Brad Treliving Interview: Thoughts on the First 20 Games of the Season

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by flamesfever

I think the remark was undeserving and disrespectful.

Not really it's the truth and might be a little wake up call to the captain. Giordano had a pretty bad second half after an injury the year before last and has looked pretty bad this season after the injury last year. Brodie deserves a lot of credit.

The Oilers currently do have 6 Giordanos and he better pick it up or else it'll be one of the worst contracts in the NHL no matter how much leadership he brings.

[HelloHockeyFans]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

He's been up all season though, which could be Treliving worrying he'd be claimed off waivers.

There might be a few teams who would take Ortio. The Oilers are still in 30th, after all.

I believed this earlier in the season as well, but at this point I doubt anyone claims him.

Remember, they have to keep Ortio up with the big club if someone claims him and essentially create their own 3-headed monster in net.

Earlier in the season, Ortio was a better gamble due to his performance last season and also not performing poorly just yet. He hasn't looked good this year - I was really hoping he'd win the starting job this year - so I think teams will pass.

Ramo and Hiller will be the duo when all is said and done this year.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by HelloHockeyFans

I believed this earlier in the season as well, but at this point I doubt anyone claims him.

Remember, they have to keep Ortio up with the big club if someone claims him and essentially create their own 3-headed monster in net.

Earlier in the season, Ortio was a better gamble due to his performance last season and also not performing poorly just yet. He hasn't looked good this year - I was really hoping he'd win the starting job this year - so I think teams will pass.

Ramo and Hiller will be the duo when all is said and done this year.

All good points, and here's the crux of it. People think Hartley is holding Ortio back and he's awesome. Could be true. The Flames could be further ahead if he started more games. The coaching staff goes with the goalie who gives them the best chance to win. Ramo has been playing well for over a week, you can't just take away a start.

Plus, Treliving's mantra is "you can't over-season guys in the AHL" so why did Ramo hit waivers before Ortio?

[HelloHockeyFans]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

All good points, and here's the crux of it. People think Hartley is holding Ortio back and he's awesome. Could be true. The Flames could be further ahead if he started more games. The coaching staff goes with the goalie who gives them the best chance to win. Ramo has been playing well for over a week, you can't just take away a start.

Plus, Treliving's mantra is "you can't over-season guys in the AHL" so why did Ramo hit waivers before Ortio?

The current management group in Calgary has proven time and time again they have no issues with acknowledging mistakes they make through their actions, which is a good thing. They waived Raymond to start the year despite bringing him in as a FA and did the same with Ramo, both for similar reasons of not meeting expectations.

At the start of the year, when Ramo was given the opportunity to lock in a role on the team, he failed to meet expectations of the coaching staff and was subsequently waived. He seems to have turned the corner now, so I can see the Flames keeping him up now and waiving Ortio.

Not really acknowledging a mistake in this scenario, but acknowledging that Ramo received the message and has earned a spot now.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I think people are not being patient enough with regards to Ortio. I still don't think you expose him to waivers. Lots of young goalies struggle early on in their careers. Ortio has shown himself to be capable already, but is having a tough time so far this season.

I think Hiller is the guy that the Flames get rid of somehow, or just waive/demote if cleared.

Ramo is looking decent now - decent like many on here thought he would be. He is a 1B kind of goalie, with perhaps a bit of potential to become something better (though I wouldn't necessarily count on it). Ortio is very young and has shown lots of improvement and promise.

Flames gave up on Giguere. Anderson was drafted and never signed. Is Ortio in that kind of class? Doubtful, but we don't know that yet for sure either. Why hang on to the oldest (and inconsistent) goalie in Hiller when any way you slice it this is not a team that is competing for the cup this year? Why give up on the youngest guy in net (Ortio) when the Flames are still very much a rebuilding team?

