Prediction 14/15: Who makes the jump?

[c.t.ner]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

That's all well and good and I understand the concern... but how do you keep him off the Flames if he has 3 goals and 4 assists in 6 preseason games. You don't have a ton of choice but to keep him up.

How do you tell the kid in training camp, "Johnny, it doesn't matter how good you play. We don't think you can play a full NHL season so you get to play in Adirondack this year."

Not only that... during the summer development camp he was the best player in terms of endurance.

Sure having a great preseason will make it hard for management and there will be fan pressure to keep him up, but given that Trevling has said he doesn't want to rush players and Burke has already talked about tempering expectations for kids, I don't think it's unreasonable that management will send him down to Adirondack for at least the first half of the year.

And even if he does rip it up during pre-season all the Flames need to say is "keep that pace up in the AHL for a few months and you'll be one of the first call-ups". Lots of young players have ripped it up in the Preseason only to come crashing down to earth when the pros catch-up.

IMO There's no harm in having Johnny Hockey adjust to the daily grind of pro hockey in the AHL and building some chemistry with guys like Poirier, Arnold, Grandlund, Reinhart and others that he'll be playing with for years. As I said a good chunk of the College kids started burning out last year around the 30-40 game mark and there is a solid chance that Johnny may face that too. Doesn't really matter if he's got top notch endurance. It's the mental riger of a 82 games schedule vs. 45-50 game schedule that's the difference. Plus if he's tearing up the AHL at that point and doesn't look like there are signs that he's slowing down, then call him up.

Giving him first and second line minutes for the first half of the season (or the entire season) in the AHL will be far more important for his development long term over playing 3rd/4th line minutes or even on the bench in his first Pro season.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

The speed and skill in the AHL is better than that of the NCAA and the NHL is better than that in the AHL. It is simply a stepping stone to allow his adjustment to be smoother. There is no reason to throw him to the wolves and play him in the NHL immediately, the risk of rushing him is too significant. Let's let him develop properly.

Couldn't you say the same about an 18 year old Monahan? Take the stepping stones, don't rush? Well, no he earned his way onto the team and according to the coaching staff it was equally as much because of his maturity and hockey sense than his skill. He was able to adapt and had the smarts to make the transition at such a young age.

Now Johnny will be 21 when training camp rolls around. And those were 3 extra years well needed. While Sean was very good last fall in proving himself, I have little doubt that Johnny will stand out even more. But they won't pick him to stay on the team because of his skill and ability to score, it'll be for the same reasons they kept Monahan. If you go by the word of the BC staff and his coach he's an extremely mature person and player. And very coachable, and his smarts are off the chart. Both he and Monahan had qualities that would hold them back going in - Monahan being only 18, and Johnny with his size. But both have the qualities that solidify their places on the team, which is maturity, adaptability and hockey sense. This is a big strength of Monahan's, but an even bigger one for Johnny. He's one of the smartest young players I've seen. If he's got the tools to be in the NHL now, then they'll look past the size issue, just as they looked past the age/development issue with Sean.

Reason he doesn't go down to Adirondack is because of what's between his ears. He's got more hockey smarts than any of the kids that needed AHL time. He just understands the game at a very advanced level, and needs to in order to do the things he can do on the ice. He'll adapt to the NHL with much more ease because of this, just as Money did.

[FlameZilla]

I voted for Reinhart, Wotherspoon & Poirier. I think he is NHL-ready, and if he's fit for training camp I think he'll be in the opening lineup.

I think Gaudreau will be one of the first injury call-ups.

Bennett might get a 9 game audition, but I feel it would be better for his development to go to junior.

Baertschi could play himself onto the team. I hope he does, but it's all up to him at this point.

[Nehkara]

Originally Posted by c.t.ner

Sure having a great preseason will make it hard for management and there will be fan pressure to keep him up, but given that Trevling has said he doesn't want to rush players and Burke has already talked about tempering expectations for kids, I don't think it's unreasonable that management will send him down to Adirondack for at least the first half of the year.

