[Signing] Panthers sign Barkov to 6 year extension ($5.9mil AAV)

[Matata]

I've been following the Monahan vs Barkov debate for a while and I'd have to go with Barkov, just seems to have the defensive edge. Even after last season there was no shortage of people who'd have preferred Barkov, there is a lot to be optimistic about with this guy, he could have a very long stretch where he is the best 2 way center in the league.

[Poe969]

Barkov is really good and I would have loved to have him on the Flames. Monahan is still really good as well but they're different players. I'm glad we have Monahan and I hope he signs a reasonable contract like this one.

[killer_carlson]

FWIW Eric Duhatschek on the Fan right now and says Barkov is a good comparable contract for Monahan.

Saying that you don't go to war with the guys you think is your core group (and push for a bridge contract). uses Ryan Johansen as an example of what not to do.

[Stud_McCool]

Maybe it's a good thing that Monahan is having an off year because he likely won't be able to command Johnny money. 6 years at 6M would be pretty good for Mony.

[SuperMatt18]

Good value for Florida but the guy becomes a UFA at 26/27.

Should have paid a little more to try to get it to 8 years IMO.

[Enoch Root]

This is not that fantastic of a deal IMO. Not sure why they would only go 6 years. So it's 4 RFA years and only 2 UFA years. Not saying it's bad, just that it's fair.

If you add 2 UFA years at $8M per, that makes the deal 8 x $6.425 which is just about right IMO.

I would be happy to see Monahan signed for 8 x $6 - $6.5M (though I doubt he does that).

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Maybe among Flames fans it's close but if you look outside of the epistemic bubble you'd find that sentiment would be rather different.

All I'm saying is that there's a clear ranking between the two players. That's why it's not close. Added to that, there's uniform sentiment around the league on the ranking that no amount of huffing and puffing will cloud over.

Please enlighten us with evidence of said clear ranking. Us poor, sheltered Flames fans long for knowledge of the outside world - maybe you can bring it to us.

So far, we have one voice, Duhatchek, who thinks they are comparables. I agree with him.

***

Fans clearly display a what-have-you-done-for-me lately mindset. And Monahan has struggled a bit this season, compared to last. Meanwhile Barkov is having a breakout season with Jagr and Uber-dough.

Step back and look at the big picture, and the players are as close to comparables as you'll ever find.

[Jason14h]

Not sure why they would only go 6 years

A lot can change in 6 years, let alone 8.

How many long contracts have actually worked out. I doubt a team wants to go to 8 very often.

Staying as motivated at 21 is far different then at 29 with a family, kids, and 40 million in the bank. Not to mention you need to be more dedicated as your body isn't as young

[heep223]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

FWIW Eric Duhatschek on the Fan right now and says Barkov is a good comparable contract for Monahan.

Saying that you don't go to war with the guys you think is your core group (and push for a bridge contract). uses Ryan Johansen as an example of what not to do.

He also called Monahan an "elite young player". Duha has seen a lot of hockey in his day.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Maybe among Flames fans it's close but if you look outside of the epistemic bubble you'd find that sentiment would be rather different.

All I'm saying is that there's a clear ranking between the two players. That's why it's not close. Added to that, there's uniform sentiment around the league on the ranking that no amount of huffing and puffing will cloud over.

Barkov is having a better year right now so no surprise that many fans will deem him better. What have you done for me lately.
For what it is worth I think they are extremely comparable players and anyone saying that one is CLEARLY better than the other is over-reaching.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Please enlighten us with evidence of said clear ranking. Us poor, sheltered Flames fans long for knowledge of the outside world - maybe you can bring it to us.

So far, we have one voice, Duhatchek, who thinks they are comparables. I agree with him.

Though its 6 months old (again, what have you done for me lately?) we have a 2nd in Darryl Sutter.