I just think patience needs to be shown here. Yes, Ortio absolutely needs to start stepping up. He has gotten his chances, and if he does better in practices and shows better in the spot duty on back-to-backs or relief appearances, he will just gain Hartley's trust more. He needs to earn his time just like everyone else. He still has thus far projected into a solid possibility sooner rather than later, and a rough start when the entire team was playing rough in front of him shouldn't change it.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by HelloHockeyFans

The current management group in Calgary has proven time and time again they have no issues with acknowledging mistakes they make through their actions, which is a good thing. They waived Raymond to start the year despite bringing him in as a FA and did the same with Ramo, both for similar reasons of not meeting expectations.

At the start of the year, when Ramo was given the opportunity to lock in a role on the team, he failed to meet expectations of the coaching staff and was subsequently waived. He seems to have turned the corner now, so I can see the Flames keeping him up now and waiving Ortio.

Not really acknowledging a mistake in this scenario, but acknowledging that Ramo received the message and has earned a spot now.

The difference is, Ramo had playoff wins. I get that part. Ortio could be starting every game with the Heat, but that changed when Hiller went down.

My whole point is that Joni Ortio was put into limbo by the GM's decision to keep him with the team, not because the coach can't run 3 goalies and win consistently.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

All good points, and here's the crux of it. People think Hartley is holding Ortio back and he's awesome. Could be true. The Flames could be further ahead if he started more games. The coaching staff goes with the goalie who gives them the best chance to win. Ramo has been playing well for over a week, you can't just take away a start.

Plus, Treliving's mantra is "you can't over-season guys in the AHL" so why did Ramo hit waivers before Ortio?

Literally nobody has said Ortio is 'awesome'.

I think people just want to see him get a sniff of a chance considering Ramo/Hiller aren't long for this team and they seem to get every opportunity to fail, despite the fact that neither has any upside whatsoever.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

All good points, and here's the crux of it. People think Hartley is holding Ortio back and he's awesome. Could be true. The Flames could be further ahead if he started more games. The coaching staff goes with the goalie who gives them the best chance to win. Ramo has been playing well for over a week, you can't just take away a start.

Plus, Treliving's mantra is "you can't over-season guys in the AHL" so why did Ramo hit waivers before Ortio?

Simple - the answer is waivers.

Yes, 'earned not given', but you need to factor-in waivers as well. Some guys take a bit longer, some guys need a bit longer leash. It isn't always just a blind application of this mantra. The Flames may very well end up waiving Ortio, but you can be sure they would not want him claimed.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

Literally nobody has said Ortio is 'awesome'.

I think people just want to see him get a sniff of a chance considering Ramo/Hiller aren't long for this team and they seem to get every opportunity to fail, despite the fact that neither has any upside whatsoever.

If Ortio wins either of his two starts, he probably gets another one. That's not unfair to say either. He didn't play well vs. Montreal. Then effing Byron puts up 2 points off waivers. Wiese gets a hat trick.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

If Ortio wins either of his two starts, he probably gets another one. That's not unfair to say either. He didn't play well vs. Montreal. Then effing Byron puts up 2 points off waivers. Wiese gets a hat trick.

Ortio gets two starts against two of the best teams in the league and predictably struggles after rusting away on the bench for a month. Now he is seemingly dead to Hartley.

Ramo and Hiller get to stumble and bumble against bad and good teams and it's all good.

Ortio is either letting in every other shot in practice or there is a double standard IMO.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

Ortio gets two starts against two of the best teams in the league and predictably struggles after rusting away on the bench for a month. Now he is seemingly dead to Hartley.

Ramo and Hiller get to stumble and bumble against bad and good teams and it's all good.

Ortio is either letting in every other shot in practice or there is a double standard IMO.

That's what I was asking earlier. What games should Ortio have started? Hartley had 3 goalies to go through. Hiller won game 2, so he starts again. List some games.

I guess it's a fair opinion to think a coach is letting him rust, vs. a GM creating a logjam at the position. Regardless of your thoughts of Ramo "stumbling and bumbling" he's been winning games recently.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

That's what I was asking earlier. What games should Ortio have started? Hartley had 3 goalies to go through. Hiller won game 2, so he starts again. List some games.

