CP Mafia 4 - The Unknown Host - Game Over!

[Mazrim]

Vote Count

With 15 alive, it takes 8 votes on any one player to hammer. It takes 5 votes to deadline lynch.

Hasn't Voted (3): SebC, Timbo, Oling_Roachinen

Voted:
dissentowner (3): Hockeyguy15, bizaro86, GGG
Hockeyguy15 (2): Party Elephant, mrkajz44
Timbo (2): dissentowner, Peanut
mrkajz44 (2): East Coast Flame, devo22
Lego Man (1): squiggs96
Party Elephant (1): Lego Man
East Coast Flame (1): Puxlut

The deadline is Friday, June 5th at 10:00 PM Mountain Time.

[SebC]

Question again for the experienced players: have you considered dissentowner to be a "strong player" in previous games?

[Timbo]

Originally Posted by SebC

Question again for the experienced players: have you considered dissentowner to be a "strong player" in previous games?

I would consider him competent. Not strong in the sense of moving and directing but he would hunt. Yet for some reason I feel he is town despite all of his transgressions.
But I have been wrong twice maybe I'm wrong again which is weird because I really felt he was scum earlier.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by SebC

Question again for the experienced players: have you considered dissentowner to be a "strong player" in previous games?

I found him to be a strong player in previous games. He wasn't aggressive compared to someone like oling or GGG or hockeyguy, but he was actively hunting scum and generating ideas. This game he has seemed less engaged and less active hunting scum.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by squiggs96

HG is playing very similar to how Oling did in Super Smash. He's the top poster, in terms of count, and he comes at you with a wave of force. I remember in Smash Oling would comment on what screen I was looking at (I had my setting on open), how long it took to reply, I used the term "contrived deceit", etc.

In this game HG went after my logic when I saw the math didn't add up for how many players were in the game. After I shared my thinking he continued to harp on it until he finally votes for me. He pointed out which people didn't thank Maz's post, prompting Maz to interject that we shouldn't be judged on whether we thanked a post or not. When I made the same mistake in post #595 (not knowing the hosts know all turned players at all times) that Diss made today, it was calmly pointed out to me by HG and devo. It's interesting to see the difference with diss having 4 votes at the time.

I found it odd on Day 1 where HG voted for me, possibly to get a reaction out of me, and when he switched his vote, it was to the guy I had voted for. He even quoted me when he voted for me because he didn't like why I voted for activeStick. If he didn't like the reason I voted for active, why switch it to him? Since that happened I felt like I was being set up. Maybe he was waiting until I got some votes on me and then he'd try and convince others. Maybe it was a coincidence, but I thought it was odd.

Originally Posted by mrkajz44

This made me think of the "XXX" mistake made by Lego. HG seems to latch on to some mistakes and really attacks, but others are let go. Diss is blasted for his error, but Lego just gets a free pass. It really seems like he has an agenda.

Totally agree that I see him mirroring Oling's play in Smash - starts to get on someone's case for something that isn't major and won't let up. He can say its just him being aggressive to hunt scum, but the selective aggression doesn't seem to add up.

Sorry but I'm going to have to do a quick reply here, I came home to find that water had been leaking in the top of my walkout door all day, so thats going to take up my time tonight.

Voting for activeStick had nothing to do with you squiggs, Bizaro had some good points against him so I voted for him to see his reaction.

And yes I do have an agenda, it's hunting hosts. If I think you're a host I am going to scrutinise your posts and if you make a mistake I am going to call you on it. If I don't think you're scum I won't spend as much time calling you out for every little thing.

Sorry for the short answer, I'll expand on it after I deal with this mess.

[SebC]

Another question for the experienced players: Lego Man seems more illogical than he is. Fair assessment? Is he the guy that's often right, but seemingly for the wrong reasons?

That's my memory of what I observed from the other game(s), but I wasn't in them so being less invested I am likely less accurate (and I'm still burning up a lot of hours analyzing this thread, so I am unlikely to get to have a look myself).

[GGG]

Originally Posted by SebC

Another question for the experienced players: Lego Man seems more illogical than he is. Fair assessment? Is he the guy that's often right, but seemingly for the wrong reasons?

That's my memory of what I observed from the other game(s), but I wasn't in them so being less invested I am likely less accurate (and I'm still burning up a lot of hours analyzing this thread, so I am unlikely to get to have a look myself).

I think Lego went out early in the 2nd game. He voted randomly day 1 for completely, turned out he was right. This game he is far mor logical.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by mrkajz44

I'm feeling better about my vote for HG now that I've seen the events of today. HG has pushed people to talk more so he can stop steering the ship. Diss obliges with a couple of long, thought-out posts and HG is right there to jump all over him for one mistake in one of his posts.

As Oling points out, Diss' mistake actually makes him look more town, but HG plows on, continuing referring to Diss as a "strong player" and then bashing his rules mistake

Really, I don't see this as anything but pushing all the focus on Diss, trying to convince others to join his side and vote him out. HG continues to lead the way, scum leading the town around under the guise of "active hunter".

I would rather vote ECF.

