2014-2015 Blue Jays Off-Season Thread

[bluejays]

I agree, IF they use that money on signing a guy like Lester. Melky's bat was a really nice threat to have to keep pitchers honest. Melky wasn't great on the field, I wholeheartedly agree - I just don't think that cost us much by way of runs compared to how much more he contributed with the bat.

As for this deal, the part I'm most disappointed with is that he's injury prone. When he inevitably gets put on the 60 day DL, we can't say we didn't see this coming. That part is frustrating as a fan because it seems to be the annual excuse, "if we were healthy..." when the reality is if you get guys who are injury prone, you get what you pay for on average.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by fleury

I agree, IF they use that money on signing a guy like Lester. Melky's bat was a really nice threat to have to keep pitchers honest. Melky wasn't great on the field, I wholeheartedly agree - I just don't think that cost us much by way of runs compared to how much more he contributed with the bat.

I think Saunders and Melky are pretty comparable to be honest and I could make a case for Saunders being better. He's a better defender to be sure, Saunders defensive profile is basically that he's a poor CF and average RF. I have to imagine that moving to LF will only help in that regard since it's the lowest position of defensive imporantance in the outfield. As far as batting goes...

.301/.352/.458 - OPS: .810
.273/.341/.450 - OPS: .791

... the top line is Melky the bottom Saunders, that is an incredably close, a mere .019 difference in OPS. Considering that Melky played in the hitter friendly Skydome while Saunders played in the vast expanse of Safeco I'd say that if you normalize the run environment Saunders comes out ahead. And you can add better baserunnering into that mix as well.

Originally Posted by fleury

As for this deal, the part I'm most disappointed with is that he's injury prone. When he inevitably gets put on the 60 day DL, we can't say we didn't see this coming. That part is frustrating as a fan because it seems to be the annual excuse, "if we were healthy..." when the reality is if you get guys who are injury prone, you get what you pay for on average.

Meh, going off the past two years (so as to not punish Melky for the PED suspension) Melky has played 227 games (234 if you include his MILB rehab games), Saunders 210 (225). So still not much difference.

Now Melky is a switch-hitter and Saunders bats exclusively left and he has the platoon split normally associated with handedness (so that's a point in Melky's favor) Saunders is a good enough hitter that he's merely average against lefties (but a great bat against righties). Fortunately for the Blue Jays Kevin Pillar has the opposite afflication (He's average to above average against lefties but pretty bad against righties) so if the Jays are concerned about his health they can aide his health by giving him the occasional extra day off against lefties (They won't run a strict platoon he's not like Lind who couldn't hit a lefty to save his life) and suffer no ill effects on the field.

[secol]

those numbers are based on saunders last year. before last year he wasn't great at the plate. in fact he was substantially worse in terms of his BA, although he still had decent OBP numbers.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by secol

those numbers are based on saunders last year. before last year he wasn't great at the plate. in fact he was substantially worse in terms of his BA, although he still had decent OBP numbers.

And decent slugging, there's some thunder in that bat. Guy who gets on base and hits the ball hard? Yes please. Guy who does that and plays decent D? Yes pretty please.

Really happy to see LF taken care of like this. Just gotta take care of 2B (sign Lowrie please) trade Navarro for a solid RH relief pitcher and that's it the Jays are set.

I'm not terribly happy about the prospect of Smoak playing 60ish% of our games but I can live with it.

[secol]

from baseballreference, the average stats of a LF in 2014

AVG, OBP, SLG, OPS
.257.322.402.724
Saunders was a bit above average last year, but the prior years were about average (slightly below)

[secol]

also i hate to be a pessimist since i like the trades so far, but i can't help seeing the similarity between donaldson and freese

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by secol

from baseballreference, the average stats of a LF in 2014

AVG, OBP, SLG, OPS
.257.322.402.724
Saunders was a bit above average last year, but the prior years were about average (slightly below)

Yeah, he's not a super-star but he is an above average baseball player... just like Melky was (and he only costs 25% of what Melky will end up making this year) Gotta take into account the park effects, he'll be moving from playing half his games in the 30th ranked hitting environment to a top 10 hitting environment (Plus the added away games at homer friendly Yankee Stadium and Fenway).

