[News] CalgaryNEXT Announcement. New arena details emerge.

[RM14]

Originally Posted by Crumpy-Gunt

Wow. Ken king is ridiculous. Love the comment Bob made about come down to Toronto and I will show you what you can build with your own money. Brilliant

It's really not brilliant, it's cocky and false. Bob is a clown, if we were to go to Toronto, we would also see Skydump and BMO field and both were built with public funds.

[D as in David]

I'm not sure that some posters understand that the $240M is just the starting point for the CRL amount. As far as we can tell from the presentation, that amount is only to go towards constructing the event centre. In order for there to be any development by other developers, the city will first have to install infrastructure (roads, utilities, etc.) like they did in the East Village. What that amount is, I don't know but I would guess maybe $150M to $300M if you look at the East Village's costs. And that doesn't include rerouting Bow Trail, which I feel is a necessity for this project (for reasons myself and others have already posted earlier.

On top of that, more government funding will be required for the creosote remediation (which is unclear whether the city could use CRL funding for that).

[Kavvy]

The flames shouldn't get a dam dime unless the below conditions are met. Let the east village grow.


• The flames open all the books
• The teams net profit and forecast profit does not sustain a reasonable payback term for the arena
• The city (i.e. the people) agrees the arena is a critical asset for any team, believes in keeping the team here, and therefore must help them out for them to survive.
• Their current arena is past its overdue date. This date would be when it begins to become reasonable for the flames to considering moving due to the money they are missing out on. Good luck flames.
• A loan model is put into place where if the team actually makes more money than the forecast during the duration of their stay, the city takes a % of that profit.

• The Flames own the arena, pay for any land, and taxes on said land. If this condition isn't met, the value of any of these items should be towards the cities contribution in the load model in the above bullet.

I want the flames to stay, just only under the above conditions.

As for the contamination, if the east village was finished its development, and there weren't so many other areas to be developed (or so I have read on here), I would be willing to have my tax dollars go towards a clean-up. Otherwise, not yet.

Say no to any community levies for hockey arena's (for now, at least)

[TX_Flame]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

All of these stadium examples are missing the point. NRG is not used at all as an amateur sports facility, unlike the proposed fieldhouse. Personally I think the combined use is a good idea for Calgary.

As for MLS, what they didn't want was teams playing in cavernous, empty football stadiums. That would not be a problem here but you are right they prefer dedicated stadiums. Calgary is a long ways down their list anyway. And the MLS ownership structure is different than other sports leagues. The league owns the teams, and investor/operators own an interest in the league. Who knows what the Flames would think of that.

My main point in bringing up NRG is that a stadium can have multiple uses without that causing a problem as long as the playing surfaces are similar. This stadium doesn't have to have the feel of a high school gym just because it's also a fieldhouse suitable for other sports.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by RM14

It's really not brilliant, it's cocky and false. Bob is a clown, if we were to go to Toronto, we would also see Skydump and BMO field and both were built with public funds.

Does Bob know his show is televised? And that we can see him wearing his sunglasses in a studio?

[Kavvy]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

Does Bob know his show is televised? And that we can see him wearing his sunglasses in a studio?

First time I watched it, I thought to myself "What a dumb format, this will last".

I am so sad I was so wrong.

[cal_guy]

Originally Posted by MacDaddy77

yes I'm absolutly ok with this, for one piece of wasted land not paying taxes there will be significant growth of other businesses paying taxes where without the project there will not be any.

is it better to have the land empty and collect nothing for tax or build the arena and have the flames only pay nothing and have the rest of the development collect tax?

I know what side I sit on

The reason that land isn't being uses is because it's contaminated not because it's lacking a giant arena.

[Party Elephant]

Originally Posted by Kavvy

First time I watched it, I thought to myself "What a dumb format, this will last".

I am so sad I was so wrong.

It only stays on because it's so cheap to produce. Take a radio show, stick a fixed camera in there and boom, you've got a televised sports talk show!

[stone hands]

Originally Posted by Southside

I don't think the Flames need to contribute to an environmental clean-up they have no relation to. You can argue other costs, but not that one. Where is that more traditional piece of land? Spruce Meadows? Balzac?

Uh, yes?

