Friedman: Flames, Treliving have to show young guys they want to win at deadline

[Psytic]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

To Leafs:
CGY 1st in 2015
Sven Baertchi
Mason Raymond

To Flames
Phil Kessel
TOR 3rd in 2015

I make that trade.

Id change the pick to 2016 and add Reinhart

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Trading a first round pick and prospect for Kessel is like saying 'win now'. Treleving already said they aren't going to sacrifice their future to win now.

The Flames have a great locker room right now, and I don't want it ruined by bringing in this self-entitled troll who thinks he's above his team.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

Trading a first round pick and prospect for Kessel is like saying 'win now'. Treleving already said they aren't going to sacrifice their future to win now.

The Flames have a great locker room right now, and I don't want it ruined by bringing in this self-entitled troll who thinks he's above his team.

It isn't for "now" as Kessel is signed long term and should produce for a number of years yet

[Badgers Nose]

Its saying win until Phil is 34.

Flames will never draft a player like that during the length of Phil's contract. The team will be top 10 in the league next year. It's going to be 10 years before Flames draft at #4 OA again.

[Imported_Aussie]

Picking up Kessel only makes sense if the Flames can start to actively shed some of their guys under contract in 2016/17 season who are not key players:
Raymond
Stajan
Bollig
Smid
Engelland

That offseason, the Flames will need to renew Giordano, Gaudreau, Monahan, Russell, and will need to make decisions regarding Hudler, Hiller, Ortio, Colborne, Granlund, Jones.
Adding 8M for Kessel makes it hard to keep a valuable guy like Hudler around, if you are paying fringe guys in that first list.

Could it happen? With the speculation that Arizona want guys under contract, and them heavily scouting the Flames, then there is a chance, but a lot of things need to fall into place.

[Badgers Nose]

I think the veteran core of this team is set, and the young core is set. Where Flames need to add is the 24-28 year olds that will be grizzled vets in 3 years when they are contenders and the kids are in their prime.

Phil and Dion fit that almost perfectly. In the right roles on this team they would be solid additions, and they should come cheap.

The TOR media is making the trades in TOR right now. They are stupid so why not buy low?

[BigRed]

If Phaneuf ever wears the flaming C again, i will ... um ... be very, very surprised. (Sidestepping the pube salad metaphor for the moment).

In all serious, he's an entitled, lazy lunkhead who is the exact opposite of the team's 'always earned, never given' credo. He'd be a $7 mln healthy scratch in no time.

Plus, there's no one in the top 4 that he is better than. You want a $7 mln #5 D? No thanks.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by BigRed

If Phaneuf ever wears the flaming C again, i will ... um ... be very, very surprised. (Sidestepping the pube salad metaphor for the moment).

In all serious, he's an entitled, lazy lunkhead who is the exact opposite of the team's 'always earned, never given' credo. He'd be a $7 mln healthy scratch in no time.

Plus, there's no one in the top 4 that he is better than. You want a $7 mln #5 D? No thanks.

Well, I disagree with the majority of what you've said.

Phaneuf is better than Wideman and Russell. Wideman and Russell have a great transition game, but are a weak link in the defensive zone when the opposition has possession. Phaneuf is TOR's #1 guy and he faces stiff competition every night. Giordano and Brodie eat those minutes up here. I think Phaneuf would be a great addition (as always, it depends on the cost though).

I think having Wideman AND Phaneuf would be a mistake, but if our top 4 going forward was:

Giordano - Brodie
Russell - Phaneuf

I think we'd be an improved hockey team without any doubt.

[Jackpot_Smooth]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

I think having Wideman AND Phaneuf would be a mistake, but if our top 4 going forward was:

Giordano - Brodie
Russell - Phaneuf

I think we'd be an improved hockey team without any doubt.

I think this would rely a lot on if dion is willing to accept that he's a number 3-4.

[dammage79]

Phaneuf WAS better than some of the Flames D men, not anymore. This is beyond stupid. Let Iggy and Dion go. Its over.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Well, I disagree with the majority of what you've said.

Phaneuf is better than Wideman and Russell. Wideman and Russell have a great transition game, but are a weak link in the defensive zone when the opposition has possession. Phaneuf is TOR's #1 guy and he faces stiff competition every night. Giordano and Brodie eat those minutes up here. I think Phaneuf would be a great addition (as always, it depends on the cost though).

I think having Wideman AND Phaneuf would be a mistake, but if our top 4 going forward was:

Giordano - Brodie
Russell - Phaneuf

I think we'd be an improved hockey team without any doubt.

