[Rumour] Giordano Extension. Kypreos: Starting point is $72 million over 8 years

[OutOfTheCube]

Why do guys like Gio even have agents? They know approximately what they're worth, where they want to play, etc. Just seems like an enormous waste of a cut of your pay check.

I get it for bottom 6/bottom pairing guys that might have trouble finding work but why does a coveted player need a middle man to figure this out for him?

Not just Giordano specifically of course, I know all the top players have agents. Just a general question. Seems like a good easy gig if you could get into it.

[BrownDrake]

Its going to be a 5 year max...about 2% of defenseman actually play productively past 38 years old. His cap hit is going to be a minimum of 7.0 on a 5 year. Let's hope its more like 7.5 to 7.75 over 4 years.

He's worth every penny of 8.0 per year on a 3 year deal.

[Headshot]

Could Treliving maybe convince Gio to sign a smaller contract if he gave him an obscene signing bonus amount? Or do those count to the cap as well?

[killer_carlson]

Originally Posted by BrownDrake

Its going to be a 5 year max...about 2% of defenseman actually play productively past 38 years old. His cap hit is going to be a minimum of 7.0 on a 5 year. Let's hope its more like 7.5 to 7.75 over 4 years.

He's worth every penny of 8.0 per year on a 3 year deal.

See, I'm not convinced he is an $8,000,000 player.

I'm open to offers on giordano from the eastern conference now that we have Hamilton

[JohnnySkittles]

He absolutely is worth 8M in today's market. The market of a few years ago no, because 8M was on the very high end side. But when guys like Bobby Ryan get 8M then Gio is without a doubt worth that.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by Headshot

Could Treliving maybe convince Gio to sign a smaller contract if he gave him an obscene signing bonus amount? Or do those count to the cap as well?

Signing bonuses count against the cap.

[Jason14h]

If the Flames don't want to give term (More then 4 years) they will be paying 8.5-9 mil or Gio will hit the market and watch another team probably pay more in FA.

If the Flames want a lower cap hit, you start adding years at the end of the contract at lower real dollar amounts.

We shouldn't really be worried in 6 and 7 years if his cap hit is high if his real dollar amount is low. Those contracts are easy to move if need be.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by JohnnySkittles

He absolutely is worth 8M in today's market. The market of a few years ago no, because 8M was on the very high end side. But when guys like Bobby Ryan get 8M then Gio is without a doubt worth that.

Age is a thing. Smart GMs don't break the bank with 33 year old players.

[BrownDrake]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

See, I'm not convinced he is an $8,000,000 player.

I'm open to offers on giordano from the eastern conference now that we have Hamilton

I agree but we aren't going to like the return either. He would be going to a contender so you probably get a 1st rounder, 20 to 30 range and a middling prospect. Alternatively you might be able to do a hockey trade for RW in the 27 to 30 range on an expiring contract (Okposo and 2nd rounder???). Remember he has to waive so its going to be a place where he can win.

He's more valuable to us over the next 3 years than we can get in return, overpaying him for 3 years isn't the issue - we just can't sign him for a high cap hit over 6.5 for 6 to 7 years.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by JohnnySkittles

He absolutely is worth 8M in today's market. The market of a few years ago no, because 8M was on the very high end side. But when guys like Bobby Ryan get 8M then Gio is without a doubt worth that.

No he isn't. Defensemen making more than $8M? One. PK Subban. Defensemen making more than $7M? Six others. Add Weber, Suter, Letang, Campbell, Doughty and Phaneuf. You can add Chara, Karlsson and Pietrangelo for defensemen making over $6M. The only player on this list undeserving of that money is Phaneuf, but he got it because of Toronto hype. When Mark Giordano can parade a Stanley Cup or a Norris Trophy around, I'll say he is worth north of $7M dollars long term.

Originally Posted by BrownDrake

I agree but we aren't going to like the return either. He would be going to a contender so you probably get a 1st rounder, 20 to 30 range and a middling prospect. Alternatively you might be able to do a hockey trade for RW in the 27 to 30 range on an expiring contract (Okposo and 2nd rounder???). Remember he has to waive so its going to be a place where he can win.

Seems that establishes the marketplace for a player's value? No? If no one else is willing to cough up much of value for Giordano, why should the Flames be backing up a Brinks truck?

He's more valuable to us over the next 3 years than we can get in return, overpaying him for 3 years isn't the issue - we just can't sign him for a high cap hit over 6.5 for 6 to 7 years.

