Men-only barber shop controversy

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Can you elaborate on this a bit more? Am I misunderstanding your point, or are you saying that barbershops should refuse to give traditionally men's cuts to women because those styles will then fall out of favour with young men who are insecure about their masculinity?

No, I think they should abide by the law and proper decency and give the service to anyone who wants it. I am just saying that it could still hurt the business. Since I have no financial stake in it, I don't care, but I can understand why a business owner would be resistant.

I understand both sides of the argument. It's not just a matter of sexism.

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by jonesy

the most intriguing thing for me out of all this is, are there really haircuts that are illegal for untrained people to attempt?
Someone took time to get a law in place for and make it illegal for just anyone to do?

A hard part involves the part line to be shaved into the person's hair with a straight razor. You have to be certified to use a straight razor during a haircut. Most hair stylists do not bother to get certified. Barbers do get certified. It's not like it is a stupid law. If someone is going to use a straight razor on the scalp it is probably better if they are properly trained to do so.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

No, I think they should abide by the law and proper decency and give the service to anyone who wants it. I am just saying that it could still hurt the business. Since I have no financial stake in it, I don't care, but I can understand why a business owner would be resistant.

I understand both sides of the argument. It's not just a matter of sexism.

I don't follow this logic; how would it hurt their business?

If that one particular style falls out of favour with young men because it became popular with women, men are still going to get haircuts and spend money at barbershops, right? Maybe they won't opt for that specific cut anymore, but they'll just get a different style instead.

[Arya Stark]

Originally Posted by Reaper

A hard part involves the part line to be shaved into the person's hair with a straight razor. You have to be certified to use a straight razor during a haircut. Most hair stylists do not bother to get certified. Barbers do get certified. It's not like it is a stupid law. If someone is going to use a straight razor on the scalp it is probably better if they are properly trained to do so.

Where is this law? And a hard part does not require the use of a straight razor. You can use it, but it's not necessary at all.

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by Arya Stark

Where is this law? And a hard part does not require the use of a straight razor.

Back when I was having someone else cut my hair I was told repeatedly by my stylists that only barbers were legally allowed to use a straight razor in Alberta. I was going by the assumption that it was still the case.

Originally Posted by Arya Stark

You can use it, but it's not necessary at all.

I guess one could use clippers but it seems like it is half-a$$ed if a straight razor isn't used to clean up the part line. Kind of like shaving one's face with clippers without finishing up with a razor.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I don't follow this logic; how would it hurt their business?

If that one particular style falls out of favour with young men because it became popular with women, men are still going to get haircuts and spend money at barbershops, right? Maybe they won't opt for that specific cut anymore, but they'll just get a different style instead.

It could hurt their ability to market themselves as a men's barber shop that specializes in men's fashion (and apparently there are a lot of men that prefer this) if female clientele becomes more prevalent in their establishment. People say that it is only one girl, but in a small city like Regina, word of mouth spreads fast and I don't think it would be unreasonable to expect a clientele shift if they changed their policy.

The whole idea of such a business is probably outdated, but I'm not the one would put my life's work into making it my living. Sucks to be him I guess.

[Arya Stark]

Originally Posted by Reaper

Back when I was having someone else cut my hair I was told repeatedly by my stylists that only barbers were legally allowed to use a straight razor in Alberta. I was going by the assumption that it was still the case.

Unless something has changed I don't think that's the case in Alberta as long as you're using a disposable razor and buy the proper box to dispose the razors in. They don't train you how to use a straight razor in school so don't know how they would differentiate between a barber and hair stylist.

I guess one could use clippers but it seems like it is half-a$$ed if a straight razor isn't used to clean up the part line. Kind of like shaving one's face with clippers without finishing up with a razor.

Straight razors in Calgary are rare. Most barbers don't even have a straight razor on hand. They take too much time and effort to use and you'll lose out on a lot of customers who just want their hair cut quickly. I think there is a big market for it in Calgary though which is why a lot of the shops who offer straight razor shaves are so popular.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

It could hurt their ability to market themselves as a men's barber shop that specializes in men's fashion if female clientele becomes more prevalent in their establishment. People say that it is only one girl, but in a small city like Regina, word of mouth spreads fast and I don't think it would be unreasonable to expect a clientele shift if they changed their policy.

I'm not buying it. Barbershops can always say they specialize in men's cuts and don't have the required expertise to perform typical women's cuts, instead referring clients who want those styles to a salon that is better suited for it. It's not like Bruno the Barber is going to magically turn into Wanda the Hairdresser if he also cuts women's hair using the exact same techniques he already uses on his male clientele.

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by Arya Stark

Straight razors in Calgary are rare. Most barbers don't even have a straight razor on hand. They take too much time and effort to use and you'll lose out on a lot of customers who just want their hair cut quickly. I think there is a big market for it in Calgary though which is why a lot of the shops who offer straight razor shaves are so popular.

Disposable blade "straight razors" are actually called Shavettes and they shave differently than a traditional straight razor. They feel different and require a different technique based on blade stiffness.

That type of shaving is a lost art. Shaving with a true straight razor requires blood borne pathogen certification similar to that of tattoo artists. Its too bad that there aren't more people doing it because it provides a cleaner shave if done correctly.

