[News] Bouma, Byron, and Jooris and 20 other players file for Salary Arbitration

[The Fonz]

I don't see how the arbitrator could award him any less than 2.1M AAV after the season he put up. Really wish the Flames would have moved off of 1.5M and got this done prior to the hearing.

[Moneyhands23]

Hmmmm. I was really hoping to see a 3 year 1.8 mil contract.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

I don't see how the arbitrator could award him any less than 2.1M AAV after the season he put up. Really wish the Flames would have moved off of 1.5M and got this done prior to the hearing.

Why do you wish they moved off this? The only way, if $2.1 is the number that gets awarded in arbitration for example, you would have wished they'd moved is if you think Bouma is just going to be lights out moving forward and you think he's going to end up commanding a much higher salary after this year because he'd just going to prove he's a true top 6 winger in this league.

Otherwise, little downside for the Flames, and I can totally sympathise with them not being ready to take that gamble on Bouma at this point, I'd say it's very fair to be concerned he's not going to put up top 6 points moving forward. So getting him on his arbitration deal for another year is pretty good, and re-evaluate moving forward. Way to much fear about locking down Bouma long term right now IMO. We can go through all this again next year with him as a RFA again if need be, why are people so convinced he needs to be locked in long term right now?

[The Fonz]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Why do you wish they moved off this? The only way, if $2.1 is the number that gets awarded in arbitration for example, you would have wished they'd moved is if you think Bouma is just going to be lights out moving forward and you think he's going to end up commanding a much higher salary after this year because he'd just going to prove he's a true top 6 winger in this league.

Otherwise, little downside for the Flames, and I can totally sympathise with them not being ready to take that gamble on Bouma at this point, I'd say it's very fair to be concerned he's not going to put up top 6 points moving forward. So getting him on his arbitration deal for another year is pretty good, and re-evaluate moving forward. Way to much fear about locking down Bouma long term right now IMO. We can go through all this again next year with him as a RFA again if need be, why are people so convinced he needs to be locked in long term right now?

I don't like teams and players facing off against each other in arbitration, is why I wish they'd moved off of their 1.5M offer. I also don't think 1.5M is fair, considering the season he just had.

There would be little to no risk in giving Bouma a 3yr/2.0M AAV deal, which I believe 100% he would have signed. On the other hand, if arbitration awards him 2.0M+, and he happens to put up another season similar to the one he just did, he'll be looking for 3.0M+ and term next summer, and he won't forget the way the Flames played hardball with him.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

Came into thread to see posters getting angry over normal negotiations.... leaving satisfied.

I don't really see much anger exhibited in this thread. Glad you are satisfied though.

[liamenator]

Rich Winter is a blowhard. I remember when Leland Irving was a pending RFA with the Flames, he was yammering on about how his company's foolproof super-duper secret analytic system offered definitive proof that Irving was trending toward Dominik Hasek territory.

He was right.



Dominik Hasek also finished his career in the KHL.

[bax]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

I don't like teams and players facing off against each other in arbitration, is why I wish they'd moved off of their 1.5M offer. I also don't think 1.5M is fair, considering the season he just had.

There would be little to no risk in giving Bouma a 3yr/2.0M AAV deal, which I believe 100% he would have signed. On the other hand, if arbitration awards him 2.0M+, and he happens to put up another season similar to the one he just did, he'll be looking for 3.0M+ and term next summer, and he won't forget the way the Flames played hardball with him.

1.5 million is likely not the best offer the flames gave to Bouma though. It's their arbitration number, so it is low as expected. Bouma's number of 2.5 is high as expected.

My best guess is that they were maybe hung up on term or maybe anywhere from 100 k to 400 k. This wouldn't surprise me as Winter is a noted tough negotiator and it appears Treliving is as well.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Why do you wish they moved off this? The only way, if $2.1 is the number that gets awarded in arbitration for example, you would have wished they'd moved is if you think Bouma is just going to be lights out moving forward and you think he's going to end up commanding a much higher salary after this year because he'd just going to prove he's a true top 6 winger in this league.

