05-29-2015, 12:30 PM
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#461
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#1 Goaltender
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Button isn't shy when he makes his list. Last year he had our 6th round pick ranked ahead of the guy the Canucks took 6th overall
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05-29-2015, 12:52 PM
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#462
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Scoring Winger
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Montreal
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Some posters in the past have assumed that Craig's list coincides with brother Todd's list.
Not sure I believe it, but if so, does this mean someone like Kyle Connor, Brock Boeser or Joel Eriksson Ek might be likely Flames targets?
(As they seem to be higher on his lists than most of the consensus rankings)
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05-29-2015, 01:01 PM
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#463
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Fernando Valley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Menace
Some posters in the past have assumed that Craig's list coincides with brother Todd's list.
Not sure I believe it, but if so, does this mean someone like Kyle Connor, Brock Boeser or Joel Eriksson Ek might be likely Flames targets?
(As they seem to be higher on his lists than most of the consensus rankings)
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I'm sure the brothers talk but I highly doubt that their lists coincide as Todd surely has to keep the general order list under wraps even from his brother. That said I'm sure Craig uses Todd as a sounding board.
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05-29-2015, 01:01 PM
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#464
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary
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My god, if Rantanen fell to 15 I'd freak out. In a good way.
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05-29-2015, 01:10 PM
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#465
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Thunder Bay Ontario
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If Hanafin dropped to 11 and it was Florida's pick, do you think they'd be willing to move down a few spots for an extra pick since they got Ekblad last year, maybe they'd be willing to pass on a D and make a deal
__________________
Fan of the Flames, where being OK has become OK.
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05-29-2015, 01:13 PM
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#466
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Menace
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not a fan of button's lists...
i like the meta lists like Mckenzie, ie list of lists, as the tend to average out individual perceptions based on consensus...
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05-29-2015, 01:25 PM
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#467
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Vancouver
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary
not a fan of button's lists...
i like the meta lists like Mckenzie, ie list of lists, as the tend to average out individual perceptions based on consensus...
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Button's lists are interesting for a couple of reasons. First being that he likely gets some scouting info from his brother so if you read between the lines, you might get a vague read on how the Flames rate the prospects. I am sure he uses other sources as well as his own opinions though.
The other reason I like them is because he at least his opinion and isn't afraid to go out on limbs. I think a lot of media lists are influenced from each other to the point that they are hype driven. Button seems to avoid that, which I can respect.
McKenzie's style is good too of course.
__________________
"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
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05-29-2015, 01:43 PM
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#468
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I believe in the Pony Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary
not a fan of button's lists...
i like the meta lists like Mckenzie, ie list of lists, as the tend to average out individual perceptions based on consensus...
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Sure but that's a different thing.
Comparing McKenzie's list - which is an aggregator, with Button's list - which his singular personal opinion is not apples to apples.
I don't get why people slam Button's lists. It actually shows there is no consensus board. Would folks rather just look at 20 different lists that all have the same names in about the same spot?
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05-29-2015, 01:51 PM
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#469
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Weitz
I don't really buy the "Deepness" of this draft. I get it in the first round.. But I mean people are saying you will be drafting guys in the 50's who usually go in the 30's that just seems ridiculous.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm
So beyond your gut feeling what do you base this post on?
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You mean besides basic principles of probability? The onus of proof is on someone who claims the difference in quality of 18-year-old hockey players varies that dramatically year-by-year.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fotze
If this day gets you riled up, you obviously aren't numb to the disappointment yet to be a real fan.
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05-29-2015, 02:12 PM
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#470
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sunshine Coast
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erick Estrada
I'm sure the brothers talk but I highly doubt that their lists coincide as Todd surely has to keep the general order list under wraps even from his brother. That said I'm sure Craig uses Todd as a sounding board.
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What I found interesting and where there may have been an intentional leak was in 2012 where Craig Button had Jankowski ranked at 14 where our original pick was. When fans would say Mark Who well it could be pointed out that someone had him ranked in the mid first round. Coincidence?
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05-29-2015, 02:15 PM
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#471
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erick Estrada
I'm sure the brothers talk but I highly doubt that their lists coincide as Todd surely has to keep the general order list under wraps even from his brother. That said I'm sure Craig uses Todd as a sounding board.
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I think the most likely scenario is this.