I guess it's a fair opinion to think a coach is letting him rust, vs. a GM creating a logjam at the position. Regardless of your thoughts of Ramo "stumbling and bumbling" he's been winning games recently.

Recently Ramo has been playing well but only after he blew it many, many times. Certainly more than Ortio's two measly games.

I don't feel like going back and listing specific games but it is obvious to me that Ramo was given time to find his game while Ortio got iced rather quickly.

There is no log jam at the moment. When Hartley choose to hitch his wagon to Ramo, there was no clear reason why as he was playing like garbage at the time. He played badly for 3-5 games after Ortio's last game too so it wasn't like he was going with the hot hand.

There is no reason to think that had Ortio been afforded the same chance, that he wouldn't of found his game as well. He never got the chance though.

Regardless of how Ramo is playing now, there is no question that the Flames have handled their goalie situation this year as badly as any team I can remember in all my years of watching hockey.

At the end of the year, if/when we miss the playoffs... what was the point? Both Ramo and Hiller will be gone and Ortio will probably be going back to Europe or on some other team. I just don't see the strategy I guess is what I'm saying. Ortio has a chance to be something but Hartley would rather run with guys who will never win anything and are both likely done in the NHL within 1-2 years.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

That's what I was asking earlier. What games should Ortio have started?

More specifically, he could have started ANY of the games Ramo did after Hiller went down. You'd have to ask Hartley why he decided to throw Ortio to the wolves against two of the best teams in the league after limited practice time and no game action. Pretty much put him in a position to fail if you ask me.

[Armchair Quarterback]

Did he say anything in the interview about:

1) Hamilton?
2) The three-headed goalie monster?

[Strange Brew]

Anyone that claims Ortio needs to keep him on the big club all year. Hard to imagine a team that had worse goaltending than the Flames this year so I don't know how he gets claimed. If he does and plays better than what we have, then.... Yikes. Shame on us.

Trade for him for whatever you can get I say. Some people claimed they wouldn't take a 2nd round pick for him at start of the year. I think you are lucky to get a 5th. He is Drew Shore value.

[adc]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

That's what I was asking earlier. What games should Ortio have started?

Any game Ramo started.

There is zero reason Ramo should have played, or should continue to play, a single game for us this year.

[Armchair Quarterback]

Originally Posted by adc

Any game Ramo started.

There is zero reason Ramo should have played, or should continue to play, a single game for us this year.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Anyone that claims Ortio needs to keep him on the big club all year. Hard to imagine a team that had worse goaltending than the Flames this year so I don't know how he gets claimed. If he does and plays better than what we have, then.... Yikes. Shame on us.

Trade for him for whatever you can get I say. Some people claimed they wouldn't take a 2nd round pick for him at start of the year. I think you are lucky to get a 5th. He is Drew Shore value.

There literally is no team in the NHL with worse goaltending than the Flames. It really is the Achilles heel right now.

[Harry Lime]

Ramo is having success now because he has played enough to get into a groove. It wouldn't surprise me if Ortio did really well after being given the ball for a while. The three goalie situation coupled with the inability to string wins together, as a team, has really cost the goaltending. I think Hiller is the least likely to be picked up on waivers, at this very moment. I think that Ortio is still the most likely.

[868904]

I can't see the Flames sending Ortio down and risk losing him and the issue isn't so much that Ortio is some great goalie prospect, the bigger issue is that Ramo and Hiller are UFA and if they lose Ortio too, they would have Jon Gillies as the only goaltender under contract next season.

Yes it would probably be pretty easy to sign any old veteran goalie (Ramo would probably re-sign, but Hiller would probably say no after what he had to go through this year), but you don't want to leave your team that exposed.

From a Flames perspective, I really see no problem with sending Hiller and . or Ramo up and down. Best goalie plays as the starter in Calgary. The other guy works on his game in Stockton. Ortio is the backup in the NHL.

If some team claims either Ramo or Hiller, then problem solved.