Otherwise, little downside for the Flames, and I can totally sympathise with them not being ready to take that gamble on Bouma at this point, I'd say it's very fair to be concerned he's not going to put up top 6 points moving forward. So getting him on his arbitration deal for another year is pretty good, and re-evaluate moving forward. Way to much fear about locking down Bouma long term right now IMO. We can go through all this again next year with him as a RFA again if need be, why are people so convinced he needs to be locked in long term right now?

I think it is because some of us see Bouma as a keeper long term for the Flames and see getting him at 2 to 2.5 on a long term deal is better than 2 this year and potentially 3 plus after this year

This will always be a debate when re-signing young players. It can go either way. Bouma doesn't score 16 next year, has an off year, or gets hurt then your laughing that you didn't lock him up long term. If he duplicates or improves then your wishing you did a long term deal at 2.5 or less for 3 or more years

On guys like Bouma it's less of a concern and I get why they don't wrap him up as he isn't a core player but I still think he would be nice to keep long term as cheap as possible

I also think the other reason why some of us would rather lock him up cheaper for long term now is that we may have cap issues next year. Teams that get themselves into trouble with the cap are the teams that dish out 3-4 million to guys that aren't top 6 forwards or top 4 d-men. The more good players you have making 2 million or less just means more room to keep or add star players

[ricardodw]

How does Frolik get a 3.3M 1 year RFA deal from a team with an internal cap (Jets) and Bouma is supposed to get less than 3M?

Frolik got his 3.3M deal after a 15 goal 42 games season where he played 81 games and was a +8 playing 16:40/game

RFA Bouma is coming off a 16 goal 34 pt 78 game season where he was +10 playing 14:01 / game.

Bouma lead the Flames in hits with 264 next was Colborne with 158. He led the Flames forwards with 81 blocked shots.

I know that the stats may not be accurate but there can be no doubt from watching the games that many of Bouma's hits and Blocked shots were key plays in important games.

RFA Frolik had 41 hits and 51 blocked shots.

If Bouma's agent is able to use Frolik as a comparable I don't see how Bouma gets significantly less than Frolik.

[Mister Yamoto]

I really don't see what the problem is here. The 2.5 that Bouma wants is fair or even a bit low.

Sometimes the process of RFA/UFA negotiations stinks. You back up the Brinks truck for Frolik because he scored 19 goals for the Jets. Then you nickel and dime Bouma because he scored 16 goals for the Flames.

Just give him his 2.5 and be done with it.

[bax]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

How does Frolik get a 3.3M 1 year RFA deal from a team with an internal cap (Jets) and Bouma is supposed to get less than 3M?



Frolik got his 3.3M deal after a 15 goal 42 games season where he played 81 games and was a +8 playing 16:40/game



RFA Bouma is coming off a 16 goal 34 pt 78 game season where he was +10 playing 14:01 / game.



Bouma lead the Flames in hits with 264 next was Colborne with 158. He led the Flames forwards with 81 blocked shots.



I know that the stats may not be accurate but there can be no doubt from watching the games that many of Bouma's hits and Blocked shots were key plays in important games.



RFA Frolik had 41 hits and 51 blocked shots.



If Bouma's agent is able to use Frolik as a comparable I don't see how Bouma gets significantly less than Frolik.

Because you can't base an entire contract on one season.

The most points Bouma ever put up before last seas was 15, where frolik had 3 seasons at over 40 points

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Lol at comparing Bouma to Frolik. One is Mr. Fancy stat with a few years of great years to back up 2nd line status. The other is Mr. Intangible with one good year where he had the sh% of a star sniper. If Bouma can do it again, we'll talk $3m+, for now it's pretty obvious he's not there yet.

