What career would you suggest?

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Here are some rough numbers on my understanding of pensions. Will you please correct me if I'm wrong?

I've understood you will receive 70% (or is it 80%) of the average of your last five years in your job. Principals make around $125K in Calgary (I think, although maybe it's more like $140k). That means when you retire after 30 years (assume you started teaching at 23, so at 53 you work your last day), you would make $87,500 per year (adjusted for inflation, too) from 53 to around 90 (assuming that's when you die). That's a value of $3.2 million in today's dollars. On top of that, it's also my understanding that you will have full medical and dental benefits during that time, which also has a high monetary value. Finally, this pension is bulletproof since it's backed by the taxpayers. If it's underfunded, the taxpayers will top it off.

That, to me, sounds like a guaranteed stress-free retirement. You will never have to worry about money. Never have to worry about medical or dental care. Never have to watch the stock market. Never have to meet with your financial advisor and discuss going back to work. It's amazing. Am I wrong on any of that?

Lots wrong here. 70% pay is the maximum, but that's only achievable if you put in 35+ years of pensionable service or wait age 65 to retire. If you retire early or don't have enough years of service (often the case with people who sub for years or women who've gone on maternity leave during their career) you see a reduction in that number. And extended medical and dental coverage certainly isn't free. You're looking at another $400 or so a month for that once you hit 65.

And it's not like that's free money. Teachers have 13-14% of their gross salary deducted to fund the pension every year.

[DownhillGoat]

Originally Posted by wooohooo

I thought something like respiratory therapy where he could do a 2-3 year diploma at NAIT would be better than the 4-5 years of hell an engineer does with no certain job market. Or am I completely out to lunch? Anything else out that that's a good job that we don't know about?

NAIT? So he's in the Edmonton area already?

Has he looked at power engineering at all?

[northcrunk]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

I can't help but think that any career in health should be pretty good and very portable.

Would he consider doing porn?

They really need them in Japan. I heard somewhere that there are only maybe 1000 male actors to the 100,000 female actors.

[NuclearFart]

Originally Posted by northcrunk

They really need them in Japan. I heard somewhere that there are only maybe 1000 male actors to the 100,000 female actors.

I heard you need a heavily pixelated penis to work over there.

[blueski]

Originally Posted by northcrunk

They really need them in Japan. I heard somewhere that there are only maybe 1000 male actors to the 100,000 female actors.

Then there's Ed Houben, aka the babymaker. I think he works for free though.
http://www.gq.com/story/how-to-have-...onor-ed-houben

[Sainters7]

Originally Posted by Sliver

There isn't a teacher in the world that puts "hours" of prep into every lecture. That's ridiculous. Also, I'm not talking about being a teacher in Compton. I'm pretty sure no teacher is being f-bombed in my kid's grade four class.

Haha geez, what is with you and teachers man? I like ya but I really don't get the hate. That's like me saying no-one in O&G has ever seriously prepped for a big meeting before. Wat?

I'd say the average teacher, especially a newer one with no lesson plans to rely on, especially in a subject like SS and the need to be current, will spend around 4-5hrs when they get home, prepping for a couple different classes the next day, and marking. Plus probably on average around another hour emailing back and forth with helicopter parents. It's way more work than it probably appears to the average high school kid who knows everything about everything.

Are grade 4 kids in your daughter's class F-bombing their teacher? Probably not. Will it happen by the time she's in JH or HS? Ohh probably...


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[Mr.Coffee]

exactly, with respect to Sliver and the teaching thing you're just so over the top with this stuff. Again I can't believe I'm coming to the defense of teachers here but are there other stresses with kids in grade 4? Yes, are the F bombs occurring at older grades? Yes, my best friend is a teacher, he has told me some pretty crazy stories. Quite frankly, it is terrifying to me what he's had to deal with.

And definitely early in the career lesson plans are chewing into teachers' time and there are multiple hours going into that work, I've heard that from various different sources and people so fairly confident it is part of the gig. Especially since the curriculum changes or is adjusted as time goes on.

Oh yeah then there's dealing with parents like you who I presume are extremely judgey when you run off to parent teacher interviews with all the answers.

[JohnnyB]

Teaching can be an extremely rewarding profession, but I don't think anyone should go into it as just a job. It is best approached as a calling or a vocation. If a person embraces the moral value of their work in education it can all be very worthwhile, but if someone sees it as only a source of stable income they will probably end up not being very good at their work and not really enjoying their work.

[FacePaint]

There are free career planning workshops offered by the government that he can attend. It will do some interest and values testing, as well as examine occupational trends and other labour market information. The facilitator can also help research what education might be required and what funding might be available. That should help him answer a lot of questions.

