[Signing] Flames Sign Devin Setoguchi to one year 750k deal.

[mile]

Originally Posted by doctajones428

Glencross - Backlund - Hudler
Gaudreau - Monahan - Colborne
Raymond - Stajan - Setoguchi
Bollig - Bouma - McGrattan
Byron, Jones

Giordano - Brodie
Smid - Wideman
Russell - Engelland
Wotherspoon

Ramo
Hiller

?

Other than Wotherspoon being in the AHL, I think this is bang on.

[Da_Chief]

To those who think the rooks are ready...

Gaudreau has played ZERO AHL games. 1 NHL game.

Baertschi has played 77 AHL games. 51 NHL games.

Granlund has played 56 AHL games. 7 NHL games.

Max has 2 seasons in the AHL.

Ferland 32 AHL games.

Knight 72 AHL games. 7 NHL games.

You get the picture, except Max everyone else is pretty much at 1 season in the AHL. I have no issues with them being groomed in the AHL.

Its a loss season anyways, I want a top 3 pick and with that lineup we pretty much will. Rather have AHL perfecting their game in the minors and winning as well.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Major Major

just out of curiosity, What does outgrowing the AHL look like? I know certainly that none of the Flames prospects have done this. The only guy I can think of is Nyquist last year started the year for Grand Rapids when he was clearly NHL ready, but that turned out pretty well.

We'll have to wait to training camp to see where everyone is. Players outgrow leagues all the time. There was no sense in Gaudreau going back to BC and there may be no sense in sending him to the AHL. This could also apply to Bartschi, Granlund and Reinhart or maybe even a couple of others. A guy like Bartschi didn't have great stats in the AHL but that wasn't the reason he was sent down. If management thinks he's learned what he needed, not giving him a shot when he knows he deserves it, isn't the way to treat our young players.

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

We'll have to wait to training camp to see where everyone is. Players outgrow leagues all the time. There was no sense in Gaudreau going back to BC and there may be no sense in sending him to the AHL. This could also apply to Bartschi, Granlund and Reinhart or maybe even a couple of others. A guy like Bartschi didn't have great stats in the AHL but that wasn't the reason he was sent down. If management thinks he's learned what he needed, not giving him a shot when he knows he deserves it, isn't the way to treat our young players.

I know it's semantics, but no one is given a shot. A young player rips his roster spot from the clutches of an established player or he certainly hasn't outgrown the second best professional league in the world.

If Gaudreau does what Monahan did last year, he will be on the team. The evidence is right there.

[Caged Great]

If 3 or 4 prospects show well enough in training camp to stick, then they'll stick and other players will get a seat in the press box including guys like Jones, Setoguchi, and Bollig. If not then they'll get prime ice time in the AHL. Either way it's a good situation. It's better to have insurance than not and Seto is insurance.

Treliving has said on several occasions that the young guys will be given an opportunity to take spots if they are ready. It's up to them though to take them. I'd much rather have a competition for spots than having a player being given one like Sven last year. He was terrible in the development camp, bad in the main camp and still was given a spot just because. Players should have to earn it. It fosters that hard working attitude that we all enjoyed about our team last year.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Major Major

I know it's semantics, but no one is given a shot. A young player rips his roster spot from the clutches of an established player or he certainly hasn't outgrown the second best professional league in the world.

If Gaudreau does what Monahan did last year, he will be on the team. The evidence is right there.

One thing is even Sutter wanted one or two rookies to make the team every season. It didn't always happen obviously and some mistakes were made favouring the vets and the biggest one was signing Anders Eriksson putting Giordano in the position of being forced to go to the KHL. Yeah I don't want to see a rookie given a spot but I don't want to see a vet get preferential treatment either and the odds are stacked for the vet just by virtue of their contract status.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

Quite the victim complex you have going on. Go back to Nik's post to which you are referring, and look through the rest of that thread. I remember having an 'excessively long' post for that one as well (and fairly sure others did as well). Don't know if I got thanked or not - when you check, can you tell me? Where was Nik's post stating that every time he posts, he gets attacked? Honestly, quit playing victim card - nobody really cares, and you are kidding yourself if you think people are just 'waiting' for you to post something so they can jump on you. I honestly couldn't care less who you are - the only reason I remember you is that you seemingly have these meltdowns on this site, and when people disagree with you, you play some sort of victim and instruct them on the steps to ignore you (do you still have that in your sig? Honest question, as I have sigs turned off).

I have never seen another poster on this forum get so defensive to the point they are screaming of being victimized. Lots of posters disagree with me, and that is fine with me. Heck, that is better, or the conversations on this site would be kind of boring, no?

As for the thread in question - the majority did seem to be in favor of Sven being demoted from what I remember. Feel free to count the yes and no posts if you like, but from what I remember, it clearly was NOT the 'consensus' you speak of at all. First couple of pages were all fairly positive to him being sent down it seems.

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=133001

wtf?

I pulled out the victim card because it's the same thing every god damn time. Believe it or not, I have received many PMs from posters who agree with me, whether they post in the thread or not to support me.

