Alberta already has a 2 tiered system for minimum wage concerning restaurant workers, as there is an expectation that they would also make tips. I don't see why this can't continue. Does Seattle have a similar system, or is it 15$ across the board?
__________________
"By Grabthar's hammer ... what a savings."
Alberta already has a 2 tiered system for minimum wage concerning restaurant workers, as there is an expectation that they would also make tips. I don't see why this can't continue. Does Seattle have a similar system, or is it 15$ across the board?
Wait what? Servers are going to be making $15/hour plus tips? I have to change careers. Rumour has it, currently $300 in tips on a friday night isn't uncommon. Or are they going to be an exception to the $15 minimum wage?
Wait what? Servers are going to be making $15/hour plus tips? I have to change careers. Rumour has it, currently $300 in tips on a friday night isn't uncommon. Or are they going to be an exception to the $15 minimum wage?
Yes, everybody gets $15/hour by 2017. The tiers will be phased out over two years.
There is a great deal of people promoting the idea of a living wage and that we need to increase our minimum wage.
There is an equal number of people against this idea for a number of good reasons.
I have no idea who is right.
However, we now get to see a real experiment in action, from which we can study the effects with no negative effect to us. Hopefully a couple universities study the city and the positive and negative effects this experiment has on it as a whole. We can then use this test city as a foundation for our own provincial decisions in the future.
Obviously wage increases are very important. I am just not convinced this is the best way to go about things. As mentioned in a recent NP editorial, this will push some companies towards more automation of basic roles, eliminating the positions permanently.
Obviously wage increases are very important. I am just not convinced this is the best way to go about things. As mentioned in a recent NP editorial, this will push some companies towards more automation of basic roles, eliminating the positions permanently.
That likely would happen anyways. In todays world as the focus in all industries very much shifts towards the Lean Six Sigma mentality automation is the way to go not just for labor cost savings but for savings due to product quality issues.
That likely would happen anyways. In todays world as the focus in all industries very much shifts towards the Lean Six Sigma mentality automation is the way to go not just for labor cost savings but for savings due to product quality issues.
Yes, I completely agree. Automation of these low-level jobs, and some high-level jobs (hello accountants?) is already well underway.
Here's some excerpts, but I encourage you to read the whole thing.
Quote:
Well, trickle-downers, look at the data here: The two cities in the nation with the highest rate of job growth by small businesses are San Francisco and Seattle. Guess which cities have the highest minimum wage? San Francisco and Seattle. The fastest-growing big city in America? Seattle. Fifteen dollars isn’t a risky untried policy for us. It’s doubling down on the strategy that’s already allowing our city to kick your city’s ass.
Yes, Seattle and San Francisco have the highest rate of job growth by small businesses because of the higher minimum wage. No possible other correlation of any kind. Why not because they have the most homosexuals per capita or because of their proximity to the sea while we're grasping at completely unrelated trivia.
I will grant that his point about having people with more disposable income is a great thing, but he writes as though there is this limitless pool of capital, the money has to come from somewhere.
However, I'll contest his point about the specific, $15 minimum wage. There is usually a balance point, if your minimum wage is already 30% higher than the national then making it 50% higher might push the feasibility too far.
__________________ The Beatings Shall Continue Until Morale Improves!
This Post Has Been Distilled for the Eradication of Seemingly Incurable Sadness.
The World Ends when you're dead. Until then, you've got more punishment in store. - Flames Fans
If you thought this season would have a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention.
The Following User Says Thank You to Locke For This Useful Post:
So, I get that this video is old, but I just watched it, and had to comment about the ending. It's hilarious that the next car just pulls up right after the crazy (high?) lady burns rubber out of the drivethrough. If I had seen that from my car in the drive-through, my reaction wouldn't be, thank god she's gone so I can pull up and get my McDeal...
Yes, Seattle and San Francisco have the highest rate of job growth by small businesses because of the higher minimum wage. No possible other correlation of any kind. Why not because they have the most homosexuals per capita or because of their proximity to the sea while we're grasping at completely unrelated trivia.
The article does go on to say "Is this issue more complicated than I’m making out? Of course. Are there many factors at play determining the dynamics of employment? Yup. But please, please stop insisting that if we pay low-wage workers more, unemployment will skyrocket and it will destroy the economy." The latter is the heart of his point, I think. Not so much that a higher minimum wage guarantees a vibrant city. But that it doesn't guarantee economic ruin.
I could see it hurting small businesses, but the profit margins for some of the big corps are at all time levels. This has partially been accomplished by starving out labour for about a generation.
The article does go on to say "Is this issue more complicated than I’m making out? Of course. Are there many factors at play determining the dynamics of employment? Yup. But please, please stop insisting that if we pay low-wage workers more, unemployment will skyrocket and it will destroy the economy." The latter is the heart of his point, I think. Not so much that a higher minimum wage guarantees a vibrant city. But that it doesn't guarantee economic ruin.
I'm not disputing any of those points, it may not result in economic ruin but it may not guarantee their 'living wage' or whatever either.
Where I tend to argue is in the figures, it seems as though someone picked $15 out of thin air and announced that its the hill they're willing to die on. What rationale is there for that?
__________________ The Beatings Shall Continue Until Morale Improves!
This Post Has Been Distilled for the Eradication of Seemingly Incurable Sadness.
