Suicide jumper - Page 2 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Calgary Flames · 07-07-2006, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

And as Cube rightfully said...what are you doing to help? If its nothing than what gives you the right to judge.

What gives me the right to judge?? How about my grandparents who are the best people in the goddam world, having their selfish daughter killing herself, and for what??

I don't have compasion for people that choose the suicide route, i'm sorry. I've everience depression, serious depression in my lifetime and the option to kill yourself and end it quickly is always there but for me, it really was never an option. How could I do that to my loved ones? How could I miss out on what the world has to offer me?

It's easy to sit back and see me in a negative light for my comments... but you really shouldn't. I got the help I needed, and still improve with each passing day. Recovery is a long road to follow.

Now you ask, What can I do to help these people? Firstly, it isn't up to ME, it's up to THEM. In the end, that individual has to make the decision for themselves. Help is available.

There is no excuse not to get proffesional help. Which is why I lack compasion for those who decide the suicide route.

JiriHrdina · 07-07-2006, 02:15 PM

So because in your specific situation you were willing and able to get help that means that EVERYONE is capable?

Its just not that simple dude. Its great that you had the strength to get help but not everyone does.

albertGQ · 07-07-2006, 02:15 PM

Commiting suicide is one of the most selfish things anyone can do to their loved ones

Calgary Flames · 07-07-2006, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cube Inmate

Similarly, then, there's no excuse for:

-alcoholism
-gambling addiction
-domestic violence
-smoking
-homelessness...

Why don't all these people just "pick themselves up" and stop being such a drain on society, eh Jordon?

You're right to a certain degree, drain on society? I don't know about that. But people need to be responsible for their own actions. Look at Theo Fleury he blames the NHL addiction program for his problems that it wasn't effective enough.

Which is why I admire Chris Simon so much, he battled through Alchoholism and is just an awesome person, having met him he's a grounded man, he's not flying off the handle and getting back to his destructive routine.

It's as easy for you to label me as some kind of jerk for my comments, and my comments weren't easy to talk about but it's how I feel. Like it or not. I've had more experience on this subject than most here.

I'm free to my opinion, my experience on this subject isn't going to change it.

Log · 07-07-2006, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calgary Flames

What gives me the right to judge?? How about my grandparents who are the best people in the goddam world, having their selfish daughter killing herself, and for what??

I don't have compasion for people that choose the suicide route, i'm sorry. I've everience depression, serious depression in my lifetime and the option to kill yourself and end it quickly is always there but for me, it really was never an option. How could I do that to my loved ones? How could I miss out on what the world has to offer me?

It's easy to sit back and see me in a negative light for my comments... but you really shouldn't. I got the help I needed, and still improve with each passing day. Recovery is a long road to follow.

Now you ask, What can I do to help these people? Firstly, it isn't up to ME, it's up to THEM. In the end, that individual has to make the decision for themselves. Help is available.

There is no excuse not to get proffesional help. Which is why I lack compasion for those who decide the suicide route.

Sorry to hear about all you've had to deal with, but I 100% agree with you!

Igottago · 07-07-2006, 02:20 PM

I think I saw on the news once that Alberta has the highest suicide rate of all provinces in the country. Kinda surprising given the prosperity and opporunity here.

JiriHrdina · 07-07-2006, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calgary Flames

It's as easy for you to label me as some kind of jerk for my comments, and my comments weren't easy to talk about but it's how I feel. Like it or not. I've had more experience on this subject than most here.

How the devil do you know that? We all have our baggage man and I'm sincerely glad you worked your way through yours but don't think for a moment that you're the only guy to have some tough times or if that makes your opinion more valid.

Calgary Flames · 07-07-2006, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

So because in your specific situation you were willing and able to get help that means that EVERYONE is capable?

Its just not that simple dude. Its great that you had the strength to get help but not everyone does.

This is where my "no excuse" comment comes in. It IS that simple. Once you decide that you're going to a psyciatrist you feel pathetic but also a huge sense of relief. Because for one, you'd probably never expect yourself doing it when you feel good and secondly you know you've taken the leap to get this monkey off your back.

It's all up to that individual person. You ask yourself, what's worse? going to a psyciatrist or killing yourself and hurting not just yourself but the people you love?