Just because king says "there is no plan b", doesn't mean there isn't a plan b if they don't want to clean up. The west village needs to be cleaned up but these things need to be planned and funded properly. We can't just magically make 800 million dollars appear out of nowhere,( especially when oil is $40 a barrel and a new lrt line was announced) just because Ken king says he won't build a facility for his private business anywhere else except for prime freshly renovated downtown real estate that he gets for free

%#&#+ that

[GGG]

I think King is not being truthful when he says the flames can't afford an arena by themselves siting the market isn't big enough. From their own numbers they could build an arena for 450ish. The ticket tax revenue is generally from the arena so you get 225 there and another 200 from the flames so that's the arena right there.

The savings for the one building appear to just from combining the field house and stadium which could still be done later as a separate project. Just having the arena leaves more space for development and the CRL can fund community development rather than the arena.

[Fuzz]

The owners have a net worth of well over $5 billion. If they can't make a business case for building this, why should the public? If they don't think they will make money, how is it good for the public? I understand the "well, we had to ask", but in the end I'm sure they can make the economics work and come out ahead with their own money.

At most, the city should give them the land on the condition they clean it all up. The city will fix the road disaster, that's going to cost $1 billion on its own.

[billybob123]

Originally Posted by RM14

It's really not brilliant, it's cocky and false. Bob is a clown, if we were to go to Toronto, we would also see Skydump and BMO field and both were built with public funds.

Did you also hear him say cost $750 million to build Skydome (King replied closer to $550) which was 3x over budget, and then sold for $50 million? I think that's his point. Stadium building by public funds doesn't end well in Ontario. You'd think people would learn.

[craigwd]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

Does Bob know his show is televised? And that we can see him wearing his sunglasses in a studio?

Mccown wears sunglasses because his eyes are sensitive to the studio lights.

[TX_Flame]

Originally Posted by stone hands

Uh, yes?

Just because king says "there is no plan b", doesn't mean there isn't a plan b if they don't want to clean up. The west village needs to be cleaned up but these things need to be planned and funded properly. We can't just magically make 800 million dollars appear out of nowhere,( especially when oil is $40 a barrel and a new lrt line was announced) just because Ken king says he won't build a facility for his private business anywhere else except for prime freshly renovated downtown real estate that he gets for free

%#&#+ that

Building arenas out in the boonies doesn't work. Where is an alternative CENTRALLY LOCATED plot of land that is not contaminated?

[TX_Flame]

Originally Posted by GGG

I think King is not being truthful when he says the flames can't afford an arena by themselves siting the market isn't big enough. From their own numbers they could build an arena for 450ish. The ticket tax revenue is generally from the arena so you get 225 there and another 200 from the flames so that's the arena right there.

The savings for the one building appear to just from combining the field house and stadium which could still be done later as a separate project. Just having the arena leaves more space for development and the CRL can fund community development rather than the arena.

No, the savings are supposed to come from combining all 3 buildings into 1. That way there are common concourses and services that don't need to be duplicated in another building.

[Da_Chief]

Originally Posted by craigwd

Mccown wears sunglasses because his eyes are sensitive to the studio lights.

Lights don't explain his terrible style and horrendous opinions. Radio shows being on TV has to be the stupidest idea ever.

[badger89]

OK, this might be a bit of a conspiracy theory, but maybe the Flames don't expect this proposal to be accepted, but are just using it as a negotiating tactic to get a better deal from the Stampede board (to build on top of the Big Four, or some location on the grounds). That might explain the minimal amount of planning that seems to have gone into this proposal.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by badger89

That might explain the minimal amount of planning that seems to have gone into this proposal.

Don't attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence.

[taffeyb]

Originally Posted by badger89

OK, this might be a bit of a conspiracy theory, but maybe the Flames don't expect this proposal to be accepted, but are just using it as a negotiating tactic to get a better deal from the Stampede board (to build on top of the Big Four, or some location on the grounds). That might explain the minimal amount of planning that seems to have gone into this proposal.

The Stampede Board has grand plans for their own entertainment district. Without the Flames/Hitmen/Roughnecks bringing in several thousand people 100 days during the year, it would be a tough go. Add in the couple of dozen concerts and you realize that the Saddledome brings in 12,000+ (at least) crowds for 1/3 of the days in any given year.

The big issue is the CRL funding. I believe that it's too late to claim it for the East Village. That being said, if they only build an Arena, the costs come way down. 200 from the owners and 250 ticket tax = 450. They can still build a multi-use field house up by McMahon if the city ever comes up with the funding. Ticket tax for the field house would really not be relevant...not really enough tickets being sold. 9 Stamps games <period>.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by TX_Flame

Building arenas out in the boonies doesn't work. Where is an alternative CENTRALLY LOCATED plot of land that is not contaminated?

Would one 2 minutes from the Zoo on the LRT line do.?