As Diss was gaining votes and HG had two votes, ECF comes in and votes for you. I mention in a post that it looks like ECF is trying distract the vote from HG or Diss.

Then HG makes the exact same arguement saying the ECF vote is distracting from the Diss votes with no mention of his. This way if Diss is lynched ECF gains town cred. I need to go back and reread to see HGs other comments on ECF.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by GGG

I would rather vote ECF.

As Diss was gaining votes and HG had two votes, ECF comes in and votes for you. I mention in a post that it looks like ECF is trying distract the vote from HG or Diss.

Then HG makes the exact same arguement saying the ECF vote is distracting from the Diss votes with no mention of his. This way if Diss is lynched ECF gains town cred. I need to go back and reread to see HGs other comments on ECF.

Never mind HG was making the arguement that MrKajz was associated with Diss.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by GGG

I find thus vote interesting,

The vote is 2 Diss, 2 HG, 1 Seb, 1 Lego, 1 Timbo

The push for HG has been going, Seb is been confirmed town, Timbo has said that he feels MrKajz and Diis are pretty scummy. So here ECF puts his vote on MrKajz for basically the same reasoning Timbo posts.

Devo quickly follows up.

Then Bizaro puts pressure back on Diss.

I'm leaning that the MrKajz vote by ECF was a scum vote designed to move discussion away from either Diss or HG. It feels like in the scum thread someone said go put a vote on someone new to get the heat off.

Since the Diss vote evaporated I'm moving onto ECF

unvote
vote ecf

[SebC]

Originally Posted by GGG

I think Lego went out early in the 2nd game. He voted randomly day 1 for completely, turned out he was right. This game he is far mor logical.

So quite possibly I am wrong because of a single, isolated but memorable incident. Thanks.

I can go ECF or HG.

Going to bed.

[Hockeyguy15]

Just a heads up, I am camping starting about 11 on Friday so I won't be around for the deadline. If you're going to lynch me can you do it a little earlier so I will be here for a death post?

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by mrkajz44

I'm feeling better about my vote for HG now that I've seen the events of today. HG has pushed people to talk more so he can stop steering the ship. Diss obliges with a couple of long, thought-out posts and HG is right there to jump all over him for one mistake in one of his posts.

As Oling points out, Diss' mistake actually makes him look more town, but HG plows on, continuing referring to Diss as a "strong player" and then bashing his rules mistake

Really, I don't see this as anything but pushing all the focus on Diss, trying to convince others to join his side and vote him out. HG continues to lead the way, scum leading the town around under the guise of "active hunter".

I find it interesting that you haven't commented on the potential link between you and Diss. Diss barely touched on it, all he said about it was this and I had already explained in the post why I thought he unvoted me and went for Timbo.

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Why would I change my vote to Timbo from you if my sole objective was to stay in the game? The votes were on you just as much as myself and leading the charge against you imo would be easier as you have steered the group into lynching two passengers. I changed my vote because I am more convinced Timbo is scum than you. That does not mean I have changed my mind on you, just trying to help direct the passengers in the right direction so that if I end up lynched they will know where to focus. As a host the smart play on my end would have been to keep the focus on you, not Timbo.

So by not commenting on the potential link between you both and then trying to turn the attention back to me makes me believe I am onto something.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by squiggs96

HG is playing very similar to how Oling did in Super Smash. He's the top poster, in terms of count, and he comes at you with a wave of force. I remember in Smash Oling would comment on what screen I was looking at (I had my setting on open), how long it took to reply, I used the term "contrived deceit", etc.

In this game HG went after my logic when I saw the math didn't add up for how many players were in the game. After I shared my thinking he continued to harp on it until he finally votes for me. He pointed out which people didn't thank Maz's post, prompting Maz to interject that we shouldn't be judged on whether we thanked a post or not. When I made the same mistake in post #595 (not knowing the hosts know all turned players at all times) that Diss made today, it was calmly pointed out to me by HG and devo. It's interesting to see the difference with diss having 4 votes at the time.

I found it odd on Day 1 where HG voted for me, possibly to get a reaction out of me, and when he switched his vote, it was to the guy I had voted for. He even quoted me when he voted for me because he didn't like why I voted for activeStick. If he didn't like the reason I voted for active, why switch it to him? Since that happened I felt like I was being set up. Maybe he was waiting until I got some votes on me and then he'd try and convince others. Maybe it was a coincidence, but I thought it was odd.

As I said yesterday I didn't jump on your mistake because at the time I didn't think you were a host. On the flip side I do think Diss is a host and I think he knows better than to not know the rules, so I pressed the issue.

The reason I switched to activeStick is because bizaro had some good points against him, I thought they made sense and I wanted to see how activeStick reacted. He really didn't do much about it until his hint he was the smuggler and then disappeared. Below is the post from bizaro I am talking about.

Originally Posted by bizaro86

So I voted for ActiveStick originally to hopefully prod him into posting more and voting, so we'd have a record of his actions to refer back to later.

Since then, he's made the following posts:

QUOTE=activeStick;5310591]Are we forcing people to vote here? I'm not convinced of anyone yet to be honest. Don't want to lynch anyone either just to vote someone out.