[V]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I'm not buying it. Barbershops can always say they specialize in men's cuts and don't have the required expertise to perform typical women's cuts, instead referring clients who want those styles to a salon that is better suited for it. It's not like Bruno the Barber is going to magically turn into Wanda the Hairdresser if he also cuts women's hair using the exact same techniques he already uses on his male clientele.

It's not that complicated. They're promoting a vagina-free barber shop. Obviously there's demand for such a place, since they're still in business. Doesn't make it right, but it seems to have been working for them so far.

This has nothing to do with technique and everything to do with the fact that apparently some guys want to get their hair cut without the annoying presence of a woman in the room. I don't get it, and don't think it's right, but there appears to be a demand. By allowing women into the establishment they will potentially lose clientelle that enjoy visiting for the vagina-free atmosphere.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I'm not buying it. Barbershops can always say they specialize in men's cuts and don't have the required expertise to perform typical women's cuts, instead referring clients who want those styles to a salon that is better suited for it. It's not like Bruno the Barber is going to magically turn into Wanda the Hairdresser if he also cuts women's hair using the exact same techniques he already uses on his male clientele.

It's not just about the actual hair cut. It's about the business image.

Maybe this will illustrate it better. I used to own a Volvo that would take to a European car garage that specialized in European cars (Volvos and Saabs). That is how they marketed themselves and they were really good at their work. While Joe Blow at AAA Car Repairs might actually have done a good job too, I had too many bad experiences taking it to generic fix-all shops to chance it. If the first time I went there, they were working on a Toyota or Ford, I probably would have questioned their dedication and specialization to my specific brand. Fair or not, that was the image that I wanted.

Granted, we are not talking about cars. We are talking about people, but from a business/marketing perspective, the principle is the exact same.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

It's not just about the actual hair cut. It's about the business image.

Maybe this will illustrate it better. I used to own a Volvo that would take to a European car garage that specialized in European cars (Volvos and Saabs). That is how they marketed themselves and they were really good at their work. While Joe Blow at AAA Car Repairs might actually have done a good job too, I had too many bad experiences taking it to generic fix-all shops to chance it. If the first time I went there, they were working on a Toyota or Ford, I probably would have questioned their dedication and specialization to my specific brand. Fairly or not, the image that I wanted.

Granted, we are not talking about cars. We are talking about people, but from a business/marketing perspective, the principle is the exact same.

I'm still not buying it, and your analogy doesn't make sense. A more apt comparison would be a Volvo owner wanting to get her engine and transmission serviced at the same shop as you but being turned away because her car is a different colour than the other vehicles they typically work on.

I think V is much closer to the mark when he says it's all about maintaining a "NO GIRLS ALLOWED" boys' club atmosphere. If that is indeed the case, I have absolutely zero sympathy for the business owner and the sexist clientele who would seek out such an establishment. I'd expect that kind of attitude to exist in places like Saudi Arabia but certainly not 21st century Canada.

[FireFly]

Originally Posted by t0rrent98

I seriously doubt she wanted to get a haircut from the barber shop. She's probably getting back at them because the Owner refused to go on a date with her. And thus she made up the excuse that she wanted a traditional haircut from a mens only barber shop.

Excellent example of a misogynist post. Your smiley at the end does not make your joke funny.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by FireFly

Excellent example of a misogynist post. Your smiley at the end does not make your joke funny.

That post fell into Poe's Law territory for me (even with the smiley at the end!). I'm honestly not sure if it was satire or if t0rrent8 was being sincere.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by V

It's not that complicated. They're promoting a vagina-free barber shop. Obviously there's demand for such a place, since they're still in business. Doesn't make it right, but it seems to have been working for them so far.

This has nothing to do with technique and everything to do with the fact that apparently some guys want to get their hair cut without the annoying presence of a woman in the room. I don't get it, and don't think it's right, but there appears to be a demand. By allowing women into the establishment they will potentially lose clientelle that enjoy visiting for the vagina-free atmosphere.

That's one thing I don't get. Every barber shop I've ever gone to has had women in it. Mothers take their sons to get haircuts; wives wait for their husbands; fathers bring their daughters along; and often there's a woman barber working there.

Does this place have a strict "No Girls Allowed" policy, or is it just for who sits in the chair?


They advertise boys cuts on their website, so they must surely get mothers bringing their sons in.

[indes]

The word misogynist gets thrown around way too loosely around here lol.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by indes

The word misogynist gets thrown around way too loosely around here lol.

lol.............indeed, silly females.

[indes]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

lol.............indeed, silly females.

Well that's a jump now isn't it?

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by indes

Well that's a jump now isn't it?

wait I thought that is what we were doing....based on your post...

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I think V is much closer to the mark when he says it's all about maintaining a "NO GIRLS ALLOWED" boys' club atmosphere. If that is indeed the case, I have absolutely zero sympathy for the business owner and the sexist clientele who would seek out such an establishment. I'd expect that kind of attitude to exist in places like Saudi Arabia but certainly not 21st century Canada.

There are all sorts of gender specific clubs and groups in Canada though so are those problematic? I have a friend who runs a company which organizes monthly outings and events specifically for females. There are countless professional groups and organizations for women in business/sciences/engineering/medicine etc. Some of those groups host events and seminars where they specifically seek out female presenters or speakers. How are these types of "girls" clubs any different?