Most Albertans overweight or obese: report

[peter12]

Or smearing our baby's face with vaginal fluids. So Old Testament!

[PrettyBoyFlizzy]

A lot of it has to do with will power, you either have it in you to make a change or you don't.

It's not just about obesity its our culture right now, people are lazy.

I like to train and do bodybuilding, so I will put on weight then shred it off, but it takes a lot of work. Really the only way to pack on muscle you have to gain weight then start cutting to have it show.

Even at my office we always get treats our way donuts and crap like that. If I say not which is 99% of the time, I get the you only eat carrots and celery crap. No I choose not eat that crap so I don't have my gut hanging over my belt.

[PepsiFree]

Healthy eaters seem to get really defensive over bad eaters ridiculing their choices, while ridiculing the choices of bad eaters.

Maybe if everyone was just how they wanted to be, and didn't hear about how they should eat better, or "live a little" then there wouldn't be such a commercialised market on the ideals of body type. Fat people seem to shame skinny people just as much as skinny people shame fat people now. Maybe people shouldn't shame each other for living their own lives? Or begin to tell them how they should best change their situation? The thing about unsolicited advice is...

[Fire of the Phoenix]

It's weird how people care about what other people eat

[Tron_fdc]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

Personally, and Thor may disagree, but I think there just hasn't been nearly enough research done on weight MAINTENANCE. There is PLENTY, and I mean PLENTY of research that has been done that shows that keeping off significant weight is next to impossible. And Dr. Aamodt's talk is a good start, but we need MORE studies that back up her claims. But more importantly, we need more studies on how we combat the human body's reaction to weight loss. We spend billions on weight LOSS, but scant pennies on weight MAINTENANCE. I was interviewed last week for a book on weight maintenance; I was told that it was hard for the author to track down people who have been able to keep off 100+ pounds for five years. Anyhow, the author said she was writing for an empty market. 10,000 books on Amazon about weight loss, 3 on weight maintenance. Three. Just three. WTF?

There's no money in that. REAL maintenance involves a healthy lifestyle and exercise, which is a slow process. Who wants that? Everyone wants the fastest, quickest way to get skinny. Who cares what happens after that. I want instant gratification!!

Weight loss and maintenance involves healthy food macros and a TDEE calculation along with exercise and TIME which is painfully simple. Who wants to pay for something like that when you can buy a book and do the Atkins diet to dump 50lbs in 8 weeks? Or go see a "Dr" for vitamin B injections and a 500 calorie daily diet? It's ridiculous.

Fad diets have been around since the beginning of time. As long as people are willing to pay for a quick fix they're not going anywhere.

[TorqueDog]

^This. I maintain that education about eating properly, how different foods can be more calorie dense despite being in smaller portions, the importance of protein in one's diet when attempting to lose weight is a real problem.

That 500 kCal diet with daily HCG injections? I tried it. Lost 30 lbs in 21 days. Great, right? Nope, I gained it all back after, and then some. Not because it didn't do what it was supposed to do (help me lose weight), but the process taught me NOTHING about making smart choices.

The diet focuses on calories as a limit, but doesn't talk about the importance of individual macronutrients. I lost muscle on that diet (and fat but to a lesser degree than I wanted) because the diet says you eat 500 kCal a day, here are your food choices and the portions you may have, go to. There aren't enough grams of protein in the allotted servings to maintain muscle, so you catabolize muscle and metabolize fat, and you have very little ability to control which is the bigger victim. 500 kCal isn't sustainable either, it's not something you can adjust a little bit and be at your maintenance calories. Diet needs to be a lifestyle change, and the very nature of the HCG diet necessitates that you treat the diet simply as a means to an end.

Education about what it means to eat healthy from the perspective of weight loss and maintenance is where we lack strength. All this discussion about toxins, GMOs, fatty food being unhealthy, and organic nonsense simply distracts from what we really need to know about.

[Traditional_Ale]

I'd like to add that I have been skinny-shamed enough that I've actually started replying to it. If I get the "God, you're so skinny," I instantly reply with "God, you're so fat." Either they are too shocked to speak or they start to get indignant and I continue "yeah, body image issues go both ways. Bitch."

[AcGold]

I've found it's best just to never bring up someone's appearance unless it's a compliment or it's a hygiene/work issue. Otherwise commenting on appearance seems to never actually help especially if you aren't in a close relationship with the person.

