[News] Darren Dreger: "I’m confused by the direction of the Calgary Flames."

[Azure]

Crosby has not been able to win a cup on his own. Best player that will play in the NHL in my lifetime, and he still isn't good enough to do it all alone.

On the other hand, a team like LA and Chicago have won 4 cups the last 4 years. What do they both have in common? Depth. Up and down the lineup they have great depth. LA had more of it last year, Chicago less. LA won. Chicago had more the year before. Depth, depth, depth.

Anyone with half a brain knows that a generational talent is not enough to win a Stanley Cup. You have a build a team around him.

The reason Dreger is pissed off is because he is obviously an Oiler fan, and the fact is the Flames rebuild is going a lot better. Dreger wanted the Flames to go out and make a big splash at free agency, and they really didn't. They filled some organizational holes and added some salary to stay above the cap floor. They never signed a David Clarkson 'disaster' type deal that will come back to haunt them in the future. They made some shrew signings that really allowed them to keep the rebuild going and possibly draft top 5 next year again. Might not be McDavid, but any of the top 5 guys would fast track the rebuild.

Flames were top 5 worst team in the league last year. By all accounts if you look at the standings, stats, etc, etc....they sucked. Yet, if you ask anyone that actually bothered to watch them the whole year, it was evident that they are a damn fun team to watch. They work hard, they play hard. They don't win many games, but man.....the effort. Post game thread after post game thread I would read seeing posters compliment the Flames on their hard work. That identity was created in 'one' year. The Oilers, who Dreger is quite obviously a fan of, still have zero identity, and no direction. They have no leadership, and shown zero improvement in the 5+ years that they have been rebuilding. Obviously this will piss Dreger off. That is why he lashes out against the Flames, because the rebuild is showing results so quickly.

I have said for years that Dreger is a moron with little to no actual insight of how the NHL works, and what actually goes on behind the scenes. His 'insider' status is limited, and he mostly just throws out crap hoping it sticks against the wall. In my books, his is on the same level as Eklund, but strangely enough if you asked Eklund about the Flames, he would be a hell of a lot more objective than Dreger will ever be.

As for Johnny Hockey, I would expect more comments like that. People that hate the Flames will be trying to find anything against our brightest prospect. Just goes to show how good he really is, and how good he will be.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Azure

Flames were top 5 worst team in the league last year. By all accounts if you look at the standings, stats, etc, etc....they sucked.

This is something I have trouble wrapping my head around. Yes, they were a 27th-place team. But they weren't actually quite as bad as that sounds. Look at the standings, and you will see that they were closer to 22nd (Winnipeg, 84 pts.) than to 28th (Edmonton, 67). They were extremely lucky to have a couple of bad teams pass them in the closing days of the season and finish with the opportunity to draft one of last summer's Big Four.

Basically, the Flames got a player who was mentioned in the mix to go first overall, and they got him after a season in which they finished 25 points ahead of last place. Saying that they finished 27th is factually correct, but it tells less than half the story. This is a bad team, but not an awful one, and it may be easier to turn it around than most people suspect.

Add Gaudreau, Bennett, and another good scorer at forward (Ferland? Poirier?), and a couple of top-four defencemen (who are probably not in the system right now, I admit); shove everybody else down the depth chart, and you begin to have what looks like a pretty decent team. There will still be plenty of work to be done at that point, but this is not a tire fire.

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I highly doubt it. Although if Arizona wins the McDavid sweepstakes it will look damn suspicious to me.

Flames dominated the league for almost a decade and won the cup with no #1 pick.

They had a self inflicted dark age when currency made hockey in Calgary a money loser, but bounced back with another cup run and 5 years of respectability. Again, with no #1 pick.

Maybe they believed in their inpsirational superstar leader a bit too long, but they are back on track with some very cool players.

So even if the league was crooked, the lack of a generational talent may not hold this team back in the future. It would be cool though to have a Gretz/Lemieux/Crosby calibre guy on this team. Especially one with a scottish name.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

Flames dominated the league for almost a decade and won the cup with no #1 pick.

They had a self inflicted dark age when currency made hockey in Calgary a money loser, but bounced back with another cup run and 5 years of respectability. Again, with no #1 pick.

Maybe they believed in their inpsirational superstar leader a bit too long, but they are back on track with some very cool players.

So even if the league was crooked, the lack of a generational talent may not hold this team back in the future. It would be cool though to have a Gretz/Lemieux/Crosby calibre guy on this team. Especially one with a scottish name.

Oh, I absolutely agree. I was addressing the notion the NHL would fix the draft to screw us. They didn't screw the idiots up North so I have a hard time believing they would stick it to us.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

This is something I have trouble wrapping my head around. Yes, they were a 27th-place team. But they weren't actually quite as bad as that sounds. Look at the standings, and you will see that they were closer to 22nd (Winnipeg, 84 pts.) than to 28th (Edmonton, 67). They were extremely lucky to have a couple of bad teams pass them in the closing days of the season and finish with the opportunity to draft one of last summer's Big Four.

