Prentice and the September Cabinet

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by Slava

Well I can answer that one. His mandate is because the party won the most seats in the last general election and now he is the leader of that party. That's how the system works in Canada. If Harper resigned and Rob Anders wins the leadership, he doesn't have to call an election the next day.

That may be the letter of the law but there is also a question of legitimacy. The party won a majority based on the vision they laid out in the last election. Well technically they won due to fear of change. If Anders took over the Federal government he would not have a mandate to bring in a bunch of social policies for example.

Now we have 4 ministries representing 70%+ of provincial spending controlled by non-MLA's. The general thought is that they are now going to prorogue and bring in a new throne speech laying out a new direction for the government. In my opinion they do not have a mandate for all this. IMO Prentice should spend the fall and winter cleaning up the party mess and then call a spring election.

Originally Posted by Slava

But you could've become a member and cast your ballot? And yeah, he's the head of the party that won the most seats, ergo he's the premier.

I don't/didn't support any of the 3 candidates.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Slava

Well I can answer that one. His mandate is because the party won the most seats in the last general election and now he is the leader of that party. That's how the system works in Canada. If Harper resigned and Rob Anders wins the leadership, he doesn't have to call an election the next day.

Anders holds a seat in Parliament. Prentice does not hold a seat in the legislature. Please don't insult our intelligence by pretending to misunderstand what people mean by "unelected premier".

Anyway, Gordon Dirks is an interesting choice for education minister, being how he is an evangelical Christian. Sounds like he's pretty good at splitting religion and politics, but his faith is still going to get thrown in Prentice's face if he decides to use "lake of fire" scaremongering against Wildrose come the next election.

[killer_carlson]

Originally Posted by GGG

If the people most qualified for the job of Cabinet ministers are not in the caucus then hiring outside people makes sense. I think provided they will seek a seat in the next general election and meet all of the disclosure and segragation of asset requirements of sitting MLA's then I don't have an issue with it.

I don't get the whole premier doesn't have a mandate argument. He does have a mandate. Individual Albertans elected MLA's those MLA's can vote for non-confidence in the government if they feel the government no longer has the authority to govern. Until such a time that the Leg decides the government isn't fit they have a mandate to govern.

I don't mind snubbing current MLA's or those who were vocal in ousting Redford. You shouldnt get rewarded for knifing your previous boss. Best people should be put in place for the job.

By puroguing he gets rid of all existing legislation on the floor right now and starts over. Unless their are any opposition bills that get killed because of this and can't be re-introduced I would be in favour of this. Rather than retracting and ammending to death current bills, or voting them down in the house and wasting time starting over seems reasonable.

I like the canceling of government owned airlines. Using small private charters when neccessary that generate expenses that have good oversite is a better process.

Many of those MLAs said internally and externally "I didn't sign up to be a Redford stooge and have to justify the entitlements to my constituents, when i don't agree with it". Those people were finally the ones who kicked her out. That isn't stabbing your boss in the back, it's finally saying "no" when your boss continually asks you to stand in front of the cannons while she suntans.

[Slava]

To the posters who are upset that Prentice is unelected, do you think he will have a hard time getting elected? It's basically a rubber stamp as far as I can tell.

[Handsome B. Wonderful]

Originally Posted by Slava

This particular "point" that I keep seeing repeated is driving me nuts. He was elected, like him or not, and you could have voted in that election. Sure he hasn't won a seat in the legislature yet, but its been less than a week. Surely this is understandable. Now if the plan was to wait until the next general election and basically run the province in this manner for a few years, yeah I can understand why people might be upset, but a few days and it just sounds petty and ridiculous.

He has not been elected by the people of this province, and he is not held accountable to the people of this province. Yet, he is now making decisions related to the distribution of significant amounts of money.

If he wants to appoint a cabinet, he can do it after he has been legitimized. Otherwise this is a circumvention of the democratic process.

[SebC]

Municipal affairs, transportation, education, and finance all seem like better fits for Mandel than health. What's the point of making him a minister, but taking him away from his areas of experience?

[killer_carlson]

I think the 3 by-elections are not just a test for Prentice, but also a test for the opposition parties as well.

What sort of pressure will there be on Smith for the WR to win at least one of those seats? What happens to her if they do not? If the Alberta Party wins a seat in Elbow, is that the end of the Liberal Party? How will the new NDP leader demonstrate relevance in those ridings where traditionally they haven't had a sniff?

It will be interesting to watch.

