2014 Training Camp Cuts. UPD: Oct 5 - Baertschi, Jooris and Ortio cut

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Also nobody is panicking, just criticizing. There is a difference.

Wondering if Baertschi should "demand" a trade? Seems like a decent over-reaction to me. Panic-like in its hyperbole.

[mile]

@SUNRandySportak: #Flames GM Brad Treliving on cuts meaning some leave compared to some who may not have earned it: "It could stay like that for a day”

[Enoch Root]

I think people are over-reacting to Baertschi's comments.

Of course he's disappointed. And it isn't that surprising that he is confused because I am sure he feels he has done what they asked him to do.

Nothing wrong with any of that.

It is often the case that Europeans are more honest and forthcoming when it comes to answering questions. They will tell you how they really feel. North American kids are more likely to give the 'expected' answer: "I am disappointed, but looking forward to going down and working on my game" and other such rhetoric.

All he did was admit that he is sad. OMG.

He will go to Adirondack and he will continue to get better.

I do agree that confidence is important for him, as well as fleeting. So what he needs is time - time to refocus and rebuild his confidence.

[killer_carlson]

Stempniak
Cammalleri
OBrien
Butler
Jackman


to name a few.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Rerun

What veterans did the Flames either put on waivers or trade to make room for the players that you have listed?

So a rookie making the team only counts if a veteran was put on waivers to make it happen?

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Mike F

...Will the team look different three months from now? Maybe. But that doesn't mean players and fans shouldn't be upset about management's current decisions failing to adhere to the promises they made

What promises, and made to whom?

I know people get tired of hearing it, but the fact is that we almost certainly do not know the while story here: we as fans and outside observers are unfortunately ill equipped to judge whether or not the team is being fair to its players based on the information we receive in the media.

When this plays out over the course of the next several weeks and months, then we will know a lot more. Until then, it seems silly to me that we get so upset about the optics of this situation.

[Split98]

Originally Posted by Savvy27

I, for one, would like to hear the entire Baertschi interview and not come to a conclusion on his character based on a tweet.

This is true. Earlier I was writing Backlund off for dead with the Hartley quote.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by mile

@SUNRandySportak: #Flames GM Brad Treliving on cuts meaning some leave compared to some who may not have earned it: "It could stay like that for a day”

What does this mean?

[The Fonz]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

All he did was admit that he is sad. OMG.

Nobody cares that he's sad... everyone's sad after they get cut. It's the "confused" comment... Implying he believes he was better than someone else who made the final roster.

We all know who his confused comment was directed at. Setoguchi. And Baertschi was better than Setoguchi... but he is a RW, and when Sven was tried at RW in the AHL last season, he didn't get the job done.

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by FBI

Not that disappointed about the cuts themselves. Just annoyed at being strung along by the coaches bs about meritocracy.

ditto

The coaches made it sound like whoever played the best and worked the hardest, would be on the team come the start of the season. Those that failed to perform would be looking for a job.

I guess a lot of us failed to read the fine print.

[mile]

Not sure how some are concluding Sven should be traded because of this. Treliving has been vocal about his support for Sven since taking over.

Expecting him to go from still learning the pro game in the AHL last year to full time NHLer is too much. He has yet to show consistent offence.

The confused comment is a little worrisome but I too would like to see an entire interview before jumping to conclusions.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by the2bears

Wondering if Baertschi should "demand" a trade? Seems like a decent over-reaction to me. Panic-like in its hyperbole.

haha What? I'm saying if I was Baertschi I'd consider it. We have now one of the best offensive prospect pools in the NHL. Wouldn't his odds be better elsewhere to make the NHL and stick? It isn't an over-reaction at all, the guy should think about it given where he's at currently in the organization, and where they will be in 1 year. Today's cut from the existing roster is one more sign that he is not good enough for the Flames. Oh will he get called up for 5 games in December for an injury? Whoops, Jooris gets the nod. Oh well. Sorry Sven you're supposed to just be content with whatever happens to you.

Why can nobody criticize the Flames or management on here without being said we are panicking. I can assure you I am quite relaxed in my armchair GM seat here.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by fatso

whoa, didn't that see that tweet about Baertschi. I think he is right - he has done what was asked of him since last season (at least as far as I know, someone with more knowledge will surely correct me if I'm wrong). I too worry about his confidence. Hopefully he can stay the course and get rewarded with a call-up soon.

