Scottish independence referendum thread

[saillias]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

Good post from a Yes voter on Reddit (love the bolded bit):

First, I'm 43, and have voted in national elections since 1992. I've never seen a Westminster party that represented me. Labour or Conservative are both slaves to the Square Mile. Note that this isn't "anti-English" ~ the English are wonderful neighbours, a lovely bunch of people, and I hope this continues whatever the result of the referendum. God forbid our relationship was anything like Israel/Palestine, or Ukraine/Russia. No, it's the Old Boy Network of Eton/Oxbridge/Bullingdon Club toffs who I object to.

North Sea oil will likely run out in 2050 or thereabouts. We've been extracting it for 40 years, but have no sovereign wealth fund like most oil-producing nations. Also, despite Scotland's vast natural resources (wind, water, coastlines), we are the worst in Europe for investment in renewable energy. That's extreme short-sightedness from Westminster, who always have and always will treat the oil like a slush fund to squander. The Nationalists promise both a sovereign wealth fund, and more investment in alternative energy, which makes them the best choice for those worried about the long-term future of the country.
Related to the above, when Margaret Thatcher came to power in 1979 (35 years in the past) our manufacturing industries at Linwood and Ravenscraig were in decline. Her government closed down everything, decimated communities (not just in Scotland, but around Britain), and left us to sink or swim. Being "in the Union" was a curse back in those grim days. I see no reason to assume the Westminster of 35 years in the future would be any different.
Since coming to power in the Scottish Parliamentary elections in 2007, the SNP have done a far better job of running the country than Labour ever did (from my perspective).
There are literally dozens of countries that have seceded from UK rule. Not a single one has ever decided it was a bad idea and asked to recant their independence. If everyone from Canada to Kiribati thought it was a great choice, why should we be any different?

My girlfriend is a Slovak. They went through their own "Velvet Divorce" in 1993. At the time, Slovakia's GDP was behind the Czech Republic by about a third. The financial gap between the two countries is now down to around 5%. Slovakia is about the same size as Scotland and has the same population, but has no coastline and fewer natural resources, so I think we could do at least as well as they did, relative to rUK.

I live in my own house. My parents live in a nicer, bigger house, which is worth more and in a better neighbourhood. If I lived with them, I'd be better off financially, and they'd probably do stuff like laundry and cooking for me. But I'm a grown-up. I want to live in my own place, be self-sufficient, and make my own decisions, even if I'm not as comfortable as I might otherwise be. I apply exactly the same logic to my country.

Cute to apply the rules of the typical family unit to states and nations. Sorry I don't buy that this nationalist desire to separate is just as natural and inevitable as a child moving out of their parent's house as they come of age.

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by saillias

Cute to apply the rules of the typical family unit to states and nations. Sorry I don't buy that this nationalist desire to separate is just as natural and inevitable as a child moving out of their parent's house as they come of age.

You guys take things WAY too seriously.

[To Be Quite Honest]

I think we should have our own ignorant poll!

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by scottish_flame

Braveheart repeated on every channel everyday

bugger that, 'whiskey galore'.

[scottish_flame]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

bugger that, 'whiskey galore'.

We aren't Irish. It's whisky

[afc wimbledon]

My bad, still joint best scotish film with Gregory's Girl though

[killer_carlson]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Infrastructure spending should be based on expected usage, not on local population. If a busy highway has enough traffic to justify twinning, it shouldn't matter if it's located in a populous, sparse, rich, or poor area of the province.



Isn't the recommendation for re-distribution supposed to make it closer to what I am advocating for? That is, rural Alberta is presently over-represented compared to Calgary and Edmonton, so the two big cities should receive more seats in the legislature such that their government representation more closely matches their population?

It may be. The issue is not going away and I hope we see some political leadership to tackle it and the accompanying dialogue.

[scottish_flame]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

My bad, still joint best scotish film with Gregory's Girl though

Trainspotting

[Nehkara]

Final YouGov prediction was just released:

YouGov @YouGov · 10m
YouGov #IndyRef prediction: YES 46%, NO 54% - http://y-g.co/1mjwlQz

[Matty81]

Originally Posted by scottish_flame

Trainspotting

You're not gonna like Irvine Welsh's take on independence .

Great movie though, loved all his books too back when.

[GirlySports]

bbc live broadcast

http://www.bbc.com/news/live/uk-scotland-29130277

[calgarygeologist]

I'll be watching the BBC during dinner tonight. I have a good feeling that the Yes side is going to pull ahead in the end.

[scottish_flame]

All roads looking like a victory for NO

Scotland has won many great battles in it's history but this one would top the lot of them if it happens

Don't want to tempt fait still got to count the votes

[calgarygeologist]

I'm thinking that a lot of folks who wouldn't typically vote in a general election because they are otherwise apathetic to the process are going to come out as Yes supporters. I think that might push them ahead.

[scottish_flame]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

I'm thinking that a lot of folks who wouldn't typically vote in a general election because they are otherwise apathetic to the process are going to come out as Yes supporters. I think that might push them ahead.

It's the exact opposite apparently

[taco.vidal]

Expecting a YES result.

[scottish_flame]

Originally Posted by taco.vidal

Expecting a YES result.

Why?

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by scottish_flame

It's the exact opposite apparently

Yep, fear beats hope every time, just look at the US

[Senator Clay Davis]

Fear doesn't usually drive the ballot box though. It drives issues, but not voters. Republicans tried damn hard to work up the fear in 2012 and it didn't work, they got a lower turnout in 2012 than 2008 when in 08 the message was mostly dominated by Obama's hope (and Sarah Palin is a boob).

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Fear doesn't usually drive the ballot box though. It drives issues, but not voters. Republicans tried damn hard to work up the fear in 2012 and it didn't work, they got a lower turnout in 2012 than 2008 when in 08 the message was mostly dominated by Obama's hope (and Sarah Palin is a boob).

And yet the US is a country utterly ruled by fear, on every level.