[PGT] Game of Ghouls: Habs murder Flames 6-2

[theoforever]

I thought Flames were the better team for the first 40 minutes.
But 2 shots 2 goals, 5 shots 3 goals and you get the picture.
Terrible goaltending and terrible giveaways that led to goals.

If you compare last year to this year, we have longer stretches of dominance in the opposition zone, but unlike last year those don't lead to goals. Instead the other team gets the puck and goes the other way, and we know what happens.

Last year a lot of goals came in as the 3rd or 4th man would enter the zone with speed, it looks like other teams are making concentrated effort to be on top of those guys and take that play away.

[dirk diggler]

Basically the Flames have now turned into the Oilers of the past few years... there skill players arent getting it done, their d coverage is beyond horrible and the goalie cant stop a beach ball... I just get the feeling that once they tie or take the lead, then within 5 minutes they will get scored on... they are now the Oilers of years gone by

[Bonecrushing Hits]

Originally Posted by dirk diggler

Basically the Flames have now turned into the Oilers of the past few years... there skill players arent getting it done, their d coverage is beyond horrible and the goalie cant stop a beach ball... I just get the feeling that once they tie or take the lead, then within 5 minutes they will get scored on... they are now the Oilers of years gone by

No, Sir, they are not. Don't ever suggest that again.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Just to clarify he's not employed by the Flames and he's not a fan boy. False assumptions

He may as well be employed by the Flames. The organization holds the power of radio rights over the Fan960 and know full well the radio station would die if they decided to pull their support.

As such a lot of the personalities on the air temper their criticism of the organization substantially if you need proof, look no further than how any of the broadcasters conduct themselves around Ken King. They interview him like they are a bunch of scared puppies.

[Enoch Root]

There have been plenty of problems this year and, for the first handful of games, you could weight them all more or less equally.

However, for the last 4 games, the goaltending has destroyed what were solid, and somewhat more promising, efforts from the team for the first half of the game.

Soft goals happen. Bad games from the goalie happen, just as all players have bad games. And when it does, you'll usually see a good team rally to try and overcome it.

But when it happens all the time, it becomes demoralizing. And once a team starts to lose confidence, they have no chance in a league as competitive as the NHL.

In the last two games in particular, the Flames were clearly the better team in the 2nd period and in both cases, the goalie (Hiller then Ortio) gave up two goals on two shots that changed the game. In in both cases, they were shots that could have been saved. Last night the goal in the first was beyond brutal. The Flames were clearly the better team and had substantially more scoring chances than the Habs. But one bad defensive play and they're down 4-2.

Again, these things happen and good teams overcome. But when it keeps happening, it's a disease that eats at a team.

Yes, the defense has been bad as well. But the thing is, every team has defensive breakdowns, they just become infinitely more noticeable when it leads to a goal.

And right now, pretty much every one leads to a goal. That destroys a team's confidence. Offensively as well as defensively. It is impossible to play well when you are worried that every mistake will end up in your net.

Until they start to get goaltending that they can count on, things will continue to get worse.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

He may as well be employed by the Flames. The organization holds the power of radio rights over the Fan960 and know full well the radio station would die if they decided to pull their support.

As such a lot of the personalities on the air temper their criticism of the organization substantially if you need proof, look no further than how any of the broadcasters conduct themselves around Ken King. They interview him like they are a bunch of scared puppies.

That's about maintaining a relationship so that he'll come on again. You can't be combative and expect to get the person again.

[habernac]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

I'm blaming the goalies.

There are two teams with save percentages in .860s - Calgary and Columbus. You give this team every bad goaltending (instead of completely awful) and they'd have 2-3 more wins.

This. I'm a huge Habs fan, and two of three Weise goals should be stopped by bantam goalies.

[habernac]

I'm still smiling about Paul Byron. Not bad for having a defenseman draped on him. Maybe he needs to let the defenders catch up to him a little more so he can score on those breakaways.

[The Familia]

This team is worse than any of the "young gun" teams. The season is over and it has barely begun. Looks like a lot of players took their new fat contracts and decided not to give a ####. The only thing keeping me interested in hockey this year is watching the Oilers and Canucks hopefully miss the playoffs.

[Roof-Daddy]

This team wasn't as good as it appeared they were last season, and this team isn't as bad as they appear so far this season IMO.