And even if he does rip it up during pre-season all the Flames need to say is "keep that pace up in the AHL for a few months and you'll be one of the first call-ups". Lots of young players have ripped it up in the Preseason only to come crashing down to earth when the pros catch-up.

IMO There's no harm in having Johnny Hockey adjust to the daily grind of pro hockey in the AHL and building some chemistry with guys like Poirier, Arnold, Grandlund, Reinhart and others that he'll be playing with for years. As I said a good chunk of the College kids started burning out last year around the 30-40 game mark and there is a solid chance that Johnny may face that too. Doesn't really matter if he's got top notch endurance. It's the mental riger of a 82 games schedule vs. 45-50 game schedule that's the difference. Plus if he's tearing up the AHL at that point and doesn't look like there are signs that he's slowing down, then call him up.

Giving him first and second line minutes for the first half of the season (or the entire season) in the AHL will be far more important for his development long term over playing 3rd/4th line minutes or even on the bench in his first Pro season.

I absolutely agree with you on one point here... there is absolutely no point in Johnny playing outside of the top 6, whether it's in Calgary or Adirondack.

If he is looking at 3rd or 4th line duty in Calgary then it would be better to send him down so he can play on the top line in Adirondack.

[ForeverFlameFan]

^ There is no way Johnny gets 3rd/4th line duty.

[Nehkara]

Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan

^ There is no way Johnny gets 3rd/4th line duty.

Exactly.

[codynw]

Originally Posted by FlameZilla

I voted for Reinhart, Wotherspoon & Poirier. I think he is NHL-ready, and if he's fit for training camp I think he'll be in the opening lineup.

Will Poirier even be able to play at training camp? He just had shoulder surgery, not sure when he'll be ready to play again.

Originally Posted by Nehkara

I absolutely agree with you on one point here... there is absolutely no point in Johnny playing outside of the top 6, whether it's in Calgary or Adirondack.

If he is looking at 3rd or 4th line duty in Calgary then it would be better to send him down so he can play on the top line in Adirondack.

I don't get this because Calgary doesn't even have a "top 6". If he makes it, he'll play sheltered minutes like every other rookie. Probably about 12-15 minutes a night, until he starts to earn more.

[codynw]

double post

[Nehkara]

Originally Posted by codynw

Will Poirier even be able to play at training camp? He just had shoulder surgery, not sure when he'll be ready to play again.

He will be at training camp but they don't think he will be able to fully participate. He will be re-evaluated in August and things might change then.

I don't get this because Calgary doesn't even have a "top 6". If he makes it, he'll play sheltered minutes like every other rookie. Probably about 12-15 minutes a night, until he starts to earn more.

I just mean there's no point in playing him in a checking/energy/enforcing role. He should be on a scoring line.

[djsFlames]

If (when) Johnny makes the team, He'll be skating on Monahan and Colborne's left side..book it!

Why the #### would he be playing with the grinders?

[puckedoff]

Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan

Lol, why?

Originally Posted by djsFlames

If (when) Johnny makes the team, He'll be skating on Monahan and Colborne's left side..book it!

Why the #### would he be playing with the grinders?

That would be an awesome line.

PLY - SNP - PWF

[Nehkara]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

If (when) Johnny makes the team, He'll be skating on Monahan and Colborne's left side..book it!

Why the #### would he be playing with the grinders?

I suggested that line this morning in AC's Gaudreau WC highlights thread.

[kermitology]

Gaudreau
Reinhart

Wotherspoon

c.t.ner, I'm not certain what difference it makes if Gaudreau can't handle the increase in games.. he'll have to be prepared to play in 70-80 games this season regardless. Practicing with the NHL team is going to be better for his skill set anyways as well.

I think that unless he destroys the pre-season, there are injuries to the top 6 in pre-season, or a trade, he starts in the AHL. But as soon as he gets his chance to play in the NHL, he won't go away.

Reinhart is the guy who can fit into more places in the NHL lineup. Top 6, 3rd line, 4th line, centre, wing.. he's going to find a place to play. Whereas guys like Baertschi or Granlund probably need to play in more of a top 6 role to be used effectively.

Wotherspoon looked awesome to me in his NHL stint. I don't think any other defensive prospect is at his level there. He just seems like the quiet solid defenceman that has the best chance of regular Flames NHL duty right now.