Basically, the Flames got a player who was mentioned in the mix to go first overall, and they got him after a season in which they finished 25 points ahead of last place. Saying that they finished 27th is factually correct, but it tells less than half the story. This is a bad team, but not an awful one, and it may be easier to turn it around than most people suspect.

They also played a lot of 1 goal games that could have gone either way. I agree that they're not as bad as people think they are.

A big part of that is how they play. They didn't have a lot of skill last year, but they made up for it by working hard. That is the cultural shift that amazes us all. And that is exactly what Edmonton doesn't have, and THAT is why Dreger lashes out against the Flames.

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

This is something I have trouble wrapping my head around. Yes, they were a 27th-place team. But they weren't actually quite as bad as that sounds. Look at the standings, and you will see that they were closer to 22nd (Winnipeg, 84 pts.) than to 28th (Edmonton, 67). They were extremely lucky to have a couple of bad teams pass them in the closing days of the season and finish with the opportunity to draft one of last summer's Big Four.

Basically, the Flames got a player who was mentioned in the mix to go first overall, and they got him after a season in which they finished 25 points ahead of last place. Saying that they finished 27th is factually correct, but it tells less than half the story. This is a bad team, but not an awful one, and it may be easier to turn it around than most people suspect.

Add Gaudreau, Bennett, and another good scorer at forward (Ferland? Poirier?), and a couple of top-four defencemen; shove everybody else down the depth chart, and you begin to have what looks like a pretty decent team. There will still be plenty of work to be done at that point, but this is not a tire fire.

Excellent post. The character that was forged last year will pay off big time in 5-6 years when the next generation of new talent (beyond the current guys we are all getting excited about) starts to crack the lineup.

And lots of players that will be on this roster soon prove that you can build a good team without a single #1.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Azure

They also played a lot of 1 goal games that could have gone either way.

What was their record in those 1-goal games? Something like 25-24, wasn't it? Just about what you'd expect. The only unusual thing was that there were so many of those games.

The team was bad because it got blown out (or shut out) a lot more often than it blew out or shut out the opposition. In the modern NHL, however, those kinds of games usually only happen when one team or the other gets thrown off its game plan. It's the close games that are every club's bread and butter, and the Flames' record showed that they were approaching those games with the right preparation and work ethic. I think that's a hopeful sign for the future, even if they should take a step backwards this year.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

It would be cool though to have a Gretz/Lemieux/Crosby calibre guy on this team. Especially one with a scottish name.

Yes, it would be rather fun to draft young Jack. I've spent many a summer in Scotland myself, fishing on Loch Eichel.

[Yrebmi]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I highly doubt it. Although if Arizona wins the McDavid sweepstakes it will look damn suspicious to me.

Completely agree on both sentiments. Suspicions are natural because we are asked to trust a closed door draw. The league really should make the lottery draw public. It might even be fun to watch on TV.

[Enoch Root]

I was recently debating with an Oiler fan about which team is further along in the rebuild - the 8-year, rebuild 3.0 of the Oilers, or the Flames in year 2 of their rebuild.

One interesting way to look at it is to compare the top 10 young players - not just prospects, but all young players - in a 6 forward, 3 defense, and 1 goalie format. The foundation of a future core, if you will.

Though I was keeping it to 25 and under, I included Perron and Backlund because it seemed appropriate for both teams. Also, they aren't ranked in any kind of best to worst, I simply tried to match roles and skill sets. So my top 10 young players are:

Oilers..........Flames
Hall.............Monahan
RNH............Gaudreau
Eberle.........Baertschi
Draisaitl......Bennett
Perron.........Backlund
Yakupov......Poirier

Schultz........Brodie
Nurse..........Wotherspoon
Morincin......Sieloff

Brossoit......Ortio (I would pick Gillies, but CP has spoken)

If you look at the forwards closely, it is actually pretty even - there are some advantages for both teams there. Having said that, I like our strength up the middle more, which I think is key.

On D, the Oilers have more upside, but the Flames D can actually play defense. Advantage Oilers for now, but well have to wait and see how everyone develops.

In goal, no contest.

Pretty even overall for the top 10. However, the Flames have a couple other big advantages:

1) leadership and culture. Giordano. That is all.

2) depth. While the first 6 forwards look pretty good for both teams, the Flames can follow that up with a 2nd 6 consisting of: Colborne, Granlund, Bouma, Ferland, Arnold and Jooris. The Oilers have absolutely no answer to that (Joensuu, Lander, Pitlick, ?).

In fact, you can throw out another 6 (Reinhart, Klimchuk, Agostino, Knight, Wolf and Van Brabant) and the Oilers 2nd group wouldn't even compare to that.

So, while the top young Oilers might be further along than the top young Flames, I think the Flames overall are much closer to having enough pieces in place to start moving forward.

