Rank The D Prospects

[GranteedEV]

I'm not expecting Acolatse to get qualified tommorow so I'm not including him as a Flames prospect. But I'd probably put him second last on both of these lists:

In terms of pure upside:

1) Oliver Kylington
2) Brandon Hickey
3) Kenney Morrison
4) Brett Kulak
5) Ryan Culkin
6) Rushan Rafikov
7) Rasmus Andersson
8) Keegan Kanzig
9) Tyler Wotherspoon
10) John Gilmour
11) Patrick Sieloff
12) Adam Ollas Mattsson
13) John Ramage
14) Riley Bruce

In terms of how close they are to being NHL-ready currently:

1) Tyler Wotherspoon
2) John Ramage
3) Kenney Morrison
4) Ryan Culkin
5) Brett Kulak
6) Rushan Rafikov
7) John Gilmour
8) Brandon Hickey
9) Patrick Sieloff
10) Rasmus Andersson
11) Oliver Kylington
12) Keegan Kanzig
13) Adam Ollas Mattsson
14) Riley Bruce

Now combining those two lists, with tiebreakers going to the younger player, I get:

1) Morrison - 24pts
2) Hickey - 20pts
3) Kulak - 20pts
4) Culkin - 20pts
5) Wotherspoon - 20pts
6) Kylington - 18pts
7) Rafikov - 18pts
8) Ramage - 15pts
9) Gilmour - 13pts
10) Sieloff - 10pts
11) Andersson - 9pts
12) Kanzig - 7pts
13) AOM - 5pts
14) Bruce - 2pts

I am happy with this list. I welcome Andersson's climb up it as he improves his conditioning and defensive zone awareness. And Kanzig's climb up as he becomes Zdeno Chara not Chris Breen.

[Geeoff]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

wow... there are a lot of guys here that are basically calling Trevling and the Flames management stupid in talent evaluation.

They picked Andersen at pick #53 and passed on Kylington.... full stop. Then 6 other teams passed on Kylington... 2 that picked d-men.

But based on some Central scouting report done 6 months ago that had Kylington highly rated they figure OMG we got a 1st rounder. They just choose to ignore the reports that in some games Kylington was awful... a game changer ... in a bad way.


There can be some arguments made in the abstract about Wotherspoon or Seiloff or Hickey being better or worse because of numerous variables. But in this clear cut case of talent evaluation taking 2 days ago .. the best hockey minds that the Flames can muster made a clear choice that Andersen was better than Kylington.

Flames drafted Sven Baertschi 3 rounds before Johnny Gaudreau. Perhaps, they really thought no one would take Kylington. They obviously liked him because they moved multiple picks to get him. It's entirely possible that the Flames had Andersen ranked below Kylington but picked Andersen first.

[N-E-B]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

wow... there are a lot of guys here that are basically calling Trevling and the Flames management stupid in talent evaluation.

They picked Andersen at pick #53 and passed on Kylington.... full stop. Then 6 other teams passed on Kylington... 2 that picked d-men.

But based on some Central scouting report done 6 months ago that had Kylington highly rated they figure OMG we got a 1st rounder. They just choose to ignore the reports that in some games Kylington was awful... a game changer ... in a bad way.


There can be some arguments made in the abstract about Wotherspoon or Seiloff or Hickey being better or worse because of numerous variables. But in this clear cut case of talent evaluation taking 2 days ago .. the best hockey minds that the Flames can muster made a clear choice that Andersen was better than Kylington.

I'm willing to bet there's a lot of Flames scouts who had Kylington ranked MUCH higher than Andersson. Obviously the majority opinion was take Andersson because he's the safer pick, but that doesn't necessarily mean they all unanimously agreed Andersson was better. They were taken 7 picks apart, so for some of us to think they should have been taken in the reverse order is not outrageous. No one is saying Treliving is an idiot. NO ONE. Go read this forum the past two days, 99.99% of posts about him are praising the work he's done this draft.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by N-E-B

I'm willing to bet there's a lot of Flames scouts who had Kylington ranked MUCH higher than Andersson. Obviously the majority opinion was take Andersson because he's the safer pick

It's also possible that Andersson being a right-handed shot was a big tiebreaker.