[Deegee]

Personally, the only thing that bothers me about your stereotypical teacher is the whining they do about all the prep and extra time they put in. I just feel it's a bit much given the research they can do prior to entering the field and the amount of other professions that require extra time put in without the compensation of generous holiday time.

However, I've always been a believer that if you're not happy somewhere you should look to be moving instead of complaining.

[blueski]

I'm teaching guys from India how to do my job right now and I have to agree, there are a lot of billable preparation hours. Hundreds...

[LChoy]

My 2 cents, but there will be an increasing need for people to get into Long term care management and senior health.
While your brother doesn't have to go back to school to get a medical degree, if he can get a certificate in health care management, social work, or even a nursing degree, there will be plenty of opportunity for a stable career working in long term care homes, NGO health care organizations, the public service...etc

However, the desire to take care of people should be there, as it's not the right job if simply chasing a paycheck or stability

LChoy

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by Deegee

Personally, the only thing that bothers me about your stereotypical teacher is the whining they do about all the prep and extra time they put in. I just feel it's a bit much given the research they can do prior to entering the field and the amount of other professions that require extra time put in without the compensation of generous holiday time.

However, I've always been a believer that if you're not happy somewhere you should look to be moving instead of complaining.

As someone who knows a fair number of teachers, I don't know if I've ever heard any of the ones I know complain about the time they have to put in for prep and marking unless it's simply in response to someone talking about how nice it must be to work 5-6 hour days. They know it's part of their job.

It's also important to highlight that for anyone considering the profession. If someone goes into it thinking they'll be working 30 hours a week 9 months a year, they're going to be in for a surprise. On the other hand if they're suited for the job and are prepared to put in 45-50 hours a week in return for long vacation time then it can be a great career that's virtually immune from market forces.

[WilsonFourTwo]

Teachers work the same 1800-2000 hours per year as everyone else, it just gets compressed into 8-9 months. Suggesting it's a cushy career is ignorant. It's a good career, it's a challenging career, and it has it's perks, but that could be said for just about any career....

[chedder]

Originally Posted by WilsonFourTwo

Teachers work the same 1800-2000 hours per year as everyone else, it just gets compressed into 8-9 months. Suggesting it's a cushy career is ignorant. It's a good career, it's a challenging career, and it has it's perks, but that could be said for just about any career....

Not to continue the teacher bashing but I know many and the math in this post equates to working 11 hours a day for 9 months (5 day weeks). I don't know a single teacher that would average that. 4 plus hours every day outside of school hours is a bit of a stretch. That said, who cares if they work a bit less time wise than others. It can be a tough and stressful job that I'm happy others want to do. You could'nt pay me enough or give me enough time off to make me deal with other people's kids day in and day out.

[GGG]

Now that this thread is sufficiently derailed there is something that always bugged me about this prep time problem.

If so much time is spent on prep why isn't there pre-planned lessons that you just download from the internet. Why does every teacher try to re-invent the wheel when they start. If I were a school board I would have an archive of go-bys and pre-made plans that were developed over time to hand to every teacher for every subject.

It seems like poor management to have every teacher spend so many hours preparing lesson plans. And just from a quality standpoint you would rather have the best ones be used in the future rather than the average ones. You also want continuous improvement rather than each teacher facing the same problems over and over again.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by troutman

My Dad always said don't make your hobby your job. You will end up hating your hobby.

I'm not sure he is right. I think being a fly-fishing guide, professional musician or astronaut would be kind of awesome.

You're a 'hobby astronaut?' Where do I sign up for that?

Originally Posted by Sainters7

Haha geez, what is with you and teachers man? I like ya but I really don't get the hate. That's like me saying no-one in O&G has ever seriously prepped for a big meeting before. Wat?

I'd say the average teacher, especially a newer one with no lesson plans to rely on, especially in a subject like SS and the need to be current, will spend around 4-5hrs when they get home, prepping for a couple different classes the next day, and marking. Plus probably on average around another hour emailing back and forth with helicopter parents. It's way more work than it probably appears to the average high school kid who knows everything about everything.

Are grade 4 kids in your daughter's class F-bombing their teacher? Probably not. Will it happen by the time she's in JH or HS? Ohh probably...


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And so it should.

[Russic]

Originally Posted by GGG

Now that this thread is sufficiently derailed there is something that always bugged me about this prep time problem.

If so much time is spent on prep why isn't there pre-planned lessons that you just download from the internet. Why does every teacher try to re-invent the wheel when they start. If I were a school board I would have an archive of go-bys and pre-made plans that were developed over time to hand to every teacher for every subject.

It seems like poor management to have every teacher spend so many hours preparing lesson plans. And just from a quality standpoint you would rather have the best ones be used in the future rather than the average ones. You also want continuous improvement rather than each teacher facing the same problems over and over again.