I've become a borderline Buddhist, my psychatrist is very anti "Anti-depressant" I've gone through and learnt methods to understanding why I felt the way I did, through small sessions of meditation and breathing excersises and focusing on the now, not past bull**** that one may have gone through.

If anyone here has problems, or a family member who needs help I can give you the name of a doctor and contact info. Just PM me.

Calgary Flames · 07-07-2006, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

How the devil do you know that? We all have our baggage man and I'm sincerely glad you worked your way through yours but don't think for a moment that you're the only guy to have some tough times or if that makes your opinion more valid.

I'm not even going to comment on this... I know what I have gone through, what i've experience and my family members have experienced.

As i'm sure you have too... but adding validity to my opinion, yes I think it does. Moreso than yours? Maybe, maybe not. Who cares? I'm just giving my opinion, nobody's opinions are more "valid" than anyone elses, their opinions are their own.

Table 5 · 07-07-2006, 02:34 PM

My parents knew a family of 4 who had just immigrated to this country, and were starting out their brand new life in hopes of attaining their dreams. They were the nicest, most hard working people you would ever meet.

One day a few years ago, the mom set out in their van, along with her two kids and a school friend (who was their to celebrate her son's birthday). A few minutes later they were in a horrific crash, where all 4 of them and a man in another car were instantly killed. The husband had lost his ENTIRE family in one horrible accident. Instead of coming to this country to help fulfill a dream, his entire life and future had been completely shattered. He lasted one year, until he just couldnt take the pain anymore and committed suicide.

I dunno about you guys, but in a case like this Im pretty sure I couldn't hold out either, no matter how many "groups" and social programs are out there for me.

Shame on you Jordan for being so narrow-sighted. Suicide is as serious as it gets, it's not just a black and white issue. I'm glad you worked through your problems, but sometimes things get to the point of no return.

Cube Inmate · 07-07-2006, 02:38 PM

Jordon:

Based on your experiences, it sounds like you always managed to keep yourself grounded through trying times...others cannot do that. Unfortunately, it appears that you're not willing to accept the possibility that a person's mental illness could get so bad that they literally could not distinguish between two very distinct alternatives: "get help or kill myself?"

Well it happens...it's a simple fact of humanity. You can either look for ways to help people who find themselves (or are found by others) in those situations, or you can continue to simply accuse them of being weak, irresponsible, selfish people. It's up to you.

Now that I've settled this topic, on to another: If you ask me, there's no excuse for being fat! Why don't fat people just stop eating? There are plenty of diet centres around! I gained 10 pounds once and I managed to take it off...anybody who can't is just a weak, selfish, irresponsible person.

Calgary Flames · 07-07-2006, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Table 5

My parents knew a family of 4 who had just immigrated to this country, and were starting out their brand new life in hopes of attaining their dreams. They were the nicest, most hard working people you would ever meet.

One day a few years ago, the mom set out in their van, along with her two kids and a school friend (who was their to celebrate her son's birthday). A few minutes later they were in a horrific crash, where all 4 of them and a man in another car were instantly killed. The husband had lost his ENTIRE family in one horrible accident. Instead of coming to this country to help fulfill a dream, his entire life and future had been completely shattered. He lasted one year, until he just couldnt take the pain anymore and committed suicide.

I dunno about you guys, but in a case like this Im pretty sure I couldn't hold out either, no matter how many "groups" and social programs are out there for me.

Shame on you Jordan for being so narrow-sighted. Suicide is as serious as it gets, it's not just a black and white issue. I'm glad you worked through your problems, but sometimes things get to the point of no return.

Why should I be ashamed for my comments? The man lost his family, but is HIS life over? Would his family want him to do what he did? I doubt it. They'd want him to continue on with life and find peace with that.

I will not be ashamed for my opinion on the subject. I feel bad for the man for losing his family, I can't imagine that happening to me, but I'd also understand that while my loved ones are gone, they're still with me in spirit and would want me to strive with as much strength as I can.

Maybe it's the help I've recieved that makes me have the opinion I do. But I just can't understand or feel bad for anyone who takes the route of suicide. I can mourn their decision but that's it.