[N-E-B]

Originally Posted by The Familia

This team is worse than any of the "young gun" teams. The season is over and it has barely begun. Looks like a lot of players took their new fat contracts and decided not to give a ####. The only thing keeping me interested in hockey this year is watching the Oilers and Canucks hopefully miss the playoffs.

Maybe you should go back and watch the Young Guns, because I disagree completely.

[adc]

I am not sure I get the "don't care" or "are happy with their fat contracts" comments.

I don't see a team that isn't trying or losing because a lack of effort it seems much more of a lack of talent or smarts.

Russell and Wideman are trying out there they are just not very good defensively. The forwards are skating hard they just aren't very offensively talented so goals are hard to come by.

There is plenty of effort but effort losing out 9 times out of 10 to talent.

[Wormius]

Except when have you seen a player get a fat contract and perform well the next season? Has that happened on the Flames?

[Jables16]

To echo the sentiments of some earlier posters I feel like a lot of these issues stem from poor goaltending. That being said I also feel that a lot of the issues with goaltending have been due to the three goalie approach that started the year. In 14-15 the "win and you're in" approach seemed to work because it was a clear tandem of two guys. You knew if you lost it was likely the other guy would start but you knew there'd be a chance to redeem yourself, the fairly even split was probably good for both guys physically, and they were there to motivate each other rather than try and beat the other guy out.

This year their mentality would have been "win and you could be out of a job". I get that these guys are professional athletes and expected to shoulder great deal of pressure but when it's hard enough to stop the puck in the context of winning that particular hockey game without having in the back of your mind "I might be in the press box for the next month or in the AHL". The more you become terrified of making a mistake the more likely it is to happen and the lack of confidence goes from the net out affecting everyone.

I think Treliving has to wear the goat horns on this one. There was a clear succession plan of Ramo walking, Hiller being the #1 and Ortio coming to the NHL full time as the back-up but I think he really just panicked because of Hiller's play in Game 6 vs. VAN and Game 1 vs. ANA, neither of which were entirely his fault. Maybe he was sure there was a trade to be had somewhere in the off-season but he didn't get that done either.

Now he has a much bigger mess on his hands and no clear solution. Don't get me wrong I really like a lot of the things Brad has done and really doubt he's going anywhere anytime soon but this is his first big challenge as GM and will go a long way in seeing what we really have here.

I feel like tonight's game has the potential to be a turning point for the season. There should be no shortage of motivation to bring it to the Oilers after what they did to the Flames on home ice, and the non-stop talk of McDavid, and the Flames regression. If they can pull it all together tonight and have a statement game that could be the start of something. If not, well we could be in for another looooong season.

[Jing]

Originally Posted by MisterJoji

Gio-Brodie (Brodie more so than Gio) = good
Engelland-Hamilton = average
Wideman-Russell = so so so so so so so bad (Russell more so than Wideman)

Totally agree, I cringe every time Wideman and Russell hit the ice.

[adc]

Originally Posted by Wormius

Except when have you seen a player get a fat contract and perform well the next season? Has that happened on the Flames?

Kane and Toews seem to be playing well this year. I imagine Habs fans are happy with Subbans play so far.

Crosby and Malkin have been pretty good since their deals were signed.

Price signed a big deal two years ago I think and he has been alright since then.

I am not really sure if there are other examples of guys who signed big deals these are the guys that come to my mind immediately.

As for the Flames I found Iginla was pretty good and he signed some big deals.

[crapshoot]

Originally Posted by habernac

I'm still smiling about Paul Byron. Not bad for having a defenseman draped on him. Maybe he needs to let the defenders catch up to him a little more so he can score on those breakaways.

That's one of the plays of yesterdays game I'm actually a bit happy about. Good for Paul, and I hope that it keeps him in the lineup. Still wish he could have buried a few like that while he were still with us though.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Steinberg is usually pretty good at his job, but he does lose it.

I don't much mind when he loses it with the obvious overly-drunk callers, or just the idiots who call in just to get a rise or are just plain obnoxious.

It bugs me that he sometimes talks-down to people who have a differing viewpoint or opinion than what he has, even if they are making an effort to form a well thought out argument in support of their differing opinions.

A good example of this would often happen while Brent Sutter was coaching. People called in and stated that they thought the Flames should adopt a system that relied on scoring off the rush. He would parrot what Feaster and Sutter kept saying at the time - that the team was not talented enough to score off the rush.