[Red Menace]

1- Kylington
2- Hickey
3- Andersson
4- Wotherspoon
5- Morisson
6- Rafikov
7- Kulak
8- Culkin
9- Seiloff
10- Ollas-Matsson
11- Kanzig
12- Gilmour
13- Ramage
14- Acolatse
15- Bruce

[Trailer Fire]

Originally Posted by Red Menace

1- Kylington
2- Hickey
3- Andersson
4- Wotherspoon
5- Morisson
6- Rafikov
7- Kulak
8- Culkin
9- Seiloff
10- Ollas-Matsson
11- Gilmour
12- Ramage
13- Acolatse
14- Bruce

I would put Ollas-Matsson ahead of Kulak and Gilmour above Seiloff. This is pretty much it though.

[jayswin]

How ironic is that Ricardodw is pulling the old "defer to the professionals....full stop" or you're an idiot line, when he's made a whole CP career of thoroughly explaining how he's smarter than the professionals using wacky numbers and crazy stats at every opportunity. Baffling.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Geeoff

Flames drafted Sven Baertschi 3 rounds before Johnny Gaudreau. Perhaps, they really thought no one would take Kylington. They obviously liked him because they moved multiple picks to get him. It's entirely possible that the Flames had Andersen ranked below Kylington but picked Andersen first.

If the Flames had Kylington ranked higher then Andersen what in the world would make them not pick him? Owner interference? Clerical mistake? Too hard a name to say?

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by flameswin

How ironic is that Ricardodw is pulling the old "defer to the professionals....full stop" or you're an idiot line, when he's made a whole CP career of thoroughly explaining how he's smarter than the professionals using wacky numbers and crazy stats at every opportunity. Baffling.

Not at all true..... I am constantly explaining what Burke and now Trevling are doing to build this team.

1) Get rid of Boumeester... check
2) Get rid of Stempniak ... check
3) Play at most 4 small no hitting skilled players.... check (got rid of Tanguay, Cammalleri, Baertschi, Cervenka, Smith, Butler and Babchuck)

They brought in Raymond to be one of the no-hitters but he got bench when Gaudreau was NHL ready.

The reason that they like Anderssen over Kylington probably is the compete level.... Anderson 4/5 ... Kylington 3/5. The whole tyrn around with the Flames is an individual hockey smarts and high compete level.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I'm not expecting Acolatse to get qualified tommorow so I'm not including him as a Flames prospect. But I'd probably put him second last on both of these lists:

In terms of pure upside:

1) Oliver Kylington
2) Brandon Hickey
3) Kenney Morrison
4) Brett Kulak
5) Ryan Culkin
6) Rushan Rafikov
7) Rasmus Andersson
8) Keegan Kanzig
9) Tyler Wotherspoon
10) John Gilmour
11) Patrick Sieloff
12) Adam Ollas Mattsson
13) John Ramage
14) Riley Bruce

In terms of how close they are to being NHL-ready currently:

1) Tyler Wotherspoon
2) John Ramage
3) Kenney Morrison
4) Ryan Culkin
5) Brett Kulak
6) Rushan Rafikov
7) John Gilmour
8) Brandon Hickey
9) Patrick Sieloff
10) Rasmus Andersson
11) Oliver Kylington
12) Keegan Kanzig
13) Adam Ollas Mattsson
14) Riley Bruce

Now combining those two lists, with tiebreakers going to the younger player, I get:

1) Morrison - 24pts
2) Hickey - 20pts
3) Kulak - 20pts
4) Culkin - 20pts
5) Wotherspoon - 20pts
6) Kylington - 18pts
7) Rafikov - 18pts
8) Ramage - 15pts
9) Gilmour - 13pts
10) Sieloff - 10pts
11) Andersson - 9pts
12) Kanzig - 7pts
13) AOM - 5pts
14) Bruce - 2pts

I am happy with this list. I welcome Andersson's climb up it as he improves his conditioning and defensive zone awareness. And Kanzig's climb up as he becomes Zdeno Chara not Chris Breen.

Well done.

I don't entirely agree with the order, but absolutely love the method.

