it's tiime to deal Ramo

[heep223]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Hiller is the guy that largely put the team in the position they are in. What message does it send the team if you ship him out right in the heat of the playoff race?

A terrible one and they shouldn't do it. I'm just presenting an alternative to the proposal of trading Ramo and calling Ortio up as a pure backup to Hiller, and agreeing with you that Ortio needs to play.

Ideally they do nothing in goal for the time being.

[FAN]

Originally Posted by Dr. Doom

Ramo is not a bad backup

And just where would he be a starter?

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by FAN

And just where would he be a starter?

Edmonton. So would my 8 year old nephew though.

[Diemenz]

People posting that Ortio should be the starter should be banned from the oilers are no good thread because they obviously agree with the oilers development schedule.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Hiller is the guy that largely put the team in the position they are in. What message does it send the team if you ship him out right in the heat of the playoff race?

In the first year of his contract no less.

[Resolute 14]

Can I just point out how great an overreaction the OP is? The premise is that we need to trade Ramo because last night showed that we need a goalie who can steal a game.

Ok, except three things:
1. Hiller has stolen several games for us already this year.
2. Pat Roy in his prime doesn't steal last night's game for the Flames.
3. Ortio has 14 games played in his NHL career. He has not come remotely close to proving that he could steal a game like last night. Particularly given point 2.

[Sylvanfan]

How do you trade a player who has no market? I am sure the Flames are scouring the league and finding no market for Ramo.

[albertGQ]

Unless we can get at least a 2nd rounder for Ramo. I say we keep him for the playoff push. I'd rather lose him for nothing as a UFA than trade him for a 3rd rounder.

We need some security in goal. And Karri provides that

[FlamesAddiction]

I would be all for trading him if we could get a steal of a deal, but not just because it is "time" to do it.

We have a pretty solid tandem right now, with Ortio coming down the pipeline soon. It's nice to have some depth at the position right now and we shouldn't get rid of it easily.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

How do you trade a player who has no market? I am sure the Flames are scouring the league and finding no market for Ramo.

Pretty much. Hiller has been by far the superior goaltender. I guess some fans have more emotional attachment to Ramo but there is no case you can state for Ramo being the better goaltender because the stats disprove that and quite frankly the head coach has disproven that going with Hiller over Ramo for most of the season.

I would like to see Ramo moved but there has to be a team that is interested and I simply don't know how much interest there is for a guy that has a GAA of 2.62 and SV barely over .900. He's clearly backup material at best and the going rate on backup goaltenders is probably a 3rd round pick at best.

[bob-loblaw]

I'd hang on to him and see what happens. I'd still like Ortio to play in the AHL especially if they're in the playoffs. If we get anything more than a fourth round for him I'd be surprised because of lack of demand. Plus even more insurance if we make it into the playoffs.

[GranteedEV]

- No, there's no real need to trade Ramo. He's a solid NHL backup and he's won his share of games over the last two seasons. If someone wants him, cool, but you don't go shopping him like he's a problem, that pretty much just hurts his chances of getting a contract next year. His expiring along with Glencross' expiring are still of value in resigning guys like Backlund and Jooris, so you especially don't wanna take back any contracts. If a team dangles a pick for him, that's awesome, but extremely unlikely.

- No, the Flames aren't expecting to win the President's Trophy or Stanley Cup this year. Whatever happens this trade deadline has to be all about developing a competitive team for a few years into the future, when Monahan, Bennett, Gaudreau, Baertschi, Hickey, Wotherspoon, Rafikov, Poirier are all around to help the team compete.

- No, there's no real concern about "putting pressure" on Ortio either. He revels in that kind of situation, so if he were given the starting role he would be stoked about the challenge. That said, in ADK he gets more games plain and simple, whereas here he'd be splitting time with Hiller. He'll be here full time next year anyways, so there's no real concern unless Hiller/Ramo both start having consecutive stinkers.

- The farm team needs a starter too, if we want them in the playoffs which would be the best development for the guys down there (we... DO have guys down there). Next year they'll probably bring either McDonald or Gillies into the farm team, but right now they have only AHL backups. Which is okay, but not going to get the deep deep.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Unless he's being traded for another goaltender, I don't see the point. The organization needs three capable of playing at the NHL level.

[Huntingwhale]

No need at all to trade Ramo now. Ortio's 1way contract kicks in next season. He'll be here soon enough. Let him ripen in the AHL. Ramo might be a UFA after this season, but no need to trade him for a low return just to get something back. He's worth more to us now then he is a low draft pick. Ortio got a taste of the bigs and now he's back down working on what he needs to do to improve. Playoffs this season are a bonus. Stay the course.

[TSXCman]

People on this site are crazy with the goalies... one day it's Hiller should be shipped, the next it's Ramo. It's always after a loss too.

isn't this a position that deserves a larger sample size with many situations (back-to-backs, etc) to get a proper idea?

[thymebalm]

My issues with the goalies are the same as always,

Hiller plays too deep in the net. Ramo can be too aggressive.

Ortio looks to have the compact, Kipperesque-style but is still prone to blowouts and losing his concentration.

I'm super happy however, as this tandem (tri-andem?) is way better than last years mix of Ramo, Berra, MacDonald, and Ortio.

I do think it's probably prudent to either sign Ramo before the deadline or trade him, strictly from an asset management stand-point. I feel the same way about the majority of our UFAs, of course.

[BACKCHECK!!!]

Goalie are voodoo.

Never trust a goalie prospect or reclamation project until he is actually starting and posting .916+

Don't let go of one monkey bar, until you've got a firm hold of the next one.

[CSharp]

After watching last night's game, it's obvious that Hiller is NOT the goalie going forward. You can tell a difference between Hiller vs Ramo and how they protect the net. Both are butterfly goalies, however, Hiller doesn't challenge anyone but stays in the blue paint area covering only down low. His inability to move quick laterally is what makes him a weaker goalie than Ramo, IMO. After replacing Hiller after the 4th goal, you can clearly see a difference in how Ramo challenges the shooter further out of the net so he effectively takes away a lot of the upper shots. I still think Ramo and Ortio is a better combo than Hiller and Ortio.

[CSharp]

Originally Posted by TSXCman

People on this site are crazy with the goalies... one day it's Hiller should be shipped, the next it's Ramo. It's always after a loss too.

isn't this a position that deserves a larger sample size with many situations (back-to-backs, etc) to get a proper idea?

The goalie position right now is a luxury that the Flames have. Both goalies right now are good enough to be on any team as a starter or as an alternate full time. No question about that. The only thing that kind of skews how good they really are is how many block shots don't make it to the net. However, after last night's shellacking by the Pens, it was evident that the Flames had absolutely no puck possession skills at all. Based on last night's goals in Hiller, all the goals were with him sitting tight just inches in front of the goal crease with the puck going east/west and upstairs past him. With him not challenging shooters and just staying close to the net, everyone in front also has to stay down low to help out. Practically most of the game was in the Flames zone except for the times they were on the powerplays. It's not like this just happened last night. This has been on most night against other elite teams. So, do the Flames need Hiller? I really don't care, but I think the team will be go through a better rebuild with Ramo and Ortio.

[Rerun]

Since we are rebuilding... we are still rebuilding, right? Isn't getting even a 4th round draft pic for Ramo better than losing him to free agency and getting nothing?

Or does the playoff push trump the rebuild?