I've had close friendships with all different races and sizes of people, when asked how I can be so close with a group of people that are different racially or body figure wise I respond with that I never ever comment on the differences. Hanging with a group of overweight people I would never bring up anything on the topic, with a group of african americans race never came up once in 4 years. The thing is being considerate, you want to get someone overweight in shape buy them some healthy food and drive them to the gym otherwise it's probably better just not to say anything most of the time.

With certain things it's ok like mentioning if someone is missing an obvious social cue or something like that but otherwise I say keep it to yourself. So Thor is overweight maybe? Actually help him with support or stay silent, I don't see any other productive use of efforts. Saying someone is just lazy might actually be true but it doesn't help, it makes things worse. If you tell someone over and over they are one thing they will start to believe it and more and more resemble that feature, by criticizing something you only reinforce it most of the time especially if there is no support or plan towards a solution.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by Traditional_Ale

I'd like to add that I have been skinny-shamed enough that I've actually started replying to it. If I get the "God, you're so skinny," I instantly reply with "God, you're so fat." Either they are too shocked to speak or they start to get indignant and I continue "yeah, body image issues go both ways. Bitch."

LOL. I think this is when someone is supposed to say "Check your privilege, sh*tlord".

[Fire of the Phoenix]

nm

[Thor]

I can see why DA told me to stay away from this discussion. Torque, you continue to refuse to answer my question.

How much were you overweight, were you overweight as a child, teenager, were you obese for a many years?

How much did you lose, over what period of time.

[Tyler]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

It's weird how people care about what other people eat

When a gigantic proportion of our taxes go towards healthcare treating preventable diseases related to 'what other people eat', I think we should all care.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Tyler

When a gigantic proportion of our taxes go towards healthcare treating preventable diseases related to 'what other people eat', I think we should all care.

I was referring to those stories of snide remarks at work functions when someone turns down a treat or is eating healthy.

[Thor]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

It's beautiful how Thor asks me a question, later refers to someone he knows talking about how people who haven't lost that much weight are the sorts who tend to hold these sorts of viewpoints, then decides that clearly I must have been a small-fat, then goes off on an insane tangent and finishes it off with cussing me out because I think parents should be held accountable to ensure their children don't become unhealthy through poor dietary options (which are primarily the responsibility of the parent/guardian). All before I even answer his questions, he's concluded all these great things about me based on no evidence.

Are you unable to read back to your comments? Here let me help you:

We shame smokers, being fat is no different. Both are (or require) direct, intentional actions that are often sustained through habit that lead to negative health and interpersonal outcomes. Fat shame is necessary. Yes, you should be ashamed if you've treated the only body you get in this life like a dumpster. Fat shame is why I learned about proper diet and nutrition and lost weight properly. I'm fit as hell now, but it wasn't without realizing no one gets a second chance in this world and you have to just do it.

The trick is to hate your body enough to recognize you need to change, and love yourself enough to realize you're worth the effort. Self-actualization is key.

What I will clarify is my statement of the hate yourself / love yourself sentence (the love yourself part which was integral to the message was clearly cut out to make me seem like a big meanie):

Make you seem like a big meanie? No no, you did that, and I quote:

We shame smokers, being fat is no different. Both are (or require) direct, intentional actions that are often sustained through habit that lead to negative health and interpersonal outcomes. Fat shame is necessary. Yes, you should be ashamed if you've treated the only body you get in this life like a dumpster. Fat shame is why I learned about proper diet and nutrition and lost weight properly. I'm fit as hell now, but it wasn't without realizing no one gets a second chance in this world and you have to just do it.

The trick is to hate your body enough to recognize you need to change, and love yourself enough to realize you're worth the effort. Self-actualization is key.

I wasn't raised with good eating habits. My dad has developed type 2 diabetes. My mom is overweight if not obese.

So did you ask your mom why she is not worth it, that she needs to change because clearly your mom and dad are treating their bodies as dumpsters and clearly don't appreciate the one life they have?

So it took effort, and I'd spend evenings figuring out calories and macros for my goals. I'm a nerd, so I had a spreadsheet to plot out my ideal trajectory, tracking daily calorie limits (along with a good phone app) and a food scale. Because I love myself. I don't want to die early, become riddled with easily avoidable health issues, or even lose my breath because I went up a staircase too enthusiastically. Life is worth more than that; I'm worth more than that.