Leads with a question, then suggests inactivity, which is the number one thing that benefits the scum. If we don't vote someone out, we just get 0.5 days closer to losing every time, and lose our biggest way of gaining knowledge.





Another question about how the game works, which has often been a scum tactic to derail analysis/conversation. Girlysports did this well last game.



Leads with a question again. This concludes three short posts with very little content, basically the same question. Seems designed to get post count up without providing any actual analysis or information that could be used against him later in the game.



Leads with a question again, comments that we need to decide as a group if we should do a lynch or not.

____________________________________

So my comments are that of the 5 posts since I voted for him, 4 start with questions about the game, none have any scum hunting in them, and the general idea seems to be to not lynch, which is a terrible town strategy. Combining that with laying low, innocuous posting to pad post count, and not voting suggests to me that activestick could be scum trying to lay low and not make waves.

I've already voted for him so can't vote again - but have two suggestions.

1) Activestick - vote for someone, and post who you think is scum and why.

2) Passengers - Read through his posts and see what you think. We need to lynch someone and I think he's a strong candidate.[/QUOTE]

[Hockeyguy15]

[QUOTE=bizaro86;5310979]So I voted for ActiveStick originally to hopefully prod him into posting more and voting, so we'd have a record of his actions to refer back to later.

Since then, he's made the following posts:

QUOTE=activeStick;5310591]Are we forcing people to vote here? I'm not convinced of anyone yet to be honest. Don't want to lynch anyone either just to vote someone out.

Leads with a question, then suggests inactivity, which is the number one thing that benefits the scum. If we don't vote someone out, we just get 0.5 days closer to losing every time, and lose our biggest way of gaining knowledge.





Another question about how the game works, which has often been a scum tactic to derail analysis/conversation. Girlysports did this well last game.



Leads with a question again. This concludes three short posts with very little content, basically the same question. Seems designed to get post count up without providing any actual analysis or information that could be used against him later in the game.



Leads with a question again, comments that we need to decide as a group if we should do a lynch or not.

____________________________________

So my comments are that of the 5 posts since I voted for him, 4 start with questions about the game, none have any scum hunting in them, and the general idea seems to be to not lynch, which is a terrible town strategy. Combining that with laying low, innocuous posting to pad post count, and not voting suggests to me that activestick could be scum trying to lay low and not make waves.

I've already voted for him so can't vote again - but have two suggestions.

1) Activestick - vote for someone, and post who you think is scum and why.

2) Passengers - Read through his posts and see what you think. We need to lynch someone and I think he's a strong candidate.

Sorry, quote is messed up because of the activeStick quote he has in there.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by mrkajz44

This made me think of the "XXX" mistake made by Lego. HG seems to latch on to some mistakes and really attacks, but others are let go. Diss is blasted for his error, but Lego just gets a free pass. It really seems like he has an agenda.

Totally agree that I see him mirroring Oling's play in Smash - starts to get on someone's case for something that isn't major and won't let up. He can say its just him being aggressive to hunt scum, but the selective aggression doesn't seem to add up.

I am not so sure Lego is scum at this point, which is why I didn't think anything of the XXX at the time.

I'm not sure why you and squiggs want to say I am playing like Oling, I am not Oling and the way he plays in previous games doesn't apply to me. If you recall I have played like this in past games as well, so if you really want to judge me on previous play maybe you should use my play as a base point, not the way someone else played.

The selective aggression does add up, it's simply if I think you are scum I will be more aggressive with you and if I think you're town I'll do the opposite.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

I am not so sure Lego is scum at this point, which is why I didn't think anything of the XXX at the time.

I'm not sure why you and squiggs want to say I am playing like Oling, I am not Oling and the way he plays in previous games doesn't apply to me. If you recall I have played like this in past games as well, so if you really want to judge me on previous play maybe you should use my play as a base point, not the way someone else played.

The selective aggression does add up, it's simply if I think you are scum I will be more aggressive with you and if I think you're town I'll do the opposite.

It would take a lot to be "sure" someone was scum. Lego does have the XXX, which combined with his posts being big lists with a bit about everybody makes it seem more likely than average that he is scum, especially considering the low post count. I think lists are a way to write a substantive seeming post without taking a strong position or making enemies, which make them a good strategy to stay under the radar.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

It would take a lot to be "sure" someone was scum. Lego does have the XXX, which combined with his posts being big lists with a bit about everybody makes it seem more likely than average that he is scum, especially considering the low post count. I think lists are a way to write a substantive seeming post without taking a strong position or making enemies, which make them a good strategy to stay under the radar.

Making lists with everyone on them is tough when you are scum because you already know who everyone is. You have to manufacture ways to make scum look innocent, and town look guilty. It's much easier to do flyby posts that don't have a lot of content and opinion to them.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

Making lists with everyone on them is tough when you are scum because you already know who everyone is. You have to manufacture ways to make scum look innocent, and town look guilty. It's much easier to do flyby posts that don't have a lot of content and opinion to them.

Interesting, I hadn't thought of that. You do the "list of everyone" tactic once in awhile (which I find less suspicious because you also post comments directly about individuals). Were you still able to do it effectively the game you were scum?