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Old 01-28-2015, 02:10 PM   #1
Tiger
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Default drafty fireplace

my new house has a really drafty fireplace, which you can really feel on cold days. Underneath the fireplace on a cold day (-18°C outside) the air was 0.4°C. makes the living room cold if we don't block the vent. It is not the insulation as the IR camera showed no issues. I'm already discussing it with the builders but does anyone have any other advice?
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Old 01-28-2015, 03:09 PM   #2
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Is the flue open?
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Old 01-28-2015, 03:12 PM   #3
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Your first mistake was building a house so far away..
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Old 01-28-2015, 03:58 PM   #4
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Quote:
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Is the flue open?
it is a direct vent, so to my understanding should not have drafts coming from the bottom.
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Old 01-28-2015, 04:09 PM   #5
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Maybe you should start a fire
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Old 01-28-2015, 05:45 PM   #6
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I am assuming you are talking about a gas insert?

I'd say our home always has a bit of a draft from the area of the insert. I always thought this was normal given the proximity to the venting outside.

I'll keep an eye on this discussion for an eert opinion - this has the making of a Holmes on homes episode
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Old 01-28-2015, 06:23 PM   #7
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Is the fireplace in a kickout by chance?
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Old 01-28-2015, 06:29 PM   #8
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Sounds like a breach somewhere in the envelope and or insulation. How cold was the outside temp when the IR camera was used?

Ir works best when indoor and outdoor temperatures are vastly different. I've brought in IR tech before but only at a minimum of -5 outside temp. Also, IR camera should be used from the outside to check heat loss, not only inside to check cold infiltration.
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Old 01-28-2015, 07:40 PM   #9
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It was about -10 when the ir was done. So it was am good time. There was no evidence of insulation issues but the guy noted he could feel the Draft when standing about 6' away. Basically the live room floor is too cold to be there unless the bottom vent is blocked. When the air underneath was about 0c the glass of the fireplace above that was still 12C. I expect the glass to be cooler. Much like a window. But underneath should not have cold air blowing in
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Old 01-28-2015, 09:14 PM   #10
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Maybe the pilot light was keeping the glass a bit warmer?
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Old 01-29-2015, 08:29 AM   #11
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No pilot light in this model
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Old 01-29-2015, 09:34 AM   #12
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No pilot light in this model
I asked above but is the fireplace in a kick out/ dog house?
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Old 01-29-2015, 01:28 PM   #13
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Yes it is in a kick out
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Old 01-29-2015, 03:45 PM   #14
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I had the same issue in my old place. I ended up selling the house so I don't have a resolution for you but I believe this is a common problem with fireplaces in a kickout. This was one of the threads that I followed: http://www.diychatroom.com/f103/fixi...ickout-136389/

Good luck
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Old 01-29-2015, 07:24 PM   #15
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These areas are generally dealt with by the drywall company's "IPD" crew at the "mech" stage of insulation/drywall. Depending on the drywall company's diligence in the training of these people, you may have R "this, that, or the other thing"- in the bumped out area that houses the unit in question. The integrity of the vapour barrier envelope is also questionable as the mech trades generally just "hack and slash" when they are doing the rough in. Too boot? The floor of the space is sitting on "cantilevered" joists-which are extended past the foundation wall- and the underside of this area is probably improperly insulated as well. Minimum code in this application calls for R28 to the underside and R12 to the rimboard areas. My guess is you have a piece of R5 foam nailed to the underside and the "insulator" (LOL) who did your basement rammed R 20 batts in as best as he could, stapled a piece of poly to the top plate and shoved it out into the voids in the joist spaces. The space with the gas line feeding into it will (most likely) have nothing blocking the cold rim board. The side rims are (most probably) uninsulated as well. This is the nature of the business...everyone is on "piece work" and joist ends/cantilevers suck major balls, when you're getting paid by the square foot. 200 feet of material at $0.28 = $56.00 and it's a 5-6 hour job (in some cases) to "do it right". With the current climate (I'm speaking as someone who is "boots on the ground" in this industry-can you tell?) of home building and the lack of supervision in the trade, this is going to be a common matter.
Get in, get out, get cheque...on to the next one.
It is what it is.

I am currently running 5 piecework crews (plus my own crew), insulating new build houses for two of the larger drywall companies in the Greater Edmonton area. My piecework people are all self trained and do it properly (to the best of their abilities) but the fireplace and bathtub area's are beyond our control to do anything with... these are done prior to us ever getting on site.
One of the company's IPD people are very good...the other company?
Not so much.

I work a bunch of "small scale" builders (direct) as well and I do the "IPD" stages, concurrent with the framing. Rim joists and Cantilevers are insulated once the floor joists are up, but before the floor is sheeted. I charge trip charges plus time and materials for these and do all of this myself. These builders recognize (and are more than willing to compensate me for) the attention to detail. None of the people who bought a house from these guys will ever come complaining about the envelope in their house. It costs the builder another $500 (on average), to buy the peace of mind of which I speak.
In their minds eye?
It's money well spent...

The thing is?

There is really ONLY one time to get this done properly. When the house is at this stage of construction.
Retrofits are intrusive and thereby? Expensive.
Anyone considering a new build in the Greater Edmonton area can PM me (at any time) with regards to the builder you are considering (I see about 35-40 different ones per year) . High, Mid, Entry? We do most of them.
Coventry
Sabal
Landmark
Dolce Vita
Bedrock
Kimberly
Infiniti Masterbuilt
Perry Signature
Perry Tapestry
Carriage Signature
Hillview
Dream Homes by Krisner
Homes by Sidney
KC Construction
M&M Construction
Look
Thomsen Homes
Streetside
Cobblestone
Christensen Developments (CDL-AKA "Can-Der")
Homes by Avi
Kazia
D&A Construction
Kate Park Developments
Impact Homes (Coventry entry level)
Plus dozens of 2-3 houses a year guys... that I won't elaborate on.

Not an advertisement... but my company also offers full service drywall from Ipd to texture. Solid board crew, great taper, constant COMMUNUICATION. Full service frost walls (framed and insulated) at competitive rates.

FWIW...
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