Ranking the Canadian Teams

[polak]

Originally Posted by codynw

wut?

I think (hope) he means playoff contender.

[activeStick]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

Giving the Oilers a C for their forwards is not realistic. I hate them as much as the next guy, but that's one area where they are stocked deep with talent.

Can you provide some reasoning then, behind why you say this?

Their talent has been the same for the last number of years producing what they have. This year they've added McDavid, so unless you meant to refer to McDavid and not them being "stocked deep with talent", I'm not sure why you think C is unrealistic.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

Giving the Oilers a C for their forwards is not realistic. I hate them as much as the next guy, but that's one area where they are stocked deep with talent.

think they have a very poor bottom 6 that's a mess. I think that their work ethic and their two way play up front is way below average.

While Hall and Eberle score points, they don't take the team on their back and win. Yakupov has zero clutch factor and is very incomplete as a forward. I have some respect for RNH, he plays a two way game.

While McDavid might be the savior of the Oilers its yet to be seen.

So yeah, I gave them a low score, they're like the smart kids that underachieve by a lot and until they improve on the little things that take you from being an nhl 2015 idol to a well rounded NHL player, they deserve the low marks.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

I agree with the OP. Maybe give Nucks forwards a C, same with the Leafs defense. Still, the best teams seem to be Jets/Flames with somewhat shaky goaltending, whereas Montreal has the best goaltending, with a somewhat shaky team (scoring).

[theslymonkey]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Lowest scoring team in the NHL over the last 5 years

By quite a bit

Originally Posted by CroFlames

Is that why they are consistently bottom 5 in goal scoring, league wide?

I'd say OP was generous with that grade even.

We all know that goal scoring is a team based stat. The Oilers Defensman's lack of ability to make a proper first pass, coupled with no one to QB the PP is their reason for a lack of goal scoring.

To say that their forward group is a C with the likes of McDavid, Hall, Eberle, RNH, Pouliot, Yakupov, Draisaitl, would be very Homeresque.

I hate the Oilers, but their skill at forward is to be feared. If they had the Flames D, they would be scoring at will.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

We all know that goal scoring is a team based stat. The Oilers Defensman's lack of ability to make a proper first pass, coupled with no one to QB the PP is their reason for a lack of goal scoring.

To say that their forward group is a C with the likes of McDavid, Hall, Eberle, RNH, Pouliot, Yakupov, Draisaitl, would be very Homeresque.

I hate the Oilers, but their skill at forward is to be feared. If they had the Flames D, they would be scoring at will.

But it's not though. They aren't scaring anyone.

While I agree that the D has been woeful, to blame all of their lack of scoring on the D is a bit simplistic to say the least.

The Oilers have had lots of brand recognition on offense because of the high draft picks. But the bottom line is that those players have been terrible. Awful. Scary, yes - but not in a good way.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

We all know that goal scoring is a team based stat. The Oilers Defensman's lack of ability to make a proper first pass, coupled with no one to QB the PP is their reason for a lack of goal scoring.

To say that their forward group is a C with the likes of McDavid, Hall, Eberle, RNH, Pouliot, Yakupov, Draisaitl, would be very Homeresque.

I hate the Oilers, but their skill at forward is to be feared. If they had the Flames D, they would be scoring at will.

Ok lets look at this

Yakupov - has been generally terrible, he's had two spurts, late in the year with no pressure, other then that he's been invisible. You can talk about potentials and ceilings, but when I watch him play I see a guy with a good shot, and straight ahead speed and that's it.

Eberle - He gets points but he's softer then a baby fighting Mike Tyson and has zero defensive game. He's as one dimensional as they come.

Poulliot - He's a bottom 6'er that takes bad penalties, makes bone headed plays and is inconsistent for long stretches.

Draisaitl - Did you see him play when he was in the NHL last year, he could barely keep up to the play. He'll probably be good, but if he is in the Oilers lineup this year it illustrates how bad the Oilers depth is

RNH - I have respect for him, he's skilled, he plays a decent two way game.


Hall - He's good offensively, terrible without the puck, doesn't care about backchecking at all.

Mcmanfromuncle - Sure he's a great talent, but until we see him at the NHL level against men, how do we grade him. He could be great, he could come up and get crushed, its happened before in the NHL with surefire number 1 draft picks.

Its not a particularly well put together group of forwards. as a whole they're a disaster without the puck, and as a whole they're soft and inconsistent.

