sentence.

[troutman]

Irene Preklet Verified account ‏@Irene680NEWS Next complainant at #JianGhomeshi trial is Lucy DeCoutere, crown asked for adjournment til 11:30 to go over new statement #Ghomeshi

Angelina Chapin Verified account ‏@angelinachapin Angelina Chapin Retweeted
Bikini photo will not be released to media in #Ghomeshi case https://twitter.com/rosiewestwood/status/695267965663645696 …

Janice Golding ‏@Janice_Golding
Judge rules #bikini photo remains sealed. "There is a serious societal interest in respecting this witness's privacy interest". #Ghomeshi

[fredr123]

Originally Posted by troutman

Irene Preklet Verified account ‏@Irene680NEWS Next complainant at #JianGhomeshi trial is Lucy DeCoutere, crown asked for adjournment til 11:30 to go over new statement #Ghomeshi

Angelina Chapin Verified account ‏@angelinachapin Angelina Chapin Retweeted
Bikini photo will not be released to media in #Ghomeshi case https://twitter.com/rosiewestwood/status/695267965663645696 …

Janice Golding ‏@Janice_Golding
Judge rules #bikini photo remains sealed. "There is a serious societal interest in respecting this witness's privacy interest". #Ghomeshi

From Laura Fraser and the CBC Live Blog, on the bikini photo ruling:

Horkins: There's a publication ban on including anything that might name or publicly identify the complainant.

"At the outset of this proceedings, I made an order that I would facilitate media access to exhibits [and] that transparency would be the default position."

The photo, however, is in a sealed envelope right now.

Horkins said the "open court" principle is recognized in the court, but he says that Fischer’s argument that the court allowed for the video of Ashley Smith’s death -- a teenager who died in custody -- may not hold water here.

In that case, Smith’s family wanted the video released -- and it highlighted the actions of the accused in the case.

Today, however, the image is of a complainant, one of who strongly opposes the release of the photo, he said. And, as the Crown has said, this could deter others from reporting.

Given the historical under-reporting of sexual offences, the judge said he considers it important to make others feel comfortable that their identity will be protected if they report an alleged sexual assault.

“There is a serious societal interest in protecting this witness’s privacy interests,” he said.

The judge said that the photo has already been described in detail and it does not seriously infringe on the freedom of the press.

“Quite seriously, it’s my view you don’t need to see it, to get the picture.”

[Coach]

Is the photo of her in a bikini showing bruises/damage from the alledged assault?

[woob]

The Current had a segment on the trial and the debate of the treatment of sexual assault complainants. Discussion on this segment includes "whack the complainant", the neuro biology side of memory during sexual assault, and myths about bullying complainants on the stand.

Ghomeshi trial sparks debate about treatment of sexual assault complainants.

[Buster]

Originally Posted by ernie

Happens all the time in abusive relationships. Just because a person stays with someone or tries to get back together with someone or various other things it doesn't mean the event in question didn't happen or is being exaggerated after the fact.

It certainly helps to create reasonable doubt.

[troutman]

#rustytrombone will be trending today.

Lucy described raunchy e-mails with Jian.

Crown is spending much more time on direct of Lucy.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by MattyC

Is the photo of her in a bikini showing bruises/damage from the alledged assault?

No.

It was sent in a personal e-mail by the accuser to Jian after she said she had cut off all contact with him.

The defense brought the e-mails in as evidence to discredit her.

[peter12]

Well, Decoutere stuck by her guns pretty well. Interesting to see what the defense does.

[bluejays]

Why is it in the public's interest to see those photographs? All jokes aside on it, if the media requested it, pretty scummy of them. I agree with the judge here - to protect the witness, it's a good idea to not release them.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by peter12

Interesting to see what the defense does.

Focus on her statement that she didn't come forward before because she didn't feel like it was an assault on her.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Focus on her statement that she didn't come forward before because she didn't feel like it was an assault on her.

No, she didn't say that. She said:

"I always thought that assault meant that you were beaten to pieces and I didn't think this qualified," she said. "I didn't know this was illegal. I thought to be assaulted you had to be broken and raped."

[woob]

In recess. Judge's laptop died due to dead battery...

Edit. One reporter says laptop died, one say battery low. But still.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by peter12

No, she didn't say that. She said:

Interestingly, the article I read had the quote worded differently.

However, I do see a way the defense will go at this. A training and development officer in the Military with the rank of captain has never crossed training that involves what constitutes assault under the law?

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Interestingly, the article I read had the quote worded differently.

However, I do see a way the defense will go at this. A training and development officer in the Military with the rank of captain has never crossed training that involves what constitutes assault under the law?

Some of the lawyer folk on here will have to step in, but she creates a very strong narrative of abuse. Obviously, discrepancies in her story can just be laid at the feet to adrenaline and shock.