Again, why pay him an exorbitant amount if no one else is willing to cough it up? You pay guys for what they will bring to your team in the future, not what they have done in the past. If you think Girodano is going to be a top end defenseman for more than another two or three years, you're kidding yourself. He's probably worth a four year contract, tops. Give him a couple years of big numbers, but the last two have to drop off significantly because defensemen see their skill level drop off after 35.

[JohnnySkittles]

Originally Posted by New Era

No he isn't. Defensemen making more than $8M? One. PK Subban. Defensemen making more than $7M? Six others. Add Weber, Suter, Letang, Campbell, Doughty and Phaneuf. You can add Chara, Karlsson and Pietrangelo for defensemen making over $6M. The only player on this list undeserving of that money is Phaneuf, but he got it because of Toronto hype. When Mark Giordano can parade a Stanley Cup or a Norris Trophy around, I'll say he is worth north of $7M dollars long term.

Bolded are all players that were signed under the old CBA, give them new contracts under the current CBA and Weber, Suter, Doughty, Karlsson are all 8M+

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

Age is a thing. Smart GMs don't break the bank with 33 year old players.

I'm not saying 8x8, but 8M on a 2 or 3 year deal for sure. I don't know if he'll sign for that short though, I imagine he'll want term.

[JohnnySkittles]

delete

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by BrownDrake

I agree but we aren't going to like the return either. He would be going to a contender so you probably get a 1st rounder, 20 to 30 range and a middling prospect. Alternatively you might be able to do a hockey trade for RW in the 27 to 30 range on an expiring contract (Okposo and 2nd rounder???). Remember he has to waive so its going to be a place where he can win.

He's more valuable to us over the next 3 years than we can get in return, overpaying him for 3 years isn't the issue - we just can't sign him for a high cap hit over 6.5 for 6 to 7 years.

lol

he would return substantially more than that

try a 1st, a player, and a blue chip prospect

[BrownDrake]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

lol

he would return substantially more than that

try a 1st, a player, and a blue chip prospect

Really now?
You have a 31 year old for one season and lose him to free agency?

What did we get for Bouwmeester again?

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by JohnnySkittles

I'm not saying 8x8, but 8M on a 2 or 3 year deal for sure. I don't know if he'll sign for that short though, I imagine he'll want term.

I think I read Gio wants this to be a retirement contract, so 6-8 years will most likely be his desired term. He's going to have to accept an AAV of starting with a 6 to make that happen IMO. Barring that, I think Treliving will trade him, as painful as that would be.

[JohnnySkittles]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

I think I read Gio wants this to be a retirement contract, so 6-8 years will most likely be his desired term. He's going to have to accept an AAV of starting with a 6 to make that happen IMO. Barring that, I think Treliving will trade him, as painful as that would be.

Ah... Didn't know that. Love Gio of today but really don't want a 39 year old Gio for a 6M+ contract.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by BrownDrake

Really now?
You have a 31 year old for one season and lose him to free agency?

What did we get for Bouwmeester again?

1) Feaster was a terrible trader and was fired in part due to that trade

2) Bouwmeester was NO WHERE NEAR the player Giordano is when we traded him.

3) he was making $6.8M (or whatever), Giordano is making $4M

A Norris candidate-worthy defenseman, making $4m, is worth a king's ransom.

[BrownDrake]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

1) Feaster was a terrible trader and was fired in part due to that trade

2) Bouwmeester was NO WHERE NEAR the player Giordano is when we traded him.

3) he was making $6.8M (or whatever), Giordano is making $4M

A Norris candidate-worthy defenseman, making $4m, is worth a king's ransom.

Bouwmeester was 2 years younger than Gio is today, was more durable and still probably is.

Conditional 1st rounder, Cundari(career AHLer) and Berra (a normal prospect)

Yah bad trade but your are not getting a 1st rounder and a blue chip prospect plus another prospect for a 31 year old on the last year of his contract.

Sorry, agree to disagree I guess

[Enoch Root]

yeah, let's just agree to disagree

[Flash Walken]

The value in moving Giordano is to a contender coveting his cap hit.

What makes Giordano so valuable is he is a 6 million dollar defender making 4.

A team like Pittsburgh, Washington, Anaheim, Montreal, Chicago or Los Angeles are desperate for players playing above their cap hit, and his addition would likely put any of those teams over the top next year. If Calgary retained 50%, you're talking about adding a potential Norris calibre defender for the price of #6 defender.

7 million dollar Giordano has a remarkably smaller valuation.