So yeah, in my mind my mark is more about what I've seen after watching a ton of Oilers hockey and less about so called homerism.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

To say that their forward group is a C with the likes of McDavid, Hall, Eberle, RNH, Pouliot, Yakupov, Draisaitl, would be very Homeresque.

Draisatl may not even make the team. Pouliot is underwhelming. And the others have some nice offensive skill but the game is more than the odd deke or breakaway goal. That's the rub for the Oilers 'star' forwards....Eberle is not good defensively at all, neither is Hall and his IQ is poor as well, Yakupov looks like a bit of a one trick pony. I don't mind RNH's two-way game, at least it looks like he cares. And as fantastic as McDavid may be, he hasn't played a single game yet.

If they put everything together, sure, they could put up some points, but that's a big if, plus they need to help out their team in other areas. Not sure a 'C' grade is very far off as we sit here today.

[CaptainCrunch]

hate the Oilers, but their skill at forward is to be feared. If they had the Flames D, they would be scoring at will

With all due respect, on this, I don't think teams fear them as much as they lick their lips in anticipation when they're on the ice and they give up the puck because it always seems to become a long odd man rush.

[theslymonkey]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

But it's not though. They aren't scaring anyone.

While I agree that the D has been woeful, to blame all of their lack of scoring on the D is a bit simplistic to say the least.

The Oilers have had lots of brand recognition on offense because of the high draft picks. But the bottom line is that those players have been terrible. Awful. Scary, yes - but not in a good way.

I'm glad you see them through Red colored glasses, but I see them for what they are... A ticking time bomb.

They finally dumped the boys club upstairs.
Got a real NHL coach.
Hall is an elite LW.
McDavid is generational.
Eberle is a very good RW
RNH is a great #2C
Yak, Pouliot, Draisaitl are all good second line options.

That right there is enough to be a little afraid of.
If they had more than a cardboard box for a goalie and someone other than the orange cones that they use for defensemen. They would be a dangerous.

Now the problem is that they aren't anywhere near competent on the back end. But grading their Forwards as a C is not realistic.

[Scornfire]

I'm not sure I'd call them a "Ticking time bomb", pretty sure I've already seen them blow up in their own end about a thousand times. At this point I'm just curious as to how expansive their munition supply is, they've gotten so good at sucking it's almost an art

[FBI]

Anyone calling the Oilers offense awesome must either be an oil fan or an oiler sympathizer.
They haven't shown anything ever. It might change this year but I doubt it.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

I'm glad you see them through Red colored glasses, but I see them for what they are... A ticking time bomb.

They finally dumped the boys club upstairs.
Got a real NHL coach.
Hall is an elite LW.
McDavid is generational.
Eberle is a very good RW
RNH is a great #2C
Yak, Pouliot, Draisaitl are all good second line options.

That right there is enough to be a little afraid of.
If they had more than a cardboard box for a goalie and someone other than the orange cones that they use for defensemen. They would be a dangerous.

Now the problem is that they aren't anywhere near competent on the back end. But grading their Forwards as a C is not realistic.

Is that the best you can do?

You said they are to be feared. My reply is that other teams simply do not fear them - and have no reason to. Playing the Oilers is a night off.

There is more to building a hockey team than having a couple offensive talents. Their forward group - as a group - is deeply flawed, buttery soft, and lacking in leadership and fortitude.

You think they're awesome - great. But just because people disagree with you (pretty much everyone so far), doesn't mean they are homers.

[theslymonkey]

Originally Posted by FBI

Anyone calling the Oilers offense awesome must either be an oil fan or an oiler sympathizer.
They haven't shown anything ever. It might change this year but I doubt it.

Alright, I retract my objective view and will join the Circle Jerk.
The Flames are amazing and the Oilers suck.

PS. One year ago the Flames had the worst Forwards in Canada, and now we're the best? Come on already...

The Flames have 3 legit top six forwards as of today. If you take McDavid, Hall, Eberle, and RNH to any other team, they would still be top 6 players. So to say that their top six is thin doesn't make sense.

Pouliot, Draisaitl, Yak have every bit the same potential as Frolik, Bennett, and Backlund.

What sets Calgary's team apart is the offense from our D and how that relates to our Forwards. Solid puck moving D drives the Forwards.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

What sets Calgary's team apart is the offense from our D and how that relates to our Forwards. Solid puck moving D drives the Forwards.