Its truly amazing how you keep inserting comments like:

" Because I love myself." and "Life is worth more than that; I'm worth more than that."

So that's the long version. You can't make a change without believing you're worth more than what you are, and if you don't keep pushing yourself in some way, how do you achieve better? Never be happy with the status quo. Push harder. You can use your own word to replace "hate" as ranchlandsselling said. The word hate worked and was accurate for my opinion of my physical condition and my lack of discipline toward it.

There are tons of reasons why people seek to lose weight, in fact the vast majority of our society is on a "diet." Our media, our society makes anyone not in a particular body shape, as someone who is lazy, fat, undisciplined, and unworthy...

But the biggest problem, besides the fact you speak from someone who has not been obese, which is clear, you can lie about it no problem but you would not say the things you do IF you had been.

Is that the massive problem of obesity in our world today is complex, it is nothing as simple as you would suggest it is, and its quite insulting when people who have no clue what the challenge is like suggest they know better.

As for the claim that Calories In, Calories Out is nonsense, the article you posted is terrible.
http://authoritynutrition.com/debunk...-calorie-myth/
First sentence of the article:
I think the notion of "calories in vs. calories out" is ridiculous.

LOL this is a friend of mine!! Kris Gunnars actually considered me as a writer last year. But wow quoting what you said about that we should shame fat people, his response like any decent human being was that you are not worth listening to... The IRONY you would link to his website, awesome..

Really? Because I could have sworn you just discounted what I did because you have decided on no information that I was a small-fat and so clearly I can't possibly know what it's really like. This compliment rings hollow given your recent statements, and you can keep it. I don't need your congratulations, thanks.

Its clear you were not obese, have never been obese. Myself and many other 100 plus"ers" run in to people like yourself pretty much weekly. Those who lost a 10-50 pound gut that had been hanging around for years, and once they got it handled, they took up the mantle of telling others how easy it is, and how if they couldn't do it, they must not care enough...

Again, ignoring the science of long term obesity. Because you know, science...

There are 2 clear classes we are dealing with. I know because I spend most of my free time helping them. Obese, those who have been obese for anything over a 6 month period require a different approach than those who are non obese, who have 5, 10, 15, 20 pounds to lose.

The reason is based on science, as I linked to above. The longer you are obese, the less likely you are to ever succeed.

So by your logic, the studies, and there are many now, science based, that 98% plus failure rate, means that only 2% of people care about themselves, and that 98% should be shamed more, and that those 98% should obviously learn to love life, because the reason they fail is because they are lazy, don't love life....

You sir, are a joke.

[DownhillGoat]

Originally Posted by Thor

The reason is based on science, as I linked to above. The longer you are obese, the less likely you are to ever succeed

Not sure if this is the same study you referenced before, but I found this to be an interesting take:
http://www.nerdfitness.com/blog/2015...fat-wait-what/

[Thor]

Originally Posted by PsYcNeT

Hardly, Thor's posting has run the gamut of "here's my take on the research" smothered lovingly with high-horse sauce and bizarre indignant anger, to "here's a bunch of dense, time consuming information. Educate yourself pleb."

Bizarre? How is it bizarre to respond to the hateful comments by Torque, and the many others who continue to propagate the unscientific ideas that obesity is about laziness, about apathy, and nothing else.

There exists a third option, simply pointing me to something a little more middle of the road, much like the SciAm article Peter12 posted above.

Edit: What I'm taking away is that coprophagia is our only option, and we should all start swapping poop ASAP.

I said that the most promising field of research is the gut brain link, and IF this turns out to be the holy grail of obesity, then it will go 100% against everything that Torque said, and others who suggest obesity is about laziness and other insulting comments.

But focus on how I am a meanie! And ignore this:

We shame smokers, being fat is no different. Both are (or require) direct, intentional actions that are often sustained through habit that lead to negative health and interpersonal outcomes. Fat shame is necessary. Yes, you should be ashamed if you've treated the only body you get in this life like a dumpster. Fat shame is why I learned about proper diet and nutrition and lost weight properly. I'm fit as hell now, but it wasn't without realizing no one gets a second chance in this world and you have to just do it.

The trick is to hate your body enough to recognize you need to change, and love yourself enough to realize you're worth the effort. Self-actualization is key.

That bypassed pretty much everyone, and my frustrated response, was what so many of you wanted to focus on.