CaramonLS · 07-07-2006, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calgary Flames

Jesus christ. Professional help is free in this country. Suicide just shouldn't happen.

Currently there is a 12 month-18 month wait time for outpatient services.

Calgary Flames · 07-07-2006, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cube Inmate

Jordon:

Based on your experiences, it sounds like you always managed to keep yourself grounded through trying times...others cannot do that. Unfortunately, it appears that you're not willing to accept the possibility that a person's mental illness could get so bad that they literally could not distinguish between two very distinct alternatives: "get help or kill myself?"

Well it happens...it's a simple fact of humanity. You can either look for ways to help people who find themselves (or are found by others) in those situations, or you can continue to simply accuse them of being weak, irresponsible, selfish people. It's up to you.

Trust me when I say this. I was in that place.

The second point is there are people who are there... they're called psyciatrists.

I didn't accuse anyone of being weak, I just cannot and will not understand how anyone could actually do it. I mean, I can understand it to a certain extent but the alternative to suicide is too great to actually do it. IN MY OPINION.

Let me say it again, it's up to nobody but the person who's battling depression to make that decision. Get help and live your life the best you can or to Kill yourself and end it.

Calgary Flames · 07-07-2006, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Currently there is a 12 month-18 month wait time for outpatient services.

I find this hard to believe... I first went a year and a half ago, and got in within 1 week. How could it go from 1 week to 18 months wait time? in a year and a half?

CaramonLS · 07-07-2006, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calgary Flames

I find this hard to believe... I first went a year and a half ago, and got in within 1 week. How could it go from 1 week to 18 months wait time? in a year and a half?

Are you talking about in-patient services - frequently people are turned away from this if they don't feel the case is severe enough.

Out-patient treatment to see a psychatrist has a 12-18 month wait and it has been like that for a couple of years now.

Scrambler · 07-07-2006, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buff

It was rather surprising. Yes quite the story it was/is too. The rumors that I heard... some people just like to make stuff up.

I've been known for several years as scrambler due to my addiction to scramble up peaks in the CDN Rockies.

I have to agree with many of the points that CF made. I think it's very hard for people to look for help when they're on the brink. I do wonder though if they would have rather made a phone call when they're on the way down and it's too late.

I feel so sorry to the family and friends of this person. How do they feel? I also feel sorry for the guy who owns the truck that was hit by the body, and of course the firmen that had to come clean everything up.

Calgary Flames · 07-07-2006, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Are you talking about in-patient services - frequently people are turned away from this if they don't feel the case is severe enough.

Out-patient treatment to see a psychatrist has a 12-18 month wait and it has been like that for a couple of years now.

I don't understand the difference.

I have my regular family doctor who referred me to a psyciatrist. This took one week.

CaramonLS · 07-07-2006, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calgary Flames

I don't understand the difference.

I have my regular family doctor who referred me to a psyciatrist. This took one week.

Are you a student?

Reaper · 07-07-2006, 02:57 PM

Scrambler, I'm sorry you had to witness such a horrible thing. Seeing the life of another human end is never a pleasant thing no matter what the circumstances.

Jordon, I appreciate that you've been through some troubling and distressing situations but some of your views strike me as very egocentric. One has to understand that no two people have the same life experience so what may have worked for you may not work for others. If this were truly a "one-size-fits-all" world then as soon as one person found resolution for their illness, addiction, psychiatric disorder, troubling situation or what have you then it would mean that everyone else would just have to do exactly the same thing to remedy their situation. Unfortunately, life is not nearly as easy and clean cut as that. Things get complicated. One person's perception is different from another's. Rock bottom means different things to different people. We can try to "reasonably predict" what the outcome of a situation will be if X steps are taken but we can never say with any certainty that success is 100% assured. The world and the people that live in it are just too variable for cookie cutter approaches when it comes to solving life's problems. I'm not saying that people don't ever make mistakes when it comes to difficult choices. What I'm saying is that humans are fallible and prone to errors in judgement based on perception, ego, jealousy, psychiatric disorders, character flaws, predispositions and every other variable under the sun. It is the nature of being human. One can never truly understand what it is like for another person in a given situation because we can never live in that person's skin and experience life through their eyes.