The World Ends when you're dead. Until then, you've got more punishment in store. - Flames Fans
If you thought this season would have a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention.
The article does go on to say "Is this issue more complicated than I’m making out? Of course. Are there many factors at play determining the dynamics of employment? Yup. But please, please stop insisting that if we pay low-wage workers more, unemployment will skyrocket and it will destroy the economy." The latter is the heart of his point, I think. Not so much that a higher minimum wage guarantees a vibrant city. But that it doesn't guarantee economic ruin.
I wanted to expand a little more in regards to wealth re-distribution which is whats essentially being proposed here.
There is only one pie and its only so big, when raising the minimum wage we're re-distributing wealth to the lower class, we're not printing new money and giving it to these people (making the pie bigger) but if we're re-distributing it then where is that money coming from?
It has to go from one pocket to another.
The guy that wrote that article is a multi-millionaire. Do you think its going to be his money?
Nope. Not a chance in hell.
His money is likely tied up in Real Estate, cars and various investments and savings. Thats important.
So whose money is it going to be? Who is going to be taking less so others can have more?
I'll let you in. Its the same people who already pay the most taxes and who are already giving the most and being squeezed the hardest. The middle-class.
So yeah, I'm sure the multi-millionaire is all for it because it likely wont affect him in the slightest.
He had a good point about moving money from the savers (high income) to the spenders (lower income) in order to stimulate economic growth, thats been happening since forever, but whats really going to wind up happening is the people struggling on the lower end of middle-class are going to fall out, the middle class get squeezed harder and the upper class arent going to even notice.
So they've re-distributed wealth but they've done it all wrong.
__________________ The Beatings Shall Continue Until Morale Improves!
This Post Has Been Distilled for the Eradication of Seemingly Incurable Sadness.
The World Ends when you're dead. Until then, you've got more punishment in store. - Flames Fans
If you thought this season would have a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention.
This hasn't been vetted by unifor, or sociology professors posing as economists but:
- Lower hours for employees who make a higher wage leading to the same or lower income anyway
- squeezed suppliers to the point where the broader economy is hurt as well
Also an interesting article about the man who decided to pay all his lowest skilled workers at least 70k per year:
Well, trickle-downers, look at the data here: The two cities in the nation with the highest rate of job growth by small businesses are San Francisco and Seattle. Guess which cities have the highest minimum wage? San Francisco and Seattle. The fastest-growing big city in America? Seattle. Fifteen dollars isn’t a risky untried policy for us. It’s doubling down on the strategy that’s already allowing our city to kick your city’s ass
Well, yeah and Seattle and San Francisco are among the US cities with the highest cost of living. It's not like Tupelo is paying their wait staff $15 an hour any time soon.
Quote:
"Is this issue more complicated than I’m making out? Of course. Are there many factors at play determining the dynamics of employment? Yup. But please, please stop insisting that if we pay low-wage workers more, unemployment will skyrocket and it will destroy the economy."
The really stupid thing is that on one hand, he has all the evidence he needs to draw conclusions on his side (15$ minimum wage is good), and on the other hand, there is not enough evidence to draw any different conclusion (15$ minimum wage is bad). It's the same bloody evidence. Brutal logic.
Quote:
The standard response in the minimum-wage debate, made by Republicans and their business backers and plenty of Democrats as well, is that raising the minimum wage costs jobs. Businesses will have to lay off workers. This argument reflects the orthodox economics that most people had in college. If you took Econ 101, then you literally were taught that if wages go up, employment must go down
Obviously he thinks the standard logic is wrong....
Quote:
I’ll have to close. I’ll have to lay everyone off. It hasn’t happened. In fact, the data show that when workers are better treated, business gets better. The naysayers are just wrong
What the guy doesn't recognize is that all of the data concerning minimum wage increases uses 7-12% wage increases. Not 50% increases as are proposed in Seattle and Alberta. That's a huge difference. So when he says his city is kicking ass, he didn't even realized that the ass kicking contest hadn't even started at he time he wrote the article.
And he's just fundamentally wrong anyway. Walmart recently raised it's minimum wage to $9 and is now cutting hours to maintain profit....
Walmart Stores Inc., in the midst of spending $1 billion (U.S.) to raise employees’ wages and give them extra training, has been cutting the number of hours some of them work in a bid to keep costs in check
I'm now almost 100% sure that raising corporate tax AND mucking with royalty rates with low oil prices AND forecasting a recession AND running a 6 billion dollar deficit will make raising the minimum wage by 50% one of the stupidest ideas to ever appear in public policy.
Very interesting interview regarding minimum wage, forced overtime, income inequality. Normally I stay away from Gawker, but this is worth a read:
Quote:
Nick Hanauer, a venture capitalist who was one of the first investors in Amazon, has the distinction of being one of America’s few progressive billionaires. We spoke to him about the class war—which he is busily fighting.
Obviously wage increases are very important. I am just not convinced this is the best way to go about things. As mentioned in a recent NP editorial, this will push some companies towards more automation of basic roles, eliminating the positions permanently.
I think it should be updated to reflect cost of living increase for all those years that the wages have been held in check.
Like you say below a whole generation has had stagnant wages, and this has to change.
