QOTD: Are the Flames Underutilizing Backlund?

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Way to cherry pick the one team with a
situation of having two #1 centers.

Okay, then I'll "cherry pick" a few more center pairs that would push Monahan/Bennett to third center or "2A/2B". And by Monahan I mean when he's not sitting between two extremely creative playmaking wingers and shooting at wide open nets:

Johnson/Stamkos
Carter/Kopitar
Bergeron/Krejci
Datsyuk/Zetterberg
Thornton/Pavelski
Getzlaf/Kesler*

*Hate him all we want, but at his peak he was a better player than Monahan has been yet.

I don't like the chances of any team winning a cup with Backlund as their #2 center but that's just my opinion.

Not being a #2 center on a cup contender does not mean his cieling is a #3 center. Generally around 24 of 30 teams ever year are not cup contenders. So not being one of the six best #2 centers (most of which are #1 centers playing #2) does not make him a #3 center.

he's really not an offensively gifted player.

He's not a first line talent or an explosive player but he is certainly offensively gifted. You don't become your team's best possession driver without offensive capability. He's a good passer, a good goal scorer, strong at zone entries, great at creating breakaways, and a good decision-maker. The way people treat his offense you'd think he was interchangable with Stajan.

If you are building a really good team you have him penciled in as your 3rd line center.

That depends on how a team is constructed as a whole. No, Backlund in between a bunch of 3rd line wingers is not good enough for a championship while Malkin probably is. But lines need to be taken as a system and your center doesn't need to be your best forward on a line. You do need strong centers especially at the #1.

Backlund is a good enough part to always be part of a strong 2nd line to never be a weak link. Just to toss out a few top 6s I think would be pretty damn good with a Backlund:

Sharp-Toews-Hossa
Saad-Backlund-Kane

Gaudreau-Monahan-Nash
Hudler-Backlund-Tofolli

Steen-Backes-Oshie
Schwartz-Backlund-Tarasenko

Now does having Bennett (eventually) push Backlund out of the #2 center spot? Yes and he might push Monahan out of #1 too.

[FlatLandFlamesFan]

Not worried about the 1st,2nd line at all ,the 3rd line needs a kick in the arse tho

[nightfx]

Leave the first line as is, I do want more skilled wingers with Backlund though

[GranteedEV]

Anyways, I'm not sold on the first line for 5vs5

The Gaudreau-Monahan-Hudler line has 27 Even Strength points together. Where they really excel is in the power play, where they've thrown up 29 points. So more than half their production is on the power play. Which makes them a beyond-fantastic power play unit, but also means there are some issues they have when space is at a premium.

Consider that The Bouma-Backlund-Jones lines has 18, plus Bouma-Backlund-Colborne line has 8. So the 2nd line has contributed 26 points even strength while the first line has contributed 27.

I think there's something inherently wrong with that when you consider the second line is playing the tougher competition as a checking line and it's certainly not as talented.

The issue I see is size. Hudler and Gaudreau are just not big enough for us to be forcing them together even strength. And Monahan isn't really the kind of player suited to digging pucks out of corners for them; just not his game.

By splitting the two small wingers up I think you'd help their individual games flourish in even strength. Then put them back together as the top powerplay unit where they are nothing short of unstoppable.

[Robo]

backlund, bouma, jones are an excellent shutdown line to put against other teams top players

[Lil Pedro]

Face it, Backlund is a great 2nd-3rd line centre who plays a great two-way game. I don't think the Flames are under-utilizing him, but rather slotting him in the role that they see fit. Think that he could play that role for many years to come in this organization

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

A really good team likely has two interchangable #1 Centers. No Backlund isn't a #1. But he'd be a #2 even on teams like Chicago.

Even Bennett or Monahan would not be 2nd line on the Penguins.

No he wouldn't. I like Backlund, like what he brings but he gets really overrated here. Guy had his best year last year playing 1st line minutes and he still produced more like a very good 3rd line centre which is ultimately what he is. On a cup contending team he is a good 3rd line C.

[killer_carlson]

Backlund is too unreliable health wise. It is difficult to pencil him into a top 6 position knowing he's only good for 75% of the season. You need talent to replace his spot for the next 25% of the games.

Great guy when healthy, but rarely is. A Flames version of Sami Salo.

cant plan to use him more than 3rd line because of health history. When he is healthy, use him all that you can because he'll get hurt again.

[sa226]

Absolutely not.

In fact I think the current setup of our forwards is a big reason for our success. We have a legitimate top line that draws the toughest matchups, which leaves the Backlund line to matchup against whoever Hartley sees fit and likely succeed. It also frees up the bottom six to play some really good minutes. The third line has at times been a catalyst with their speed and forcheck. The Stajan line has given us some great minutes as well. It all trickles down from the top.

If anything Backlund is very versatile and his current place in the lineup is a big reason for our success right now.

[Flash Walken]

What are Josh Jooris' fancy stats compared to Backlund?