[secol]

i agree with that point.....but some posters were saying the dropoff in the bat isn't big, but in reality it is big. cabrera was a legitimate top of the order bat where saunders is a bottom of the order guy. whether or not the $ savings is worth the dropoff (once the improved fielding/baserunning is taken into account) is debatable

[bluejays]

I know with these apparently moves the Jays are really going for it, but why do I get the impression that one of Encarnacion or Bautista are going to be dealt? If they want to shore up some money and maybe even out their roster, I'm thinking Bautista goes in a blockbuster somehow.

[Caged Great]

Originally Posted by secol

i agree with that point.....but some posters were saying the dropoff in the bat isn't big, but in reality it is big. cabrera was a legitimate top of the order bat where saunders is a bottom of the order guy. whether or not the $ savings is worth the dropoff (once the improved fielding/baserunning is taken into account) is debatable

I would agree with you if the Jays didn't already get Martin and Donaldson prior to this move. Their top 5 will be Reyes, Martin, Bautista, EE, and Donaldson.

[Jason14h]

The Jays OF was terribad at D last season. The fact that Bautista and Cabrera have the ability to make great looking catches (that other fielders easily could have made without diving) hides that actual D problems from the naked eye.

Range factor was embarassing for our whole OF. Look what great OF D can by looking no further then KC

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by secol

i agree with that point.....but some posters were saying the dropoff in the bat isn't big, but in reality it is big. cabrera was a legitimate top of the order bat where saunders is a bottom of the order guy. whether or not the $ savings is worth the dropoff (once the improved fielding/baserunning is taken into account) is debatable

Saunders is going to be hitting middle of the order for sure. He is a plus fielder (much better than Melky) and I wouldn't be surprised to see him hit more then 20 bombs with a decent slash line in the AL east.

As a whole the jays are much better positionally and more balanced offensively then last year already with more moves likely to come.

[d_phaneuf]

Originally Posted by fleury

I know with these apparently moves the Jays are really going for it, but why do I get the impression that one of Encarnacion or Bautista are going to be dealt? If they want to shore up some money and maybe even out their roster, I'm thinking Bautista goes in a blockbuster somehow.

those two are on incredible deals, arguably underpaid by a combined 20m

[seattleflamer]

This twit from one of the local sports shows quoting the Times' Mariners beat reporter. If true, a bit easier to take:

Happ is due $6.7m in 2015. Divish tells @1090TheFan that TOR is chipping in, perhaps as much the difference between Saunders-Happ deals.

https://twitter.com/ProspectInsider/...66904289869824

[Tyler]

Looks like the Jays are looking for a replacement for Beeston for some of his questionable actions...

"Blue Jays' ownership was not pleased with some of Beeston's actions during the search for a replacement for ... Bud Selig." - @Buster_ESPN

[bluejays]

Originally Posted by Tyler

Looks like the Jays are looking for a replacement for Beeston for some of his questionable actions...

"Blue Jays' ownership was not pleased with some of Beeston's actions during the search for a replacement for ... Bud Selig." - @Buster_ESPN

What does that even mean? Was he vying for Selig's position when Selig retired? How would that even be a possibility given he's 69 years old?!

[Caged Great]

Originally Posted by fleury

What does that even mean? Was he vying for Selig's position when Selig retired? How would that even be a possibility given he's 69 years old?!

He was supporting a different guy than the one that became the new commissioner because he was trying to get a job with the MLB and the other guy would've agreed to that.

[bluejays]

So just some good old boys club politics. Hate seeing that anywhere.

Anyway, at the President level, it's more about dealing with ownership and working around the dollars and cents side of things. I don't know exactly what Beaston does day to day, but I personally don't think it'll make a difference whether he's still with the organization going forward, or not.

[bluejays]

Just got a notification from The Score app that said that Beaston would remain as President for 2015. I guess that's the end of that for now.

[Flickered Flame]

Blue Jays are pursuing a trade for Greg Holland.
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2014/1...ade-davis.html