As for HF, they probably know as much about Monahan as I know about Barkov, which is probably not much. I'm usually not one for advanced stats, but some good points raised above that has me more convinced; though I still don't think one (Barkov) is substantially better than the other (Monahan) I will contest that there seems to be a good case for him being better. Not sure I'd do the swap... again, different divisions and conferences, different competition (Kopitar, Getzlaf, Thornton/Pavalski, Sedin sisters is better than Kreji, Stamkos and the never healthy Zetterberg), different teams with different systems and different expectations... sometimes a player (Olli Jokinen) plays incredible on one team as a No 1 C and puts up 90 points then flops when he goes to another team, at least I know Monahan can produce here.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Barkov is having a better year right now so no surprise that many fans will deeh him better. What have you done for me lately.
For what it is worth I think they are extremely comparable players and anyone saying that one is CLEARLY better than the other is over-reaching.

Obviously there's recency bias in everyone's assessment but is that really a problem? The question is who's the better player and who will be the better player. Obviously you want to weight the recent development and performance more than what happened two seasons ago.

As others have discussed, Barkov appears to have better tools, is bigger, faster, and is almost a year younger. Coupled with the pedigree and his usage stats which are more impressive than Monahan and it's not a stretch to say that most people would rank Barkov as the better player.

When you watch Barkov vs. Monahan you notice one alot more. Anyway, it's not a slight on Monahan to say that Barkov looks like he's a clearly a better player. It's just the styles they play. Monahan is a goal mouth and off the rush player with Barkov is a board and possession player.

If you just wiped it all aside and looked at who these players are this season I don't know how you can really say that it's a toss up. Should Monahan's two previous seasons then count for something? I don't think so, it's comparing apples to oranges with Barkov who was injured and younger and on a worse team.

So yes, we can talk about the semantics of who's clearly better but most indicators are pointing to Barkov.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Should Monahan's two previous seasons then count for something? I don't think so, it's comparing apples to oranges with Barkov who was injured and younger and on a worse team.

Of course they do, we're comparing the same levels of experience (age doesn't mean everything).

Barkov was also developed in a men's league and had pro experience before coming to the NHL.

If playing on a worse teams makes a difference, why are you avoiding factoring in how much worse the Flames are than Florida this year?

If it's apples and oranges it's apples and oranges, that doesn't mean calling them incomparable until Barkov is suddenly playing better.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

...So yes, we can talk about the semantics of who's clearly better but most indicators are pointing to Barkov.

Oh, please. You are the one who came out and asserted that "it's not even close." I would agree that Barkov is a better player, but your insistence on the gap between him and Monahan is not just a matter of semantics.

[Hackey]

So far in their short careers I think you have to give Monahan the edge. In the future however I'd probably bet that Barkov becomes the better overall player. Still both very good players but I think Barkov's potential is higher. He has more untapped potential. Monahan I see rounding out his game but I don't see him really taking another big step forward. He probably will be a 25-40 goal scorer for the rest of his career. Barkov has Selke potential.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Barkov is having a better year right now so no surprise that many fans will deeh him better. What have you done for me lately.

To me it has nothing to do with what have you done for me lately. Barkov was rated higher than Monahan in every pre-draft ranking, and it looks like he's going to fulfill his potential.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

To me it has nothing to do with what have you done for me lately. Barkov was rated higher than Monahan in every pre-draft ranking, and it looks like he's going to fulfill his potential.

Agreed. I had Barkov rated #2 on my list for the Flames prior to that draft. He's on his way to achieving his full potential IMO which is a bit higher than Sean's.

[calgaryblood]

I can't think of two more similar centers around the same age. Both great young centers where Monahan is struggling a little lately and Barkov struggled earlier in his career.

I think both are a little over rated defensively to be honest.

[vilzeh]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

I can't think of two more similar centers around the same age. Both great young centers where Monahan is struggling a little lately and Barkov struggled earlier in his career.

I think both are a little over rated defensively to be honest.

No, it's just Monahan who is overrated if someone, Barkov is that good defensively, and he's 20.

Also he's the brain of Florida's game, when he was injured, Florida was a mess.

[albertGQ]

Lots of comments about the Oilers' 6X6 contracts (in other threads as well), but didn't they only hand out one of these type of contracts (Eberle)

I think Hall & RNH got 7X6 contracts.