On the main roster now there are 9 players that are home grown. I don't know how that matches against other teams - but seems pretty good. That excludes Ortio.
Let's remember Ortio was a sixth round pick.
9 does not seem like a lot to me. I guess my question really is this. Is the Flames organization currently doing a good job of getting AHL players ready to become quality NHL players? Ortio is just one guy and doesn't make a representative sample. But as a case study my complaint is not with Hartley for not playing him. He should have been knocking down the door giving him no choice. Is there anyone in the system doing that now? Last year? Ferland, Jooris maybe. But those guys are still fringe NHLers.
And yeah Ortio was a 6th round pick. That is not too relevant after a while. Are our 1st and 2nd rounders in the AHL looking to make the jump right now?
Bob Hartley would argue that his job isn't to manage assets - it is to win games. If he thinks, on any given game day, that Ortio doesn't give him the best chance to win - he won't start him.
If the Flames are out of it completely - then I agree - see what you have. But they clearly haven't thrown in the towel yet. Though if we are being hoenst I think this season is already over.
Does that not make it poor asset management? They are very likely done and yet they are risking losing a goalie to keep two guys who have are UFAs after this year.
Does that not make it poor asset management? They are very likely done and yet they are risking losing a goalie to keep two guys who have are UFAs after this year.
That seems to fall under Trelivings job. A coaches job is to win with the lineup he's given. The GM is to give the coach the best lineup possible
I'm sure he'll clear but what a brutal job by Hartley on this one.
As a matter of fact, talents like Gaudreau, Monahan and Bennett are hard to screw up. Other then them, who has he turned into a real good player? Some of our other lower rated prospects were talked about are toiling the bottom lines or the minors; Granlund, Wotherspoon, Ortio, Morrison, Poirier, Ferland.
A guy like Grant comes in and fills a role that this team has had helluva time filling in all my years of watching the Flames, winning faceoffs and he's sent back down cause we don't want to lose him to waivers?
The whole Always Earned Never Given was such a farce it's unbelievable. The team was winning last year and nothing was really said.
He's so damn stubborn. He's hurting the franchise right now. What worked last year, has to work this year and he won't change it up.
The team does have talent but last in PK, last in PP, last in GA in 2nd period, last in GA in 3rd period. last in overall allowed goals. Its not all the players.
If we continue losing hope he gets canned soon. Huska has having to teach the same system as he deploys up here, that team is garbage too. From top to bottom he's hurting the franchise.
The Flames have two mediocre veterans that are pending free agents and an NHL ready up and commer who is waiver eligible and a pending RFA.
The GMs thought process is probably that he wants to see what he has in the up and commer so he can figure out how to manage his goalie situation.
The coaches thought process should be that the two mediocre goalies that are playing terrible and won't be any better then mediocre. So he might as well see what he has in the up and commer so he can figure out how to manage his goalie situation.
Different thought process, same conclusion.
I don't know of Hartley came to a premature negative conclusion on Ortio, if he was sticking with his vets out of loyalty, or if he was bitter he had to deal with a three goalie situation. But he made the wrong decisions and now neither the coach or GM have the data on Ortio to make intelligent decisions going forward.
The only argument is "he was doing what he thought gave them the best chance to win." But they aren't winning and goal tending is a big part of the problem. Pot shot or not, it certainly isn't irrelevant. In fact it is one of the only things that is.
Prior to the Ducks game, Ramo had a save percentage over .920 and a GAA of 2.25 in his previous eight games. Goaltending was, in fact, one of the most significant reasons why we finally posted a winning record in a seven game segment.
But some people don't want to see that because they want to be angry and bitter.
Friday-Saturday is certainly the ideal time to go with the backup for a game, but unfortunately for Ortio, Hiller is ready to come back.
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pretty sure he'll clear, but am getting really annoyed by the flames this year.
I'm hoping that as the playoff opportunity diminishes further i would like to hear about a lot of the vets being moved out. hudler, stajan, jones, wideman, russel, smid/engelland. This team is in the middle of a rebuild, and young assets must still be a priority.
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if i'm ortio, i'm done with the flames organization regardless of what happens this year, so no, not particularly asset management in how any of this has been handled by the management.
Fred Poulin @FredPoulin98
I'm hearing the #Habs put a claim on Joni Ortio, but there are several teams ahead of them, so it will be interesting to see where he lands.
A honest question here. Is Hartley's job to win games or to do whatever is the best for organization? What happens if the Flames feel they need to ice some player because they need to showcase him for trade or they want to develop him or whatever, but the coach doesn't feel like said player gives him best chance to win? If coach only cares about his W-L record and doesn't care about organization's interests, isn't he a bit like a player, who only cares about his own stats and doesn't care about the team?
I think in the short-term, and with short-term decisions, his job is to win games in the here and now.
In the long-term his job is also to help develop players and improve them.
But I think as soon as the GM starts demanding lineup decisions to showcase players or whatever, you are entering dangerous territory.
The coach must care about the organization in the long-run, but when it comes to who he puts on the ice tonight - he must have the empowerment to ice the team he thinks has the best chance of winning.
9 does not seem like a lot to me. I guess my question really is this. Is the Flames organization currently doing a good job of getting AHL players ready to become quality NHL players? Ortio is just one guy and doesn't make a representative sample. But as a case study my complaint is not with Hartley for not playing him. He should have been knocking down the door giving him no choice. Is there anyone in the system doing that now? Last year? Ferland, Jooris maybe. But those guys are still fringe NHLers.
And yeah Ortio was a 6th round pick. That is not too relevant after a while. Are our 1st and 2nd rounders in the AHL looking to make the jump right now?
I think 9 is about average, maybe slightly below refelctive of the organization's poor drafting until recently.
Quick scan:
- Blackhawks have 10
- Ducks have 10
- Kings have 15 (high!)