No. What sets them apart is that the Flames best forwards are also very good defensively. When your forwards come back to help out, you gain possession, move up the ice as a unit and create offense.

If you have forwards that glide back or have no clue how to play in their own zone it's tough to gain possession and get back into the offensive zone.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

I'm glad you see them through Red colored glasses, but I see them for what they are... A ticking time bomb.

They finally dumped the boys club upstairs.
Got a real NHL coach. (Hopefulyl he can manage egos better then he did in SJ)
Hall is an elite LW. (He's a elite one way LW, he's not a complete package as a player which means he's not overall elite)
McDavid is generational. (Maybe, but maybe we should wait and see what he does in the NHL)
Eberle is a very good RW (softer then a poop on taco Tuesday, a liability defensively)
RNH is a great #2C (Agreed)
Yak, Pouliot, Draisaitl are all good second line options. (out of that I might agree with Pouliot, but I still think he's more of a third liner. Yak hasn't done anything to prove that, Draisaitl based on last year in the NHL isn't ready, you can talk about what he did in the WHL, but he'd better dominate in the WHL)



That right there is enough to be a little afraid of.
If they had more than a cardboard box for a goalie and someone other than the orange cones that they use for defensemen. They would be a dangerous.

Now the problem is that they aren't anywhere near competent on the back end. But grading their Forwards as a C is not realistic.

The forwards for the Oilers are just as much to blame for the ga and lack of offense as the blueline is.

[theslymonkey]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Is that the best you can do?

You said they are to be feared. My reply is that other teams simply do not fear them - and have no reason to. Playing the Oilers is a night off.

There is more to building a hockey team than having a couple offensive talents. Their forward group - as a group - is deeply flawed, buttery soft, and lacking in leadership and fortitude.

You think they're awesome - great. But just because people disagree with you (pretty much everyone so far), doesn't mean they are homers.

Oh good grief. I never said they're awesome. But an educated fan can see the strengths of the other teams. Even the Oilers have strengths. Just because their team sucks doesn't mean they don't have areas of strength.

I realize this is a Flames board, but looking at things objectively is far more healthy than bashing obsessively.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

Alright, I retract my objective view and will join the Circle Jerk.
The Flames are amazing and the Oilers suck.

PS. One year ago the Flames had the worst Forwards in Canada, and now we're the best? Come on already...

The Flames have 3 legit top six forwards as of today. If you take McDavid, Hall, Eberle, and RNH to any other team, they would still be top 6 players. So to say that their top six is thin doesn't make sense.

Pouliot, Draisaitl, Yak have every bit the same potential as Frolik, Bennett, and Backlund.

What sets Calgary's team apart is the offense from our D and how that relates to our Forwards. Solid puck moving D drives the Forwards.

Are you incapable of discussing something without the whining and insults?

And no one said the Flames were the best.

However, the Flames are more balanced and well-rounded (a point you continue to struggle with), while the Oilers are one-dimensional.

It isn't all on the defense - their whole team is poorly constructed.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

Alright, I retract my objective view and will join the Circle Jerk.
The Flames are amazing and the Oilers suck.

PS. One year ago the Flames had the worst Forwards in Canada, and now we're the best? Come on already...

The Flames have 3 legit top six forwards as of today. If you take McDavid, Hall, Eberle, and RNH to any other team, they would still be top 6 players. So to say that their top six is thin doesn't make sense.

Pouliot, Draisaitl, Yak have every bit the same potential as Frolik, Bennett, and Backlund.

What sets Calgary's team apart is the offense from our D and how that relates to our Forwards. Solid puck moving D drives the Forwards.

First of all, if you read your post in the tone of an overtired 6 year old it sounds awesome.

second of all to the boarded, no Frolik is just plain better then Pouliot especially as a two way forward, and has a better work ethic.

Bennett actually got to the NHL and looked like an NHL player and contributed, Drai was clearly not ready, and I wouldn't trade Bennett for Drai and nobody would. Backlund is considered to be a very good two way forward, what has Yak done except flounder.

I wouldn't even come close to trading our three that you listed for your three, and that isn't homerism, that's common sense.

[theslymonkey]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

The forwards for the Oilers are just as much to blame for the ga and lack of offense as the blueline is.

Now that's fair and objective. Well put, I don't completely agree but I can see that side.