Actually at 3.15M flat for the next few years and a salary cap of around 70M his salary is essentially at the NHL average, and soon to be below.
I think if you add up the tinkle trunk of things that Stajan brings to the table and I'd say he's at least an average NHL player, and maybe even a hint above.
If he was making 5M I'd likely be on the other side of the argument.
Take a veteran like Tanguay who was making what 5M? He had more production, but was rumoured to be brutal in the room, not physical, and brutal in his own zone. Not sure I'd ever want Tanguay over a Stajan at the same dollar total (realize the timing of this with his strong season in Colorado is ill advised, but then production was never his problem)
I think Stajan and Byron are good swivel pieces. I think the cp poster's annoyances with these players is that they want specialist players with an anchored spot. This is perhaps why we don't crap on Bouma?
That being said, is there a clear whipping boy yet this year? It looks like there's a Byron and Stajan shindig going on now that Setoguchi is gone and Bollig/Eggs is a boring topic to get rowdy to. Or overall... lots of discussion due to equal distribution of annoyances. Toss Raymond and Sven into the mix everyone! It's more fun that way!
Yeah - it seems there is a certain segment of fans out there that's always looking to whoop on somebody - just don't get it.
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Yah, he's a dick, but he's our dick
Actually at 3.15M flat for the next few years and a salary cap of around 70M his salary is essentially at the NHL average, and soon to be below.
I think if you add up the tinkle trunk of things that Stajan brings to the table and I'd say he's at least an average NHL player, and maybe even a hint above.
If he was making 5M I'd likely be on the other side of the argument.
Take a veteran like Tanguay who was making what 5M? He had more production, but was rumoured to be brutal in the room, not physical, and brutal in his own zone. Not sure I'd ever want Tanguay over a Stajan at the same dollar total (realize the timing of this with his strong season in Colorado is ill advised, but then production was never his problem)
Fair enough. Admittedly, I've never been a fan of Stajan since his Maple Leaf days, and personally I'd like to see him off the team (not because of his veteran presence / locker room contributions though)... but I can respect and understand a well-stated argument like yours.
Fair enough. Admittedly, I've never been a fan of Stajan since his Maple Leaf days, and personally I'd like to see him off the team (not because of his veteran presence / locker room contributions though)... but I can respect and understand a well-stated argument like yours.
Hey I'm not immune either.
I have a serious dislike for Curtis Glencross. He's productive, plays on the first line but all I see is a turn over machine, and a guy that takes stupid penalties!
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Unless the Flames are a cap team, salary has no bearing on my opinion of a player. So it doesn't factor in for me with Stajan (or Raymond or Wideman for that matter). Salary at term could become a factor with Stajan, but that's a future issue.
All I know is that I was always nervous when the 4th line was in the D-zone. Now, I'm not (now it's only when the 3rd D pairing is out). And in fact I love it when the other team matches 4th lines with the Flames.
I'm a bit surprised with all the support that Stajan gets by some people. I admit he has been fine as the 4th line player, but Hartley puts him on the 4th line (and the occasional healthy scratch) and hardly on the top 3 lines for a reason. I think the fact that he has gone through some terrible personal issues causes people to defend him more than they would otherwise. I wouldn't trade him during the season, because doing that when his wife is 8 month pregnant would be a dickish move by the organization, but I have absolutely no issue with the Flames trading him during the off-season.
The Flames have too many other younger/cheaper guys that are capable at handling a 4th line center role. Maybe they will not be as good as Stajan is right now, but it will be better asset management to have lower cap and younger player on the 4th line. Shore and Jooris are two guys that could be doing that right now, but both are healthy scratches.
I'm a bit surprised with all the support that Stajan gets by some people. I admit he has been fine as the 4th line player, but Hartley puts him on the 4th line (and the occasional healthy scratch) and hardly on the top 3 lines for a reason. I think the fact that he has gone through some terrible personal issues causes people to defend him more than they would otherwise. I wouldn't trade him during the season, because doing that when his wife is 8 month pregnant would be a dickish move by the organization, but I have absolutely no issue with the Flames trading him during the off-season.
The Flames have too many other younger/cheaper guys that are capable at handling a 4th line center role. Maybe they will not be as good as Stajan is right now, but it will be better asset management to have lower cap and younger player on the 4th line. Shore and Jooris are two guys that could be doing that right now, but both are healthy scratches.
Two words for you: Cap. Floor. We already have lower cap hits and younger players on our top two lines, and likely will get even younger and cheaper over the next couple of years. What you are describing is something you do once you are near the cap and you're paying all your top players premium dollars. That's not where we will be for the next 3 years, which is why Stajan was signed to that contract in the first place.
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"You know, that's kinda why I came here, to show that I don't suck that much" ~ Devin Cooley, Professional Goaltender
The Flames have too many other younger/cheaper guys that are capable at handling a 4th line center role. Maybe they will not be as good as Stajan is right now, but it will be better asset management to have lower cap and younger player on the 4th line. Shore and Jooris are two guys that could be doing that right now, but both are healthy scratches.
Jooris hasn't been a healthy scratch - he's been an unhealthy one.
And it partly was when Jooris was centering the 4th line that they had big issues. Jooris is good at faceoffs, good at forechecking, not as good at defensive zone coverage.
And you need older guys throughout the lineup, including the 4th line. Who cares how much they are paid as long as the team can afford it and they aren't hurting the team cap-wise?
Location: F*** me. We're so f***ing good, you check the f***ing standings? Lets f***ing go! F***ing practice!
Exp:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan
Two words for you: Cap. Floor. We already have lower cap hits and younger players on our top two lines, and likely will get even younger and cheaper over the next couple of years. What you are describing is something you do once you are near the cap and you're paying all your top players premium dollars. That's not where we will be for the next 3 years, which is why Stajan was signed to that contract in the first place.
Come on, you can't really think that way. We will certainly hit the cap floor without Stajans contract.
Bolded are the guys that will certainly get a raise if kept.
What do you think he'd get on a 2 year bridge? 3m? 3.5?
On a 2 year bridge, my guess would be $2.5-$3M first year, and $3.5-$4M second year, for a cap hit of $3 - $3.5M, more likely at the bottom end of that.
(so I guess exactly what you said )
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Personally I wohld want to sign both Johnny and Monahan to 2-4 year bridge deals so they are still RFA after those deals expire then lock them up for full 8
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)