[bubbsy]

i think 1 or 2 forwards, and no d actually make the team out of camp.

My money is on Gaudreau, Baertchi as the forwards, and picked wotherspoon as he'd be the first dman callup.

That being said, i have no doubt that injuries, etc, will result in us getting to watch the following others this season at some point for varying number of games:
reinhart, granlund, knight, and maybe even ferland, hanowski, van brabant

if the flames really are a bottom 5 team this year, it's really interesting just how many young assets the flames will have in the stable after the next draft. the frigin prospect polls will have to start the day after the draft just to finish in time for camp

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

i think 1 or 2 forwards, and no d actually make the team out of camp.

My money is on Gaudreau, Baertchi as the forwards, and picked wotherspoon as he'd be the first dman callup.

That being said, i have no doubt that injuries, etc, will result in us getting to watch the following others this season at some point for varying number of games:
reinhart, granlund, knight, and maybe even ferland, hanowski, van brabant

if the flames really are a bottom 5 team this year, it's really interesting just how many young assets the flames will have in the stable after the next draft. the frigin prospect polls will have to start the day after the draft just to finish in time for camp

Actually, unless we pick up another d-man on a 1-way contract before the season, at least one defenceman will have to make the team, as we only have 6 NHL players currently on the roster - Brodie, Gio, Wideman, Smid, Russell, Engelland.

Edit: They won't go forward into the season without an extra skater on D. And often teams will actually carry 8 players on the back end.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by puckedoff

That would be an awesome line.

PLY - SNP - PWF

Joe Colborne: Power Forward.

.
.
.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

If (when) Johnny makes the team, He'll be skating on Monahan and Colborne's left side..book it!

Why the #### would he be playing with the grinders?

3 players that are natural playmakers on the same line. That should be effective.

Glencross should play with Monahan and Colborne because it gives them a shooter on the line. I would play Gaudreau with Stajan and Hudler personally.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by puckedoff

That would be an awesome line.

PLY - SNP - PWF

crash pass and stash

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

3 players that are natural playmakers on the same line. That should be effective.

Glencross should play with Monahan and Colborne because it gives them a shooter on the line. I would play Gaudreau with Stajan and Hudler personally.

Monahan 22 goals and 12 assists a playmaker..... He is a goal scorer. a lot of his goals goals were just ordinary plays with him sniping...

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by c.t.ner

Sure having a great preseason will make it hard for management and there will be fan pressure to keep him up, but given that Trevling has said he doesn't want to rush players and Burke has already talked about tempering expectations for kids, I don't think it's unreasonable that management will send him down to Adirondack for at least the first half of the year.

And even if he does rip it up during pre-season all the Flames need to say is "keep that pace up in the AHL for a few months and you'll be one of the first call-ups". Lots of young players have ripped it up in the Preseason only to come crashing down to earth when the pros catch-up.

IMO There's no harm in having Johnny Hockey adjust to the daily grind of pro hockey in the AHL and building some chemistry with guys like Poirier, Arnold, Grandlund, Reinhart and others that he'll be playing with for years. As I said a good chunk of the College kids started burning out last year around the 30-40 game mark and there is a solid chance that Johnny may face that too. Doesn't really matter if he's got top notch endurance. It's the mental riger of a 82 games schedule vs. 45-50 game schedule that's the difference. Plus if he's tearing up the AHL at that point and doesn't look like there are signs that he's slowing down, then call him up.

Giving him first and second line minutes for the first half of the season (or the entire season) in the AHL will be far more important for his development long term over playing 3rd/4th line minutes or even on the bench in his first Pro season.

yep the flames had a private jet waiting for his college career to end .... so he wouldn't play another year and walk away a UFA.

You don't think maybe that Burke told Gaudreau and his parents that he would be given a near golden opportunity to be making $925k next year with a shot at some of the other 925 K in bonuses ...... rather than $70k playing in the AHL??


If it was the signing bonus of 185K (2 years) and AHL contract of 70 K Gaudreau would have stayed in BU and been able to pick his team this time next year.