[Da_Chief]

There's a clear top 5 in Kylington, Hickey, Andersson, Morrisson and Wotherspoon. All have top 4 potential imo.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Not at all true..... I am constantly explaining what Burke and now Trevling are doing to build this team.

1) Get rid of Boumeester... check
2) Get rid of Stempniak ... check
3) Play at most 4 small no hitting skilled players.... check (got rid of Tanguay, Cammalleri, Baertschi, Cervenka, Smith, Butler and Babchuck)

They brought in Raymond to be one of the no-hitters but he got bench when Gaudreau was NHL ready.

The reason that they like Anderssen over Kylington probably is the compete level.... Anderson 4/5 ... Kylington 3/5. The whole tyrn around with the Flames is an individual hockey smarts and high compete level.

So by that reasoning, you'd have to have had Gaudreau waaaaaaay down in any forward prospect charts at all times during his development and his NHL upside would have to have been lower than most prospects, after all that's where management picked him.....full stop, right?

I appreciate your passion for the game, but you just don't think things through all the way.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Not at all true..... I am constantly explaining what Burke and now Trevling are doing to build this team.

1) Get rid of Boumeester... check
2) Get rid of Stempniak ... check
3) Play at most 4 small no hitting skilled players.... check (got rid of Tanguay, Cammalleri, Baertschi, Cervenka, Smith, Butler and Babchuck)

They brought in Raymond to be one of the no-hitters but he got bench when Gaudreau was NHL ready.

The reason that they like Anderssen over Kylington probably is the compete level.... Anderson 4/5 ... Kylington 3/5. The whole tyrn around with the Flames is an individual hockey smarts and high compete level.

Flames Trade Jay Bouwmeester - April 1st 2013
Flames don't give Cervenka new contract, signs in Europe - May 16th 2013
Flames don't give Babchuk new contract, signs in Europe - May 28th 2013
Flames trade Alex Tanguay - June 27th 2013

Flames Hire Brian Burke - September 5th 2013

[N-E-B]

Originally Posted by flameswin

How ironic is that Ricardodw is pulling the old "defer to the professionals....full stop" or you're an idiot line, when he's made a whole CP career of thoroughly explaining how he's smarter than the professionals using wacky numbers and crazy stats at every opportunity. Baffling.

Wacky numbers and crazy stats? Are you saying NHL general manager's don't use RGI?

[BruceCody]

NHL-ready right now

01. Tyler Wotherspoon
02. John Ramage
03. Ryan Culkin
04. Kenney Morrison
05. Brett Kulak
06. Brandon Hickey
07. Keegan Kanzig
08. Rushan Rafikov
09. Patrick Sieloff
10. John Gilmour
11. Adam Ollas Mattsson
12. Rasmus Andersson
13. Oliver Kylington
14. Riley Bruce

Sena Acolatse is out

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Flames Trade Jay Bouwmeester - April 1st 2013
Flames don't give Cervenka new contract, signs in Europe - May 16th 2013
Flames don't give Babchuk new contract, signs in Europe - May 28th 2013
Flames trade Alex Tanguay - June 27th 2013

Flames Hire Brian Burke - September 5th 2013

I guess Feaster was trying to hang onto his job by following my advice.

[GoJetsGo]

Wow. Just wow.

It's not just the outlandish things Ricardow thinks and says, it's that he manages to do it with an air of authority that he's the genius while lecturing others about his incorrect assertions and one dimensional contrived ramblings.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

I guess Feaster was trying to hang onto his job by following my advice.

Delusions of grandeur

[Point Blank]

Originally Posted by GoJetsGo

Wow. Just wow.

It's not just the outlandish things Ricardow thinks and says, it's that he manages to do it with an air of authority that he's the genius while lecturing others about his incorrect assertions and one dimensional contrived ramblings.

I just chose to not read his posts. Life on CP is easier that way.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by N-E-B

Wacky numbers and crazy stats? Are you saying NHL general manager's don't use RGI?

are you even suggesting that all GM's and NHL teams do not have some sort of team toughness measurement and standard that they are following? I would hope that it is more extensive and the statistics more accurate and analysis more sophisticated than the little spare time exercise that I put up.


It is just an accident that all successful teams have a few small talented guys surrounded by beef that allows them to use their skills to win hockey games?