[Handsome B. Wonderful]

Originally Posted by SebC

Municipal affairs, transportation, education, and finance all seem like better fits for Mandel than health. What's the point of making him a minister, but taking him away from his areas of experience?

Mandel probably needed something big to entice him out of retirement. Prentice needed someone who was a lock to win a by-election. Thus, Health.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by Handsome B. Wonderful

He has not been elected by the people of this province

That's the funny thing- most of the time we have no say as to who becomes Premier. We have to vote for our MLA and hope we also like the leader of our MLA's party. That was the thing in the last election, I liked my PC MLA but didn't like Redford; how should I have voted. However last week I got to place a ballot to say who I wanted to be Premier.

Originally Posted by Handsome B. Wonderful

If he wants to appoint a cabinet, he can do it after he has been legitimized. Otherwise this is a circumvention of the democratic process.

The fact that an insignificant number of people chose to vote for the race for Premier does not circumvent the process. Yes, I know it cost $10 to vote this time around. However the next Premier will be working with thousands of my tax dollars every year; seemed like a small price to pay to have my say.

And I say that having voted for McIver.

[Slava]

^ great point there about normally not being able to vote directly for the premier. Rumour has it there were free memberships available as well!

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by Slava

To the posters who are upset that Prentice is unelected, do you think he will have a hard time getting elected? It's basically a rubber stamp as far as I can tell.

He should get elected easily, he should however seek a byelection as soon as possible. There is one seat available right now and 2 other MLA's who are willing to step down to give him their seat.

I have a problem with the 2 biggest ministries being run by appointed people who don't have to be accountable in the legislature. I seem to remember you had an issue with that last week.

I also have an issue with Prentice bringing in major changes to policy without facing the electorate and letting the voters judge his platform.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Slava

To the posters who are upset that Prentice is unelected, do you think he will have a hard time getting elected? It's basically a rubber stamp as far as I can tell.

Of course he won`t have any difficulty getting elected because the PC Party will stick him in a district which will be easy to win.

[killer_carlson]

nm

[GGG]

Prentice has a mandate to govern as long as he holds the confidence of the legislature. We did not vote for the PC party led by Redford to govern us. We each voted for an MLA. Until MLAs who you elected provide a vote of non confidence Prentice has a mandate to govern given to him by the elected representatives of Alberta.

This is how our parliamentary system works when we don't directly elect a leader or a party.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Jacks

He should get elected easily, he should however seek a byelection as soon as possible. There is one seat available right now and 2 other MLA's who are willing to step down to give him their seat.

I have a problem with the 2 biggest ministries being run by appointed people who don't have to be accountable in the legislature. I seem to remember you had an issue with that last week.

I also have an issue with Prentice bringing in major changes to policy without facing the electorate and letting the voters judge his platform.

You don't have to go all the way back to last week. I said that today in this thread. The thing is Prentice becoming an MLA is a formality. He will have an easy riding and should win easily. There are plenty of targets for people to argue about with him and the PCs. The fact that he hasn't won a seat yet though is just petty. Like I say... It hasn't even been a week.

[Resolute 14]

If you guys are done being condescending, we all understand how the system works.

It does not change the fact that Prentice is not an elected MLA. As such, he most certainly is an unelected premier.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by GGG

We did not vote for the PC party led by Redford to govern us. We each voted for an MLA.

While that may be technically correct I would bet that most people vote for the party, leader and platform.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Jacks

While that may be technically correct I would bet that most people vote for the party, leader and platform.

I would agree. I cast my ballot based on the party that I wanted to see govern Alberta. I didn`t really know anything specific about the candidates on my ballot (except for Redford - of course I knew about her.)

[GGG]

Just because people choose to vote one way or for a certain reason doesn't change the way our system works. I would agree he is an unelected premier but he is an unelected premier with a strong mandate to govern.

Also if people primarily vote for a party first then it's still the same party in power.

[#-3]

I'm with GGG here, I think that the way our system is structured the amount people are talking about a personal "mandate" is over blown. Generally we know allot more about the parties and the incumbents than individual candidates

The majority of people look at the party, or an incumbent before they vote for a person. I am not different, I vote for and against Incumbents, and for or against parties, because I am happy or unhappy with them, and honestly don't know enough about the challengers.

I hate to be critical of democracy because it is great in theory. But under informed voters and lack of individualism in the MLAs/MPs are huge problems that plague Canadian politics. People voted for the Party, the Party will make the decisions, its to bad but that's our system.