The actual ability to move forward is still a little ways away, as Bennett, Gaudreau, Monahan etc are still too young. But the overall blueprint favours the Flames by a fair margin, IMO.

I would not be at all surprised to see the Flames back in the playoffs first.

[Critter4223]

Most of you are idiots.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Critter4223

Most of you are idiots.

Thanks for your input, Darren.

[MisterJoji]

Originally Posted by edn88

I think the Flames are smart enough to realize no matter where they finish, the NHL will rig it so they will not get McDavid...

Honest question: do people truly believe the draft lottery is fixed? I mean when the bankrupt/possible relocation-bound Penguins won Crosby, it did appear a little too convenient, but I highly doubt Bettman would've let the Oilers draft #1 three years in a row if it was fixed.

[mhsyyc]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

You guys sure are getting angry over nothing.

You've just discovered the essence of fan forums.

[Erick Estrada]

I'm not the biggest Drager fan but don't see the big deal here. All he's saying is that the Flames should avoid quick fixes just to try and make the team competitive today.

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I'm not the biggest Drager fan but don't see the big deal here. All he's saying is that the Flames should avoid quick fixes just to try and make the team competitive today.

Which they haven't been doing. Hence the reaction to calling the team's direction "confusing."

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Yrebmi

Completely agree on both sentiments. Suspicions are natural because we are asked to trust a closed door draw. The league really should make the lottery draw public. It might even be fun to watch on TV.

Pretty sure it's been discussed many times before here that every team sends a representative.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by mrdonkey

Which they haven't been doing. Hence the reaction to calling the team's direction "confusing."

Maybe he's heard that the Flames are looking for possibly a veteran defenseman to shore up the blue line as he was making reference to the Flames looking at defensemen? Either way I don't see the uproar as we all know the guy is an Oilers fan and just saying a few nice things about the Flames as he did probably pains him.

[Goodlad]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I was recently debating with an Oiler fan about which team is further along in the rebuild - the 8-year, rebuild 3.0 of the Oilers, or the Flames in year 2 of their rebuild.

One interesting way to look at it is to compare the top 10 young players - not just prospects, but all young players - in a 6 forward, 3 defense, and 1 goalie format. The foundation of a future core, if you will.

Though I was keeping it to 25 and under, I included Perron and Backlund because it seemed appropriate for both teams. Also, they aren't ranked in any kind of best to worst, I simply tried to match roles and skill sets. So my top 10 young players are:

Oilers..........Flames
Hall>Monahan
RNH<Gaudreau
Eberle>Baertschi
Draisaitl<Bennett
Perron=Backlund
Yakupov>Poirier (I love Poirier, but once Yak figures his stuff out he'll put up more points.)

Schultz<<Brodie
Nurse>>Wotherspoon
Morincin ? Sieloff

Brossoit<<Ortio (Ortio had a bad pre-season, but I still think he's miles ahead of Broissoit)

If you look at the forwards closely, it is actually pretty even - there are some advantages for both teams there. Having said that, I like our strength up the middle more, which I think is key.

On D, the Oilers have more upside, but the Flames D can actually play defense. Advantage Oilers for now, but well have to wait and see how everyone develops.

In goal, no contest.

Pretty even overall for the top 10. However, the Flames have a couple other big advantages:

1) leadership and culture. Giordano. That is all.

2) depth. While the first 6 forwards look pretty good for both teams, the Flames can follow that up with a 2nd 6 consisting of: Colborne, Granlund, Bouma, Ferland, Arnold and Jooris. The Oilers have absolutely no answer to that (Joensuu, Lander, Pitlick, ?).

In fact, you can throw out another 6 (Reinhart, Klimchuk, Agostino, Knight, Wolf and Van Brabant) and the Oilers 2nd group wouldn't even compare to that.

So, while the top young Oilers might be further along than the top young Flames, I think the Flames overall are much closer to having enough pieces in place to start moving forward.

The actual ability to move forward is still a little ways away, as Bennett, Gaudreau, Monahan etc are still too young. But the overall blueprint favours the Flames by a fair margin, IMO.

I would not be at all surprised to see the Flames back in the playoffs first.

Interesting approach. I think it's too early to tell right now, but if I was an Oilers' fan I would be really uncomfortable with how the Flames' rebuild looks compared to theirs.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I'm not the biggest Drager fan but don't see the big deal here. All he's saying is that the Flames should avoid quick fixes just to try and make the team competitive today.

But we aren't making any quick fixes. We're going about the rebuild exactly as we should be. So I fail to see what's got his trousers in a bunch. To me irrational rants like this smell of someone who's got something personal against the team at hand, or at least a lack of objectivity. Which makes me think he's really an oiler fanboy. If he was truly being objective hed be commending Treliving and Burke on their job so far, and not trying to take any shortcuts. The only move that could possibly seen as eyebrow raising in that regard is the Hiller signing... But that's really it. Engelland isn't gonna buy them many wins lol...

Dreger be hatin.