$7 million dollar second pairing D-man ... where do I sign?

[Gaudfather]

I doubt that Treliving is going to make any bold moves and certainly not risky ones. He has been very clear that they are staying committed to their development/rebuilding blueprint and will not deal key building blocks or prospects.

I also believe that both Burkie and Treliving know that this is not the year the Flames were going for it in terms of Lord Stanley. If the Flames make the playoffs great, if they can win one round that would be ecxeeding all expectations.

But in terms of trades any that happen are more likely to be minor moves. As fans we like to speculate, but the reality will likely be far more modest in terms of outcomes.

Basically they will let the kids go as far as they can, but, IMHO, management feels no compulsion to have a big trade impact on performance in this year's playoff race.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by nik-

$7 million dollar second pairing D-man ... where do I sign?

$7 million dollar second pairing d-man who is better on the PK and in the defensive zone than our current $5.25 million dollar second pairing d-man.

Seeing as we have a 1st pairing d-man being paid $4.65 million (2nd pairing money) for the next 5 years, it allows us a certain level of flexibility other places in our line-up.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

$7 million dollar second pairing d-man who is better on the PK and in the defensive zone than our current $5.25 million dollar second pairing d-man.

Seeing as we have a 1st pairing d-man being paid $4.65 million (2nd pairing money) for the next 5 years, it allows us a certain level of flexibility other places in our line-up.

Phaneuf isn't better on the PK and defensive zone than our 2.6mil 2nd pairing d-man in Russell.

Wideman and Russell are a great, balanced pairing. Just like the first pairing. Why do people want to swap veterans and mess with that chemistry?

I hope Treliving doesn't make a deal just to make a deal. That's what this Phaneuf proposal is sounding like.

[GioforPM]

I don't know that Phanuef is better than Wideman or Russell - they are all three such different types of players it's hard to compare them (except salary-wise I know Russell is a huge bargain, Wideman may be a tad expensive and Phaneuf is highly overpaid).But as for Phaneuf facing stiff competition? Yeah, but he fails miserably at it. He's just not a good defensive defenceman - just ask Robyn Regher.

[Psytic]

Originally Posted by BigRed

If Phaneuf ever wears the flaming C again, i will ... um ... be very, very surprised. (Sidestepping the pube salad metaphor for the moment).

In all serious, he's an entitled, lazy lunkhead who is the exact opposite of the team's 'always earned, never given' credo. He'd be a $7 mln healthy scratch in no time.

Plus, there's no one in the top 4 that he is better than. You want a $7 mln #5 D? No thanks.

He is the kind of guy thats wants to be the man and I think it would conflict with Gio's leadership. I also dont think his footspeed and hockey sense are good enough for Hartley's system.

[Psytic]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

Phaneuf isn't better on the PK and defensive zone than our 2.6mil 2nd pairing d-man in Russell.

Wideman and Russell are a great, balanced pairing. Just like the first pairing. Why do people want to swap veterans and mess with that chemistry?

I hope Treliving doesn't make a deal just to make a deal. That's what this Phaneuf proposal is sounding like.

TBH I havent liked any of Treliving's aquisitions so far so it wouldn't surprise me. Im not very confident in his ability yet but its still early in his tenure.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by Psytic

He is the kind of guy thats wants to be the man and I think it would conflict with Gio's leadership. I also dont think his footspeed and hockey sense are good enough for Hartley's system.

Yeah, if for some godforsaken reason Phaneuf ends up in Calgary again, I hope Gio and Hartley stop him as he goes to adjust the music and tell him to sit down, shut up and fall in line.

[trublmaker]

Originally Posted by BigRed

If Phaneuf ever wears the flaming C again, i will ... um ... be very, very surprised. (Sidestepping the pube salad metaphor for the moment).

In all serious, he's an entitled, lazy lunkhead who is the exact opposite of the team's 'always earned, never given' credo. He'd be a $7 mln healthy scratch in no time.

Plus, there's no one in the top 4 that he is better than. You want a $7 mln #5 D? No thanks.

thanked for the accurate use of the word lunkhead

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

$7 million dollar second pairing d-man who is better on the PK and in the defensive zone than our current $5.25 million dollar second pairing d-man.

Seeing as we have a 1st pairing d-man being paid $4.65 million (2nd pairing money) for the next 5 years, it allows us a certain level of flexibility other places in our line-up.

Phaneuf has a long term, just like Kessel. No thanks.