[codynw]

Originally Posted by Mister Yamoto

I really don't see what the problem is here. The 2.5 that Bouma wants is fair or even a bit low.

Sometimes the process of RFA/UFA negotiations stinks. You back up the Brinks truck for Frolik because he scored 19 goals for the Jets. Then you nickel and dime Bouma because he scored 16 goals for the Flames.

Just give him his 2.5 and be done with it.

For one thing, RFA vs UFA. For another, Frolik is a proven, consistent ~40 point player with a solid two way game. Bouma had one season with 34 points, while having a ridiculously high shooting percentage. Not comparable at all.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by Mister Yamoto

I really don't see what the problem is here. The 2.5 that Bouma wants is fair or even a bit low.

Because it's just as easy to say that the 1.5 that the team wants is fair or even a bit high.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by bax

Because you can't base an entire contract on one season.

The year before Frolik had 10 pts in 45 games and got traded to the Jets for a 3rd #74 and 4th #134 round pick.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

How does Frolik get a 3.3M 1 year RFA deal from a team with an internal cap (Jets) and Bouma is supposed to get less than 3M?

Frolik got his 3.3M deal after a 15 goal 42 games season where he played 81 games and was a +8 playing 16:40/game

RFA Bouma is coming off a 16 goal 34 pt 78 game season where he was +10 playing 14:01 / game.

Bouma lead the Flames in hits with 264 next was Colborne with 158. He led the Flames forwards with 81 blocked shots.

I know that the stats may not be accurate but there can be no doubt from watching the games that many of Bouma's hits and Blocked shots were key plays in important games.

RFA Frolik had 41 hits and 51 blocked shots.

If Bouma's agent is able to use Frolik as a comparable I don't see how Bouma gets significantly less than Frolik.

I think the reason is Frolik had 3 season prior to that of 38 points or better where Bouma had 19 career points before last year. But this is why most of us want the Flames to jump on signing long term for 2.5 or less as you see what Frolik got from us long term and that was considered to be a good contract

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

How does Frolik get a 3.3M 1 year RFA deal from a team with an internal cap (Jets) and Bouma is supposed to get less than 3M?

If Bouma's agent is able to use Frolik as a comparable I don't see how Bouma gets significantly less than Frolik.

Bouma and Frolik are not comparables; neither in age, experience, offensive production, or roles. The mere fact that you think they are makes me question how you think about hockey...well, more so than usual anyway.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by codynw

For one thing, RFA vs UFA. For another, Frolik is a proven, consistent ~40 point player with a solid two way game. Bouma had one season with 34 points, while having a ridiculously high shooting percentage. Not comparable at all.

Frolik was coming off a 1 year deal for 3.3M that he signed as a RFA with the Jets.

Similarly to Bouma Frolik was a 3 line RW that got to play 2nd line because of injuries. He was behind Wheeler and Buff in the depth chart and the Jets considered him so weak as the #2 RW they were forced to move Buff from D to forward.

Bouwmiester.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Frolik was coming off a 1 year deal for 3.3M that he signed as a RFA with the Jets.

Similarly to Bouma Frolik was a 3 line RW that got to play 2nd line because of injuries. He was behind Wheeler and Buff in the depth chart and the Jets considered him so weak as the #2 RW they were forced to move Buff from D to forward.

Bouwmiester.

Drink!!!

[Yamer]

I project Bouma to be an excellent fourth line player and solid 3rd line player. If he scores 8-10 goals consistently with 15-20 points annually, puts his body in front of pucks and players, then I think he is totally worth around 2 - 2.2 million now and an average of that in the future.

I was hoping they could have bought a year of FA with a 3 year deal around the above figure, but 2.2 (or less) million on a one year deal might work the best for the Flames.

I'm of the mind that Bouma is as an important member of the team in his role as any other player, and should be kept given the information we have on salary negotiations/arbitration. He's worth more to the Calgary Flames than anything they would get for him.