I know the big notch in the pro-column for Backlund is his possession metrics. Does Jooris compare?

Tough to evaluate Jooris this year because of a nagging wrist injury, but so far I don't think it's a stretch at all to call him a better offensive threat than Backlund.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Guy had his best year last year playing 1st line minutes

He got off to a slow start for a myriad of reasons, including NOT getting 1st line minutes and generally still trying to get his confidence and footing. He hadn't been having his best year right from the get-go - 2 goals, 5 assists in the first 24 games. Specifically, 10 of those games in which he was under 16 minutes. He had 2 goals, 2 assists in his first 7 but then found himself in the doghouse.

...He then put up 16 goals and 16 assists in the next 52 once he actually got going. That's not third line production. Likewise, he's had 8 goals and 13 assists since returning getting healthy over 30 games. Again not 3rd line production any way you put it.

So ignoring the little stretch to open the season where he shouldn't even have been playing due to injury, that's 24 goals, 29 assists in his last 82 (Healthy) games to go with excellent defense. All while being the team's best possession driver.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

He got off to a slow start for a myriad of reasons. 2 goals, 5 assists in the first 24 games. He hadn't been having his best year right from the get-go.

...He then put up 16 goals and 16 assists in the next 52 once he actually got going. That's not third line production. It's a 50+ point pace.

Likewise, he's had 8 goals and 13 assists since returning getting healthy over 30 games. Again not 3rd line production any way you put it.

So ignoring the little stretch to open the season where he shouldn't even have been playing due to injury, that's 24 goals, 29 assists in his last 82 (Healthy) games.

Great, you know who else had those kind of numbers with that amount of ice time in Toronto? Matt Stajan. Is he a 2nd line centre on a cup contending team too? You can just about get 50 point seasons from any 3rd liner if you feed him the minutes. You can use Backlund as a 2nd line C but ultimately if you have a strong cup contending team you would want him as your 3rd line C.

[#-3]

I guess it doesn't really answer the question about quality of line mates, but he is not being under utilized.

Backlund has only played under 15 minutes in 2 games this year. If we are going to be a cup contender with Backlund he will be a 2/3 center, and he is getting used as such.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Tough to evaluate Jooris this year because of a nagging wrist injury, but so far I don't think it's a stretch at all to call him a better offensive threat than Backlund.

[FlamesAddiction]

Sometimes I think Backlund is both the most under-appreciated and overrated player on the team.

Under-appreciated because he is an ideal 2nd/3rd line centre that is currently 2nd on the team in ice-time and plays in all situations. He is extremely important to the team in this role but is somewhat unheralded by the media and some fans.

Overrated because I don't think his production or skill warrants more even strength time or time on the 1st line, but there always seems to be a contingent of fans that think he isn't being used fairly..

I'm really happy with what we have with him, but I don't expect more either. Once we can make him the 3rd line centre on this team, I think we will be a lot better off.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Great, you know who else had those kind of numbers with that amount of ice time in Toronto? Matt Stajan.

And you know who had those kind of numbers with that amount of ice time in Vancouver? Ryan Kesler. Pretty much the definition of a 2nd line center. Or was Kesler also a 3rd line center?

Or do you really think Stajan is as talented as Backlund?

Is he a 2nd line centre on a cup contending team too?

The last bunch of 2nd line centers on cup winning teams:

Jeff Carter - Actually a 1st liner playing on a 2nd line. Made a cup final as a #1
Andrew Shaw if he was their 2nd line center- A worse player than Mikael Backlund.
Michal Hanzus if he was their 2nd line center - Backlund is better.
Jeff Carter - Actionally a 1st liner playing on a 2nd line.
Bergeron - Actually a 1st liner playing on a 2nd line.
Andrew Ladd - Backlund is about as productive as he was then.
Evgeny Malkin - actually a 1st liner and Hart winner playing on a 2nd line
Henrik Zetterberg - Actually a 1st liner playing on a 2nd line.
Ryan Getzlaf - Actually a 1st liner and recent Hart candidate... playing on a 2nd line

Is Backlund a 1st liner? No. That does not automaticlaly mean he's a 3rd line center.
Is being able to put Backlund on a 3rd line a fantastic luxury? Absolutely. But that doesn't mean he has to be on a 3rd line for a team to be very, very good. Put him on a 2nd line with legit wingers and there's nothing intrinsicly holding the team back.

[Rerun]

No. He's doing just fine as it is.

[madmike]

I wouldn't say they're underutilizing him.

I would say they need much better 2nd line wingers though.

[Knut]

It is good to have him there to go against the other teams top lines and take some of the defensive burden away from Monahan. I think it free's up Monahan offensively quite a bit.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

And you know who had those kind of numbers with that amount of ice time in Vancouver? Ryan Kesler. Pretty much the definition of a 2nd line center. Or was Kesler also a 3rd line center?

Really? Kesler had 75 and 73 points man! That is a helluva lot more than 50 points, lol. Backlund is not as good as Kesler, come on man....