[Rumour] Dreger: Hall is the face of the Oiler's culture problem. I expect him to be shopped - Page 22 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Coach · 12-19-2014, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

I've felt for a few years that Sharks needed to do something bold. Logan Couture + 2nd + crappy prospect for Hall. He could kill it like Cheechoo with Thornton for a couple years, then they could flip him at his ceiling before Joe falls apart. Not sure he's the right fix for what seems to be a locker room with strange leadership.

Couture is better at hockey than Taylor Hall.

If I was San Jose, trading my near-future top-line centre for a troubled offensive winger would not be on my short list.

I agree San Jose should make some moves, but I wouldn't do that straight up, much less add to Couture. If San Jose should trade anyone, it should be Thornton and Marleau.

Flash Walken · 12-19-2014, 02:52 PM

Couture is so much better than Hall I don't think Hall + 2nd round pick gets San Jose to answer the phone.

Resolute 14 · 12-19-2014, 02:54 PM

Logan Couture was .83PPG last year, and is .85PPG this season, plays a more important position and is much better at the overall game. Even if Hall can be trusted to be a point per game player, that is not enough of a scoring upgrade for me to even consider Couture straight up, let alone throwing anything else in.

Locke · 12-19-2014, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

I think something centred around Ryan O'Reilly could make sense...they'll have to overpay him in a couple years, but he was keen enough to come to YYC a couple years ago...ROR+Barrie for Hall and a prospect that doesn't have total Oiler stink yet?

I've felt for a few years that Sharks needed to do something bold. Logan Couture + 2nd + crappy prospect for Hall. He could kill it like Cheechoo with Thornton for a couple years, then they could flip him at his ceiling before Joe falls apart. Not sure he's the right fix for what seems to be a locker room with strange leadership.

Has J Staal's NTC kicked in yet? All those guys also make $6M.

Thats not bold, thats stupid. You trade your up-and-coming stud centreman who is going to replace Joe Thornton for Taylor Hall?

I cant imagine an offer that doesnt make Doug Wilson laugh himself into a hernia.

Flash Walken · 12-19-2014, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Logan Couture was .83PPG last year, and is .85PPG this season, plays a more important position and is much better at the overall game. Even if Hall can be trusted to be a point per game player, that is not enough of a scoring upgrade for me to even consider Couture straight up, let alone throwing anything else in.

isn't couture like a year and a half older than hall as well?

Just dumb.

Coach · 12-19-2014, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

isn't couture like a year and a half older than hall as well?

Just dumb.

But he wasn't drafted 1st overall, and therefore has less value than Taylor Hall years after their draft.

/Oilerlogic.

foshizzle11 · 12-19-2014, 03:26 PM

does anyone think that Hall will return another 1st line forward, centre or not or a 1st pairing Dman?

I find that hard to believe even though he could get you 80 points in a season or possibly more on a more successful team. I am not trying to under value him, but I don't think other teams would give up one of those things for him. Doesn't seem possible. I know I wouldn't trade Bennett or Monahan for him or Gio or Brodie. Others i would consider but not our top guys.

killer_carlson · 12-19-2014, 03:28 PM

Yes, despite what is being said here, Hall will either bring back a top line forward or blueliner in a Heatley for Hossa type trade, or he will bring back a glut of organizational depth, in a Phaneuf for Toronto's leftovers type deal.

Dan02 · 12-19-2014, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by foshizzle11

does anyone think that Hall will return another 1st line forward, centre or not or a 1st pairing Dman?

I find that hard to believe even though he could get you 80 points in a season or possibly more on a more successful team. I am not trying to under value him, but I don't think other teams would give up one of those things for him. Doesn't seem possible. I know I wouldn't trade Bennett or Monahan for him or Gio or Brodie. Others i would consider but not our top guys.

Quite honestly a first line winger is not worth a equal first line center or first pairing defensemen. You might get a equal swap across for another winger or get a second line centre/defensemen+

stemit14 · 12-19-2014, 04:13 PM

How about this... Taylor Hall to the penguins with 50% salary retained in exchange for Derek poulliot, a first round pick, and maybe beau Bennett/nick spaling. The only issue would be that the penguins would probably prefer a right winger. Maybe eberle instead but it would be tough to get any of that for eberle.

JohnnySkittles · 12-19-2014, 04:22 PM

If they retain 50% of his salary they could get alot more then that.

JiriHrdina · 12-19-2014, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnySkittles

If they retain 50% of his salary they could get alot more then that.

I REALLY doubt they would do that.

GioforPM · 12-19-2014, 05:40 PM

I don't see Hall for Ryan O'Reilly straight up unless O'Reilly wants out.

stemit14 · 12-19-2014, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnySkittles

If they retain 50% of his salary they could get alot more then that.

Poulliot is a former 8th overall pick whose being slowly and properly developed into a top 4 NHL defenseman... Maybe even a top 2. He's nearly a ppg in his rookie season as a pro in the AHL... As a defenseman. He has size, hockey IQ, and high end puck moving/offensive skills. All that adds up to a lot of potential in an already well-developed prospect. The penguins have lots of great defensemen... Part of the reason why they have been able to be so patient developing him.

Plus a first round pick in a deep 2015 draft and possibly another former first round pick in beau bennett. This is a huge package for any player. Definitely wouldn't consider it an underpayment for hall.

Walter Reed · 12-19-2014, 05:51 PM

Never say never, but I can't foresee the Oilers moving Hall during this season.
Once an evaluation is done at seasons end maybe .......

Flash Walken · 12-19-2014, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walter Reed

Never say never, but I can't foresee the Oilers moving Hall during this season.
Once an evaluation is done at seasons end maybe .......

I thought they did their 'forensic analysis' and fired the goalie coach.

Walter Reed · 12-19-2014, 07:47 PM

Their problems clearly run much deeper than simply a goalie coach

Hackey · 12-19-2014, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I don't think I am. I think a winger is almost always of less value than a defenceman or centre of equal skill. Teams whose best player is a winger don't do as well as teams whose best skater is a centre. Sid and Ovie were considered pretty close in value at one time. Not any more, and ordinary wingers turn into scorers on the Pens. The Flames had the best winger in the game and didn't do that well. On the other hand, crap teams added a Pronger and became contenders.

It's one reason I'd take RNH over Hall.

Take Kane and Toews. Close in value but what probably gives Toews the edge is his intangibles like leadership. I don't think the fact that he is a center is what creates his value. Getzlaf and Perry are close as well. Getzlaf has an edge with playmaking and production but Perry is a pure goal scorer which has its own value combined with his physical edge as well. Both duos are extremely important to their teams and bring elements the other doesn't. I don't think you value Toews or Getzlaf more because they are centers. Its what the actual player brings and more importantly what a team needs. The Flames didn't do so well because of the team, not the fact that their best player was a winger. If they traded Iginla for a center of equal value the team likely produces similar results.