Sometimes it's beyond their control. The administration can move the goalposts and change the curriculum. It's a huge complaint from older teachers who develop an efficient system. Also, what works for one class might not work for others, or you might find a better way to get something across that requires an overhaul.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by opendoor

Lots wrong here. 70% pay is the maximum, but that's only achievable if you put in 35+ years of pensionable service or wait age 65 to retire. If you retire early or don't have enough years of service (often the case with people who sub for years or women who've gone on maternity leave during their career) you see a reduction in that number.

Well, obviously. If you don't work the minimum requirement, you don't get the maximum benefit of the pension. That's not unique to teaching or something that needs to be pointed out as a negative aspect of the profession. If I decide to stop contributing to my retirement savings or work an abbreviated career, I'll have less in retirement saving as well. That's just basic math.

Originally Posted by opendoor

And extended medical and dental coverage certainly isn't free. You're looking at another $400 or so a month for that once you hit 65.

But it is better for teachers and subsidized by the taxpayer (in the case of shortfall). If it wasn't good value for the money, they would opt out. But none do. Because you can't get something better in the private sector. That is, they pay less than the monetary value of the benefit.

Originally Posted by opendoor

And it's not like that's free money. Teachers have 13-14% of their gross salary deducted to fund the pension every year.

Again, the fact that teachers have to save for retirement isn't something unique to teaching. We all have to save for retirement. You don't need to point out that they are contributing to their pension. Of course they are!

Where they are in a relatively unique position (along with other public-sector employees, I'd imagine), is if the stock market tanks, the taxpayers will backfill the underfunded portion. They're paying into something and getting a guaranteed return regardless of how poorly their investments may do. If the stock market tanks and my investments evaporate when I'm 75, I'm screwed as are most other people. Teachers will just keep getting the exact same cheque auto deposited into their account regardless of what is happening in the world around them. Why do you want to spin any of these perks into something negative? They're fantastic and should be pointed out as such.

Originally Posted by Sainters7

Haha geez, what is with you and teachers man? I like ya but I really don't get the hate. That's like me saying no-one in O&G has ever seriously prepped for a big meeting before. Wat?

Hate? I think it's the best profession in Canada. I tell any young person to consider it as a career if it would be a good fit for their personality. At 38 years old, I look around at my friends and the ones with the best gig in life are the teachers. Very good pay. Worry free retirement and retirement planning. Great benefits. Recession proof. Never need to worry about layoffs. Unreal benefits. Absolutely, positively incredible and unrivaled holiday time both in quantity and quality. By quality I mean two things:

1. Best times of year off (summer, x-mas, etc.)

1. It's uninterrupted. Most professionals that are relied upon in a company may need to be disturbed while on vacation and always have work waiting for them when they return and need to work like mad to get ahead enough to be able to take time off. Teachers have none of that so their vacation time comes with a lot of peace of mind that others don't have.

Originally Posted by Sainters7

I'd say the average teacher, especially a newer one with no lesson plans to rely on, especially in a subject like SS and the need to be current, will spend around 4-5hrs when they get home, prepping for a couple different classes the next day, and marking. Plus probably on average around another hour emailing back and forth with helicopter parents. It's way more work than it probably appears to the average high school kid who knows everything about everything.

You're wrong. Teachers don't spend 4-5 hours preparing lesson plans. It's absurd to even think that. Do they have to put in extra hours beyond 5.5 hours of teaching in a day? Of course they do. But that's not unique to teaching. There is the requirement for extra hours in every professional job ever.

Originally Posted by GGG

Now that this thread is sufficiently derailed there is something that always bugged me about this prep time problem.

If so much time is spent on prep why isn't there pre-planned lessons that you just download from the internet. Why does every teacher try to re-invent the wheel when they start. If I were a school board I would have an archive of go-bys and pre-made plans that were developed over time to hand to every teacher for every subject.

It seems like poor management to have every teacher spend so many hours preparing lesson plans. And just from a quality standpoint you would rather have the best ones be used in the future rather than the average ones. You also want continuous improvement rather than each teacher facing the same problems over and over again.

People really want to downplay how great a job teaching is on CP, and I don't understand why. GGG, teachers do use pre-made lesson plans. They don't reinvent the wheel for every class, every time. Ignore this nonsense and talk to a real teacher that will give you honest answers. I hang out with a few regularly. They know they have the best gig ever. They laugh at all of us all summer long for having to work (good naturedly). And at Christmas. And at 3:17 when they're on their way home and all of us have another hour or two to go in our days. And they're looking forward to retiring earlier than most people with wonderful pensions.

I really hope my kids get into teaching. If there's a job with better benefits out there, I haven't seen it yet.

[gladaki]

I know people doing great with degree from SAIT. I heard there infrastructure management course us good and people get place easily. Its 10 month course, better than spending 4 years in school again..