1) Flames scout introduces interesting prospect from less-scouted/less-hyped league to Todd Button. (Jankowski, USHL guys etc)
2) Todd Button scouts player and if he likes player, tells people to check player out (Other Flames scouts, his brother)
No list-leaking, moreso just "okay, let's go watch this team play specifically for this player". And then the players Todd liked just impress Craig / etc too.
__________________
"May those who accept their fate find happiness. May those who defy it find glory."
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05-29-2015, 02:20 PM
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#472
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Vancouver
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It could also just be that being brothers that likely talk about hockey together, they have similar values and evaluate the strengths and weaknesses in a similar fashion. The similarities might not be intentional.
__________________
"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
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05-29-2015, 04:13 PM
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#473
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GranteedEV
I see organizational need as a tie-breaker. Also, a guy like Merkley could easily settle into a role as a RW. Don't forget on our own squad, Hudler, Byron, Colborne were all a few "natural" centers who settled in as wingers.
Totally worth it, I'd also add Mitch Marner and Mathew Barzal to that list. I don't know what I'd give up.
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True about Merkley. He's having a good Memorial Cup by the looks of things.
I've been drawn to Barzal the last few days.
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05-29-2015, 04:18 PM
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#474
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caged Great
I would easily take about 18 different players at #15 and that's before guys like Kylington or Sprong. There simply is too much talent in this draft and it will be very difficult to go wrong. Logically, one of the top 13 players will fall to 15 because every year, strange picks happen. It will just depend who that player is.
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Definitely. At where we're picking Merkley, Connor, Chabot, Meier, Konecky, Svechnikov, and Barzal would all be very good picks.
If we could move up of course and grab a Provorov or Werenski that would be immense, but really with it being such a deep draft guys going 10-15 might be as good as guys going 5-10 in previous drafts or even higher.
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05-29-2015, 08:03 PM
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#475
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JiriHrdina
Sure but that's a different thing.
Comparing McKenzie's list - which is an aggregator, with Button's list - which his singular personal opinion is not apples to apples.
I don't get why people slam Button's lists. It actually shows there is no consensus board. Would folks rather just look at 20 different lists that all have the same names in about the same spot?
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Slam? maybe other people...I just said I am not a fan...
i just prefer the aggregate as opposed to zeroing in on one particular guy like Button or a Damien Cox or any other individual writer from sportsnet, tsn, espn, nhl.com etc because its so subjective...
I didn't think Button did a particularly good job as GM of the Flames, so i don't put any more stock in his list than any other lists...
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05-29-2015, 08:48 PM
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#476
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Calgary, AB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary
I didn't think Button did a particularly good job as GM of the Flames, so i don't put any more stock in his list than any other lists...
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How long ago was he our GM? A decade or more?
Like just about everyone in their profession, I'm sure they get better with time and experience.
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05-29-2015, 08:53 PM
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#477
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Salmon with Arms
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary
Slam? maybe other people...I just said I am not a fan...
i just prefer the aggregate as opposed to zeroing in on one particular guy like Button or a Damien Cox or any other individual writer from sportsnet, tsn, espn, nhl.com etc because its so subjective...
I didn't think Button did a particularly good job as GM of the Flames, so i don't put any more stock in his list than any other lists...
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Button had always had a very good reputation for finding young amateur talent. Managing a team is an entirely different beast
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05-29-2015, 09:01 PM
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#478
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyler
How long ago was he our GM? A decade or more?
Like just about everyone in their profession, I'm sure they get better with time and experience.
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and he's been an analyst ever since...
people can draw their own conclusion on that.
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05-29-2015, 10:30 PM
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#480
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Some kinda newsbreaker!
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Learning Phaneufs skating style
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While Craig Button was with the Stars and North Stars from 1988 to 2000 (where he held the titles of Director of Scouting and Director of Player Personnel), the Stars drafted:
Todd Harvey, Jamie Langenbrunner, Marty Turco, Jarome Iginla, Peter Buzek, Brendan Morrow, Steve Ott
North Stars drafted (where he was listed as a scout, but 4 years later became the director of scouting for the franchise, so maybe safe to say he had a big say in some of their decisions)
Jere Lehtinen, Richard Matvichuk, Roman Turek, Arturs Irbe, Mike Modano, Derian Hatcher
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