I posted that Baertschi was playing better/contributing more to the Flames than the likes of Colborne or Jones. I then get two responses that basically amount to "you're Ashasx, your opinion doesn't matter". How am I supposed to respond? My original post had nothing to do with being a victim, but when somebody calls me out like cam_wmh just did and fails to actually support his claim, yeah, I'm going to get angry and defend myself. I don't post looking for negative attention, but in situations like this, how can I not feel that people are looking to go after me?

The same people who call me a pessimist get mad at me when I rave about how good/valuable Brodie and Backlund are. It's infuriating that I can't have any strongly opinionated posts without somebody jumping on my back.

Here's what nik- wrote:

Originally Posted by nik-

I still think Sven's first benching was totally unwarranted and it seemingly derailed his season. There was a lot of players that deserved the bench before Sven 10 games in, and not just vets.

The thread you linked to me was made in the middle of December. Of course posters aren't going to be so dramatic when Hartley had already benched Sven half a dozen times. It's better for him to play somewhere than nowhere.

Why don't you find the thread of his first benching?

And before people start going off about how I derailed the thread - I didn't. I simply defended myself after others derailed it.

[Dion]

[MissTeeks]

Did I mention the offseason is too damn long? Can't you guys just ignore each other?

[ignite09]

I'll agree with ashasx to a degree here. During Svens first ten games before he was sat out, he looked decent to a lot of us here on CP. However, by the time the third benching came around, he was a shell of his former self. The AHL was the best place for him at that time. He did look better than Colborne and Jones by a long shot during the early stages of last season however.

[Fire]

Originally Posted by Major Major

I know it's semantics, but no one is given a shot. A young player rips his roster spot from the clutches of an established player or he certainly hasn't outgrown the second best professional league in the world.

If Gaudreau does what Monahan did last year, he will be on the team. The evidence is right there.

Monahan's situation was different. If he was AHL eligible would he have started in the NHL? I have my doubts.

My worry with signing these average NHLers like Setoguchi is that unless he is garbage in training camp and pre-season the Flames are not going to send him to the minors. For Gaudreau, Sven, Granlund, etc they can't just be equal to these one-way average NHL players they will have to be a lot better to make the team. Not exactly fair for them.

[Poe969]

Isn't that more of a reason for them to try and be better than everyone else?

[FlamesAddiction]

Back when the offseason started, Setoguchi was a player that I was hoping the Flames would target, so I am happy with this.

I wonder what changed in Treliving's mind. Earlier he said that we were done with free agents and would be looking down the trade route for future roster changes.

I hope that if some of the prospects looked poised for the NHL in October, that we make room for them somehow, but I feel Setoguchi could be a good asset for this team.

[djsFlames]

Gaudreau will make the squad and feed a soon to be valuable asset Setoguchi on the PP, I'm not worried. But in reality I do hope this works out to be a better local signing than Galiardi was.. I want to see some free agents rebound here rather than just postpone the end of their careers.

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I wonder what changed in Treliving's mind. Earlier he said that we were done with free agents and would be looking down the trade route for future roster changes.

Most likely Setoguchi's $ and/or term demands dropped

[Henry Fool]

From what I saw of him in Minnesota, if the kids are ready for the NHL they are going to beat him over the long run. They are simply more dynamic and harder working. Setoguchi might have ten games where he looks like a different player, but my expectations over the entire season are low.

Still, I wish him all the best. Perhaps he can turn it around, rare as that is.

[Yrebmi]

Baertschi's performance compared to Colborne at any point last season seems odd to me unless you're comparing them at the same position. I don't think anyone is trying to say Sven more deserved Joe's eventual slot on right wing or even center. So what is really being complained about is that Joe's signing allowed a better left wing to continue to play left wing. Setto signing does the same I guess. Just looks like misdirected anger/blame to me. Baertschi being debatably better at LW than Colborne at RW doesn't matter.

[gargamel]

Originally Posted by Falclore

The only way for Baertschi and Gaudreau to be top six forwards in the league is to beat out guys like Setoguchi at camp and throughout the season. Depth can only ever be a good thing.

They (or at least Gaudreau) would beat out Setoguchi and Raymond in a fair competition right now, but are we really going to put Treliving's new signings on waivers within a few months of acquiring them? I'm all for making the young guys earn their spots, but it doesn't seem like they're even going to be given that chance.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by gargamel

They (or at least Gaudreau) would beat out Setoguchi and Raymond in a fair competition right now, but are we really going to put Treliving's new signings on waivers within a few months of acquiring them? I'm all for making the young guys earn their spots, but it doesn't seem like they're even going to be given that chance.

I'd say temper your expectations a bit if you think Gaudreau has already "beat out" a player who is coming off a 20-25-45 point season.

And if you're right, they will easily find a spot for a player capable of putting up 50 points so there's 0 worries.

[Split98]

Originally Posted by gargamel

They (or at least Gaudreau) would beat out Setoguchi and Raymond in a fair competition right now, but are we really going to put Treliving's new signings on waivers within a few months of acquiring them? I'm all for making the young guys earn their spots, but it doesn't seem like they're even going to be given that chance.

I see where you're going with this, but the contract he gave Seto is very much a 'prove you belong on the team'. Just like the kids, he now has a spot in training camp and needs to prove he belongs here.