[Rumour] Flames still trying to re-sign Russell

[nik-]

I guess it really depends on the dollar amount. We really can't be paying him like a second pairing D-man. It's going to be contracts like that that will get us in trouble.

[AC]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

All UFA's next summer though. But yeah.

Yep, for sure. But with Monahan and Gaudreau needing big time deals those 3 D are hurting our cap the most IMO.

Worst case we wait a year until they're off the books though.

[Stormchaser]

Why all the hate for Russell? I don't get it. I'm fine with good asset management and happy if we get a good return. I'm also fine to keep the guy around. Still don't get the hate?

[Flash Walken]

All sorts of factors make Russell attractive for a playoff bound team.

He'll be cheap at the deadline in terms of remaining salary. No salary commitment next year. Not a top earning player so potential to re-sign him prior to free agency if he works with your team. Shot blocking, 'heart and soul' player, exactly what you need come playoff time.

There are loads of reasons why he's valuable.

[dammage79]

The debate for me is, the Flames have far too many vets and no room for the necessary growth of the farm hands. There are 3 or 4 that have a honest shot at earning a spot for next season.

I like Russell but in terms of getting the right return to further the rebuild, you're just not going to get for Wideman what you can for Russell. I feel like the Flames are locked into Wideman until at least the next seasons trade deadline.

Russell, as a rental with his cap is going to fetch a studly return during deadline day madness. And there's a real chance he comes back and re-signs in CGY anyhow. I think it could be a missed opportunity to re-sign Russell and not try to move him at the deadline.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by AC

Yep, for sure. But with Monahan and Gaudreau needing big time deals those 3 D are hurting our cap the most IMO.

Worst case we wait a year until they're off the books though.

Yeah, there is a surprising 16 million coming off the books this season though (without Russell). Obviously those roles needs to be replaced, especially the goalies but there should be more going out than in.

Raymond and one of Engellend or Smid going would be peaches.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by dammage79

The debate for me is, the Flames have far too many vets and no room for the necessary growth of the farm hands. There are 3 or 4 that have a honest shot at earning a spot for next season.

Well first of all, the farm hands have to show that they could be better than Russell. I haven't gotten that sense from any of them at this point. Just out of curiosity, who do you feel is ready next year? I can't think of 1, let alone 3 or 4.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Well first of all, the farm hands have to show that they could be better than Russell. I haven't gotten that sense from any of them at this point. Just out of curiosity, who do you feel is ready next year? I can't think of 1, let alone 3 or 4.

Probably not anyone, maybe one of Wotherspoon, Kulak or Culkin. Russell could be gone regardless of depth though, that's the point. His price point, especially if he hits UFA status will get inflated and disrupt the Flames cap IMO.

Treliving obviously has a price he thinks can work, but if it doesn't trade him before losing him for nothing. The Flames aren't in the position to be keeping valuable trading chips yet.

[dammage79]

Nm

[Enoch Root]

Nakladal is ready right now.

But there are 3 other guys I would replace before Russell.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Well first of all, the farm hands have to show that they could be better than Russell. I haven't gotten that sense from any of them at this point. Just out of curiosity, who do you feel is ready next year? I can't think of 1, let alone 3 or 4.

Nakladal, Kylington (no joke), Kulak, Culkin (health permitting) and Rasmus Andersson who made far too much noise last camp to completely write his arrival to the NHL off as well. And the season he is having in the O.

There are some real legitimate options that can earn a top six role with the Flames.

[MoreDrank]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Probably not anyone, maybe one of Wotherspoon, Kulak or Culkin. Russell could be gone regardless of depth though, that's the point. His price point, especially if he hits UFA status will get inflated and disrupt the Flames cap IMO.

Treliving obviously has a price he thinks can work, but if it doesn't trade him before losing him for nothing. The Flames aren't in the position to be keeping valuable trading chips yet.

Flames looked fine when Russell was out. Won all the games. Rotate in a Wotherspoon or Kulak if one of Wideman, or Smid, Engelland gets banged up.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Nakladal is ready right now.