That team was not talented enough offensively, so it wasn't completely wrong. However, that team was the oldest (or one of the oldest) and the smallest in the NHL at the time. A system where you generate offence off the cycle was probably worse. As people would try and argue their points, he would just talk down to them and often end the call while just insisting that the team couldn't score off the rush. It always bugged me how he did that to callers who weren't simply drunk or being obnoxious.

He is usually pretty good, and hosting a show like that I can't imagine would be easy. Just needs to allow the callers who actually are trying to make well-formed arguments the opportunity to get them out rather than shooting them down. I can definitely understand that after 'x' amount of obnoxious, combative callers, one just loses the patience to keep a more unbiased and professional state. I know I couldn't do it.

However, the above just matters if the show is trying to be a real platform for fans to voice their opinions. If it is just a platform for some witty banter like some other call-in shows are, then there is no problem at all.

And yes, I would expect everyone on the Fan960 to be 'easy' on Flames' management and players. I would expect them to be easy on even the Oilers' personnel too. Why? Who would ever agree to go on a show where there exists a very real possibility of looking stupid and having a really hard time with the tough questions that the host is known for confronting their guests with? Not only do you not get repeat guests, but loads of other potential guests would take notice and never agree to come on the show to begin with. That is just how things work.

[dammage79]

You can definitely notice a difference in Steinberg these days. I've actually stopped streaming the Fan during the afternoons because he's been getting... what is it? Too full of himself? Arrogant? Condescending? Arrogant and Condescending are too strong of words.

Stuffy, smug. Vancouver Canuck-y. Yep.

Anyways, as Fans we're losing our minds because we've all seen first hand what this team can do, they just aren't doing it. It's mind boggling and frustrating. Working call in shows when the team is playing the way it is, is not an easy endeavour, but calmer heads must prevail.

As old Bryzgalov would say , and this is for all of us in these dark times:

[mikeecho]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

Steinberg is usually pretty good at his job, but he does lose it.

I don't much mind when he loses it with the obvious overly-drunk callers, or just the idiots who call in just to get a rise or are just plain obnoxious.

It bugs me that he sometimes talks-down to people who have a differing viewpoint or opinion than what he has, even if they are making an effort to form a well thought out argument in support of their differing opinions.

A good example of this would often happen while Brent Sutter was coaching. People called in and stated that they thought the Flames should adopt a system that relied on scoring off the rush. He would parrot what Feaster and Sutter kept saying at the time - that the team was not talented enough to score off the rush.

That team was not talented enough offensively, so it wasn't completely wrong. However, that team was the oldest (or one of the oldest) and the smallest in the NHL at the time. A system where you generate offence off the cycle was probably worse. As people would try and argue their points, he would just talk down to them and often end the call while just insisting that the team couldn't score off the rush. It always bugged me how he did that to callers who weren't simply drunk or being obnoxious.

He is usually pretty good, and hosting a show like that I can't imagine would be easy. Just needs to allow the callers who actually are trying to make well-formed arguments the opportunity to get them out rather than shooting them down. I can definitely understand that after 'x' amount of obnoxious, combative callers, one just loses the patience to keep a more unbiased and professional state. I know I couldn't do it.

However, the above just matters if the show is trying to be a real platform for fans to voice their opinions. If it is just a platform for some witty banter like some other call-in shows are, then there is no problem at all.

And yes, I would expect everyone on the Fan960 to be 'easy' on Flames' management and players. I would expect them to be easy on even the Oilers' personnel too. Why? Who would ever agree to go on a show where there exists a very real possibility of looking stupid and having a really hard time with the tough questions that the host is known for confronting their guests with? Not only do you not get repeat guests, but loads of other potential guests would take notice and never agree to come on the show to begin with. That is just how things work.

The "overtime" show needs to be gassed for the regular season and bring it back for the playoffs like how it originally evolved.

60% of the callers are either drunk, have comments about the game and later reveal they didn't actually watch it, propose something stupid, etc... All that for the 10% of callers who add something intelligent or the remaining 30% who just state the obvious (yeah Pat, the goal tending just wasn't good enough tonight). I get that people like to have an avenue to share their feelings, but really... phone a friend or just go to sleep.

I don't blame Pat at all for getting short with people who call in and say "The Flames should have traded for a #1 goalie in the summer" and then sit silent when asked which #1 the Flames could have traded for or the "we should have saved that #1 draft pick from the Hamilton trade and drafted a goalie that could jump in right now and save the day."

It's tough to listen to and I'm sure it's hell for anyone who has the duty to host the show.