Spector: Kris Russell would net a 2nd line forward for sure - Page 6 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

SuperMatt18 · 10-26-2015, 10:15 AM

I could see Hamilton being a little lost in his own zone due to the systems change.

Under Julien the Bruins play a very structured system, especially in the defensive zone, with lots of support from the wingers and centers helping the d-men down low.

A system like that really helps the d-men in their own zone. It is harder for forwards - Seguin struggled with it - because it is very demanding.

The Flames play less structured in their own zone, and more aggressively move the puck and try to play with pace. Even with forwards fleeing the zone a little early a times.

I would say that Hamilton is struggling with this system, and looks bad because he is not being as protected protected by playing with strong defensive centers like Krecji and Bergeron in Boston.

Hamilton's top linemates last year were: Zdeno Chara, Patrice Bergeron, Brad Marchand. & Rielly Smith. That is pretty good company to have on the ice with you and to help protect you in the defensive zone.

sureLoss · 10-26-2015, 10:17 AM

Hamilton is approaching permanent whipping boy status. Pretty soon any good he does will be overlooked and every mistake he makes will be magnified and criticized.

Tough gig for a young player.

mennoknight · 10-26-2015, 10:20 AM

lord jesus...I'll just stop visiting these forums and come back in 10 games. A lot of dudes here need to take some advice from Mr. Freeze and *arnold voice* chill out.

Finger Cookin · 10-26-2015, 10:22 AM

Russell might get even more money than Tanev. He's made even more great saves!

ricardodw · 10-26-2015, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Disagree with this post. I feel the Flames only have 4 legit top 6 forwards today (Monahan, Gaudreau, Hudler, Frolik) I hope Bennett gets there but that remains to be seen.

This team does have 5 top 4 D and our #2 has been missing all year. You say we need defense well Brodie is retuning. There are no top 6 forwards retuning to this team any time soon

Not a lot of teams where Frolik is top-6. On his old team the 3rd line is Stafford-Lowry-Burmistrov.... He would be arguably better than Burmistrov.

Stafford has 5 goals 7 pts in his first 8 games. the Jets signed him for 2 years a teh same salary as the Flames gave Frolik for 5.

Flames need Backlund and Colborne and Bennett to play like a second line.

Fire of the Phoenix · 10-26-2015, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricardodw

another 8 equivalent games from Hamilton and the Flames are out of the 2015-16 playoffs.

Chances are that Hamilton's ice time get cut to less than 15 when Brodie returns. Hartley has seen the same thing as I (and anyone watching the games) and Hamilton , not Russell or Wideman is the guy losing ice time.

Why did Boston not sign him for basically the money and term that he got from the Flames??

They would have had the best evaluations of his abilities and were not going to sign him. They decided they would rather sign Krug on a 3.4M 1 year deal than Hamilton long term. Ie it wasn't because they couldn't find cap space.

The playoffs probably aren't happening this year, regardless of anything Hamilton does or doesn't do. It might be time to start looking at the team (and Hamilton) though a different lens.

Fire of the Phoenix · 10-26-2015, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Hamilton is approaching permanent whipping boy status. Pretty soon any good he does will be overlooked and every mistake he makes will be magnified and criticized.

Tough gig for a young player.

Yeah, it's pretty disappointing that the fan base is acting like this. Can't say I blame guys that would rather play in Tampa or San Jose over teams in markets like ours. Not only is the weather better, but they don't have fans foaming at the mouth to see them catapulted into the sun when expectations don't line up with reality immediately. Garbage like this is a direct contributing factor as to why a Canadian team hasn't won a Stanley Cup in 22 years.

Vinny01 · 10-26-2015, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Not a lot of teams where Frolik is top-6. On his old team the 3rd line is Stafford-Lowry-Burmistrov.... He would be arguably better than Burmistrov.

Stafford has 5 goals 7 pts in his first 8 games. the Jets signed him for 2 years a teh same salary as the Flames gave Frolik for 5.

Flames need Backlund and Colborne and Bennett to play like a second line.

Frolik scored 42 points 2 years in a row (25-26 years old) if he can put those numbers up again that is decent second line production. So far he has 4pts in 8 games with limited pp time so he is on pace for the same numbers. A half point a game is decent second line production. Your Stafford sample size is irrelevant until he does it over a full season. Your small sample sizes and weird logic always make it frustrating to debate with you. Frolik is better offensively and Colborne or Backlund and should be a fixture on the second line. Bennett should be there but is slow out the gate. The Flames need a second line winger that can score badly if they are going to get some secondary scoring. Hopefully it comes internally but if not they need to make a deal

Fire of the Phoenix · 10-26-2015, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I could see Hamilton being a little lost in his own zone due to the systems change.

Under Julien the Bruins play a very structured system, especially in the defensive zone, with lots of support from the wingers and centers helping the d-men down low.

A system like that really helps the d-men in their own zone. It is harder for forwards - Seguin struggled with it - because it is very demanding.

The Flames play less structured in their own zone, and more aggressively move the puck and try to play with pace. Even with forwards fleeing the zone a little early a times.