Yes and no.

Yes, he came into camp in unbelievable shape. Yes, he played his butt off and looked like the Sven Baertschi they drafted out of Portland. Yes, he played a 200-foot game and even added a bit of physicality. So he did do what was asked of him...

...But that was for a grand total of five pre-season games.

Last year, what I saw (and others on this forum who followed the Heat) was a lazy, weak, occasionally skilled player. Before he even went into the corner to battle for a puck it was a forgone conclusion that he wasn't going to get it. Players would skate right past him and all he'd do is swing his stick weakly as they left him in ice shavings. In his own zone, more often than not, a lamp post could've defended better.

But if this pre-season is any indication, Sven has broken out of those crappy habits and is a legitimate complete player. Now, let's see it on a consistent basis Sven! If he does that for 15-20 games in the AHL, scores like crazy, shows Huska he's got a great attitude, then, and only then, will he be given a roster spot.

Originally Posted by Henry Fool

That would be nice but I suspect players don't necessarily get personal time with the coaches in these situations. Maybe a former first rounder is used to receiving more attention.

They do get one-on-one time with the coaches and management when they're demoted. Even career AHLers and Tweeners like Cundari, Ben Walter and Krys Kolanos got one-on-one time. It's actually a vital time for players, coaches and GMs to all be on the same page.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by mile

Not sure how some are concluding Sven should be traded because of this. Treliving has been vocal about his support for Sven since taking over.

Expecting him to go from still learning the pro game in the AHL last year to full time NHLer is too much. He has yet to show consistent offence.

The confused comment is a little worrisome but I too would like to see an entire interview before jumping to conclusions.

A trade would be good to even out our prospect depth from primarily offensive to a more balanced pool that includes a stud or two on defence. That's why... it doesn't even have to be Baertschi. Then the other side of the coin is that if i'm Sven I would consider asking for one to try and save this NHL career I've worked my entire life for.

[Cheese]

If that's the way Sven behaves in the face of adversity id rather him not be on the team. Go down and prove management did you wrong and dont pout.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

What does this mean?

I think he means it's not permanent, that it could change in a day and you could get called up.

[Phil Russell]

Not too surprised and not disappointed yet. If the team is still dressing one rookie come December I will be disappointed. If the team isn't full of Rookies come season's end, I will be disappointed.

My guess is that several of the rookies surprised at training camp--better than expected. But, decisions had to be made during the summer regarding the salary cap and bringing in veteran help and those decisions can't be quickly undone. You have to give those vets a chance to play themselves out of the lineup and the rooks the time to play their way in. And no, a preseason is not sufficient time for this to happen. Patience everyone.

[mile]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

What does this mean?

I'm guessing he is saying that the players getting sent down who may have deserved a spot over those who haven't and are still here may not be in the AHL for long

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

haha What? I'm saying if I was Baertschi I'd consider it. We have now one of the best offensive prospect pools in the NHL. Wouldn't his odds be better elsewhere to make the NHL and stick? It isn't an over-reaction at all, the guy should think about it given where he's at currently in the organization, and where they will be in 1 year. Today's cut from the existing roster is one more sign that he is not good enough for the Flames. Oh will he get called up for 5 games in December for an injury? Whoops, Jooris gets the nod. Oh well. Sorry Sven you're supposed to just be content with whatever happens to you.

Why can nobody criticize the Flames or management on here without being said we are panicking. I can assure you I am quite relaxed in my armchair GM seat here.

How does it help his career to demand a trade? That would show some pretty alarming entitlement issues. Certainly an over-reaction.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

Nobody cares that he's sad... everyone's sad after they get cut. It's the "confused" comment... Implying he believes he was better than someone else who made the final roster.

We all know who his confused comment was directed at. Setoguchi. And Baertschi was better than Setoguchi... but he is a RW, and when Sven was tried at RW in the AHL last season, he didn't get the job done.

Wow - that is a LOT of assumptions. You know no such things.

You have no idea whether 'confused' means that or not. Maybe it means what I suggested - that he thought he did what they asked him to do.

You do not have any justification to suggest that he thinks he was better than other players. And you CERTAINLY have no justification to assume Setoguchi in particular.

What a bunch of emotional hyperbole!