Says volumes about the issue I think.

[Thor]

Originally Posted by Locke

I actually think Torque has a point, if you've done it to yourself (as I have been lately- ) then you should be responsible for your actions and have to take your lumps.

If you havent and its a biological issue then the comment doesnt apply to you and no harm no foul.

Or am I totally off base with this?

I have so far, posted a video series, links to science based articles.


No harm no foul right? Just form an opinion, and when two of the forum's 100 plus weight loss success stories, who are also science nerds and skeptics, tell you "hey there is more to this than just, fat people are lazy..."

You might want to give it a bit more thought.

[Thor]

Originally Posted by PrettyBoyFlizzy

A lot of it has to do with will power, you either have it in you to make a change or you don't.

It's not just about obesity its our culture right now, people are lazy.

Nope, its about biology. People are opinionated sure, but the science, says something else.

I like to train and do bodybuilding, so I will put on weight then shred it off, but it takes a lot of work. Really the only way to pack on muscle you have to gain weight then start cutting to have it show.
Even at my office we always get treats our way donuts and crap like that. If I say not which is 99% of the time, I get the you only eat carrots and celery crap. No I choose not eat that crap so I don't have my gut hanging over my belt.

And this is where most of the problem's arise. People who have never been obese, talking about them as if they know or have a solution to it.

Again, the science speaks quite clearly on this, obesity and getting back to a healthy weight has a 1 in 212 rate.

This is not based on effort, how much you love life, or your mommy. It has to do with the powerful biological processes that push your body to return to the weight you were at once you have been obese for a certain length of time.

The big problem is how do we communicate to these people like you, who have a completely detached view of obesity and weight issues. The idea that if all people experienced the world as YOU do, would make the world simple. However brain chemistry, human biology means that we all experience the world in our own ways, and to this day we still have not seen a problem as obesity which is as difficult and complex.

[Thor]

Originally Posted by PsYcNeT

I guess you missed the most important point: people are lazy. I'm lazy. Give me something that summarises the current state of the field that I can read in an hour and be done with it.

Sigh, well we don't know for sure. What is likely that we will confirm is that we have a neurological and bio brain barrier with the gut which has everything to do with how much energy you have daily, if you will be overweight, skinny, muscular...

The immense power of this connection to our human biome, is at this point the best explanation of why obesity is such a problem and how we are to this point unable to figure it out.

As I always have to when speaking to weight loss groups in Iceland, I need to make clear that a few pounds overweight, does not create this change in the brain which will tie into the gut and therefore make it nearly impossible to keep the weight off.

I get this from all sides, I have the "love your fat body" people telling me to stop promoting biggest loser, or anything I write or discuss in the public forum.

On the other hand, I have been lately calling out the gyms, the diet programs and people who make a living off of taking money from obese people and failing them at a 98% failure rate long term.

I don't have the answer for them, I am not sure how we do this better and how we find a way to keep the weight off long term. I think will have to figure out the biome and brain connection, once we understand the gut's power over our body, we will once and for all have found the holy grail of dealing with obesity.

The reason guys I get so upset, is because you belittle and talk down to 98% of people who diet and fail. That the suggestion is they are just lazy, or unable to commit to eating right.

The fact you base these opinions as people who have never been obese, and don't know what the powerful biological and psychological triggers have on fighting against even the most determined of us who lose the weight, means you come off as pretty condescending and insulting to us who understand what it is all about.

We're not all going to become obesity researchers overnight, however asking for information to literally educate ourselves doesn't preclude us from participating in the discussion.

Absolutely not, but the majority of comments here have been about people thinking they have the answer.

]

You want to win hearts and minds? Then make it easy to understand, and act like you give a #### about educating people rather than getting angry at them. What you are displaying is not passion; it is arrogance and irritation.

You mean the links I put up, the videos, the at this point hours I have spent answering people's comments...

Obesity is not easy, we do not understand why we are failing so massively.

Odd that you would call me arrogant and irritating, considering the insulting comments made against obese people in this thread, and in general. Fat shaming is the last great politically correct insult that most people have no issue with making.

I just don't know how much more I can answer, like those anti GMO, anti Vaxx people I deal with every week, it is even worse with the pre conceived notions against obesity. You have an opinion on why you think people are fat, and little I can say or others will change that.

Sad to say, because the science is pretty clear, yet few of us stand up to say it.

[Thor]

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