But there are 3 other guys I would replace before Russell.

Fair enough, Wideman, Smid and Engelland won't fetch the return that Russell can though. It's the whole sell high on Hudler when we should have argument all over again. This time I think the prudent maneuver is to move the pending UFA that can fetch the absolute best return for the franchise moving forward.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Fair enough, Wideman, Smid and Engelland won't fetch the return that Russell can though. It's the whole sell high on Hudler when we should have argument all over again. This time I think the prudent maneuver is to move the pending UFA that can fetch the absolute best return for the franchise moving forward.

I am not against trading him. And I don't want to see the Flames sign him to a huge contract.

But I think Flames fans under-rate Russell substantially.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Nakladal, Kylington (no joke), Kulak, Culkin (health permitting), Andersson made far too much noise last camp to completely write his arrival to the NHL off as well. And the season he is having in the O.

There are some real legitimate options that can earn a top six role with the Flames.

I don't disagree that they can be NHLers, but outside of Nakladal, I'm not sure any of them are seasoned enough yet to make the jump. Kulak and Culkin are likely to be bottom pairing d-men with an outside chance at the 2nd pair, and while they are progressing, it's not really a linear progression so far. Kylington must be making huge strides, because he looked nowhere near ready for NHL competition in his own end earlier this year. Offensively, he's very talented, but he needs a LOT of tutelage still. Andersson looks good too, but he also needs at least a season or two in the AHL before you should really consider him for regular NHL duties.

I think your timeline is a little premature, that's all.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I am not against trading him. And I don't want to see the Flames sign him to a huge contract.

But I think Flames fans under-rate Russell substantially.

For me, I don't think I under estimate Russell at all. He's been amazing for the Flames and a straight up bargain too. But that's also why I think he should be moved. He's debatably the strongest asset the Flames have to move. With all the bickering about the Cammy thing a couple years ago to moving Hudler in the off season I feel like people need to soften their stance a bit, myself included.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

I don't disagree that they can be NHLers, but outside of Nakladal, I'm not sure any of them are seasoned enough yet to make the jump. Kulak and Culkin are likely to be bottom pairing d-men with an outside chance at the 2nd pair, and while they are progressing, it's not really a linear progression so far. Kylington must be making huge strides, because he looked nowhere near ready for NHL competition in his own end earlier this year. Offensively, he's very talented, but he needs a LOT of tutelage still. Andersson looks good too, but he also needs at least a season or two in the AHL before you should really consider him for regular NHL duties.

I think your timeline is a little premature, that's all.

My take on the Kylington chatter in the AHL forum and reading elsewhere, is that Kylington and Nakladal could walk right into say the bottom pairing next season and the Flames won't skip a beat.

In the end, we will see how it all unfolds heading into next season but my argument is that moving Russell isn't going to expose any major nerves that the team cannot adapt to.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by dammage79

My take on the Kylington chatter in the AHL forum and reading elsewhere, is that Kylington and Nakladal could walk right into say the bottom pairing next season and the Flames won't skip a beat.

Maybe, but that still doesn't address the 2nd pairing and it puts one of Wideman, Engelland, or Smid up there playing over 20 minutes a night. I don't think that's a recipe for success.

[VladtheImpaler]

You already have your top 3 + Wideman (who you are probably stuck with going into next season). Certainly one of (or both due to being untradeable) Engelland and Smid is around too. You can't sign Russell for 2 simple reasons:

1) need to leave room for organic growth from within that also allows you to have a defenseman or two on ELC
2) Russell has good value at the deadline, and it would be foolish to forego a nice return at this stage of the rebuild just to hold on to a bottom-pairing defenseman

[Cali Panthers Fan]

People need to stop saying Russell is a bottom pairing defenseman. He might be on the deepest d-corps in the league (which the Flames can be in the conversation of), but fact remains he hasn't played on the bottom pairing in several years.