I would say that Hamilton is struggling with this system, and looks bad because he is not being as protected protected by playing with strong defensive centers like Krecji and Bergeron in Boston.

Hamilton's top linemates last year were: Zdeno Chara, Patrice Bergeron, Brad Marchand. & Rielly Smith. That is pretty good company to have on the ice with you and to help protect you in the defensive zone.

I don't think the Flames 'system' is one that will work long term to be honest. It looks to be easy to adapt to and you don't exactly see a lot of teams playing the way we do. There's no doubt in my mind that as the team develops and better players come along, the system will evolve/change. Hamilton looks totally lost in our system right now, it doesn't mean he's a bad player or will struggle forever. It might be time for Hartley to make some adjustments, the rest of the league clearly already has.

GoJetsGo · 10-26-2015, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Why did Boston not sign him for basically the money and term that he got from the Flames??

They would have had the best evaluations of his abilities and were not going to sign him. They decided they would rather sign Krug on a 3.4M 1 year deal than Hamilton long term. Ie it wasn't because they couldn't find cap space.

It's painful reading your ramblings.

What part of this is difficult for you to understand: Boston DID want to sign him to a deal similar to what the Flames ended up at, but Hamilton didn't want to sigh with Boston.

So by all means, keep up your tunnel-vision ignorant hating, but don't use outright lies to try and support your drivel.

Street Pharmacist · 10-26-2015, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Not a lot of teams where Frolik is top-6. On his old team the 3rd line is Stafford-Lowry-Burmistrov.... He would be arguably better than Burmistrov.

Stafford has 5 goals 7 pts in his first 8 games. the Jets signed him for 2 years a teh same salary as the Flames gave Frolik for 5.

Flames need Backlund and Colborne and Bennett to play like a second line.

Jesus man. Your logic is painful

Phanuthier · 10-26-2015, 11:16 AM

holy crap guys, how did you let troll bait you guys so easily? the last 3 pages are a #### show.

Poe969 · 10-26-2015, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Jesus man. Your logic is painful

Shows what you know, Ricardow doesn't need to use logic!

This team can't score enough. A shakeup needs to be made at some point weather it's a D for a second line player or something big like that Stamkos rumor that would give us a skilled player to play on the top 2 lines and spread out the skill more. So far we have Johnny and to a lesser extent Monahan as our skilled players and then we have.....

So it's clear that we need more actual skill and less "grit". We still need grit but the thing is, skill and grit don't have to come from different players. This team is on the smaller side and can't stand up against big teams and they're not skilled enough to match up against the more skilled teams.

The Flames need to do something soon.

Macho0978 · 10-26-2015, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robaur

Have you not watched the games? Flames are in dire need of scoring depth. We only go as far as Gaudreau/Monahan/Hudler take us right now.

I agree. As bad as the d has look the guys we got need to start to play better. On other hand our forwards are a concern. We have 16 goals and Gaudreau has 10 points. Frolik is the only non first line player that is chipping in. We are getting nothing out of Backlund, Bennett, Jooris, Stajan, Raymond. Since Colborne has been back he has looked good and Bennett is just not finishing could start to play better but others on that list aren't exactly reliable to help a team that has issues with scoring

When Brodie comes back our d will look and hopefully play a ton better. If we can land a top 6 forward for Russell it would balance the team out alot better

sureLoss · 10-27-2015, 01:17 PM

Chris Nichols @NicholsOnHockey
Dreger: "Brad Treliving is making his calls and he's listening to those w/ interest." Wideman's, Russell's names are out there. #Flames 1/2

Chris Nichols @NicholsOnHockey
Dreger: “But I don't believe for a second Treliving has any interest in trading Russell." Believe #Flames want to sign/extend him. 2/2

Ashasx · 10-27-2015, 01:22 PM

Brad just trying to raise the price for Russell.

Harder to trade for a player that a team wants to keep.

JiriHrdina · 10-27-2015, 01:40 PM

I bet Plan A is traded Wideman, sign Russel
Plan B is trade Russel

Wonder what the plans are like for Hudler. No whispers of any extension talk from what I've heard. I think they know they will move on from him, and he will be dealt this season.

442scotty · 10-27-2015, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Brad just trying to raise the price for Russell.

Harder to trade for a player that a team wants to keep.

Absolutely!!!

Badgers Nose · 10-27-2015, 08:30 PM

This is a good time to get rid of both Russell and Wideman.

Wideman because there is demand and you might be able to get all his dollars off the books.

Russell because of his rep in the league, and the good probability of getting a solid forward in return.

I'll add to the chorus, we have nice D prospects knocking on the door. If this is going to be a development year (looks like it) might as well start investing in next year.

Badgers Nose · 10-27-2015, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

I bet Plan A is traded Wideman, sign Russel
Plan B is trade Russel

Wonder what the plans are like for Hudler. No whispers of any extension talk from what I've heard. I think they know they will move on from him, and he will be dealt this season.

Maybe once they move Russell for a good forward, Hudler will go.