Jay Feaster update (Stan Fischler interview)

[Split98]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

I think what you pointed out were small transactions, minimal trades off a bottom feeder team, compared to Feaster who was armed with Iginla, Bouwmeester, Regehr and returned with minimal return. Those were big transactions, and as you'd expect, big transactions get critisized more than middle ones.

I think the transactions that are better comparable would be something like Feaster's trades like a draft pick for PL3, Freddy Modin, Tim Jackman, Blair Jones, David Jones and SOB, and Denis Wideman.

Feaster's "win's like Erixon trade, Hudler... (can't think of any other win's he's had) probably would be on par with something like us trading Reto Berra for a 2nd, and Stempniak for a 3rd.

(FWIW I do not consider the Bollig deal to be a bad trade at all. I rather like the deal. The David Wolf comment is really short sighted, I do not consider this to be a bad deal as there is pretty much no risk to this.)

Treliving and Burke don't have to deal with the mess Feaster had to sort out, so they don't have an Iginla and Regehr to try and get value for. They have a clean slate to build off of, no gigantic NMCs to navigate around and a prospect pool to work with... thanks to Feaster.

And yes, all of it is short sighted and I don't hate any of their moves yet and I am jacked having Burke, Treliving and Conroy at the helm. I'm just addressing the 'Feaster sucked, Treliving is great!' idea. I'm thankful for what Feaster did to get us to the point where the current crew can keep building a fun team.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Split98

Treliving and Burke don't have to deal with the mess Feaster had to sort out, so they don't have an Iginla and Regehr to try and get value for. They have a clean slate to build off of, no gigantic NMCs to navigate around and a prospect pool to work with... thanks to Feaster.

And yes, all of it is short sighted and I don't hate any of their moves yet. I'm just addressing the 'Feaster sucked, Treliving is great!' idea.

What was the mess? Kotalik, Hagman and Stajan right? (Total, I believe $7-8M)

The solution was giving up Regehr to move Kotalik (Kotalik ended up leaving for Europe anyways, oops)..... Hagman was selected off re-entry waivers, so we had to eat half of his salary..... Stajan is still here.

Feaster's mess he did leave behind included Shane OBrien, David Jones, Denis Wideman, which totals $11M. You could argue we had to move Sarich and Tanguay's salary, both both guys were signed by Feaster. While I agree Feaster acquired a mess, I don't believe he left less dead anchor contracts.
EDIT: I also do not consider Feaster to just be the man that took out the garbage, because one of the contracts he did go after was Brad Ricards..... which would be a dead anchor long term deal. He himself tried to lock us up with a long term, NMC deal.

Thanks Jay.

[Split98]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

What was the mess? Kotalik, Hagman and Stajan right? (Total, I believe $7-8M)

The solution was giving up Regehr to move Kotalik (Kotalik ended up leaving for Europe anyways, oops)..... Hagman was selected off re-entry waivers, so we had to eat half of his salary..... Stajan is still here.

Feaster's mess he did leave behind included Shane OBrien, David Jones, Denis Wideman, which totals $11M. You could argue we had to move Sarich and Tanguay's salary, both both guys were signed by Feaster.

Thanks Jay.

Hagman and Kotalik were one part of the mess. Half the team being on NMCs was another part of it, paired with being at the salary cap missing the playoffs. Not to mention we had little to no prospects to speak of.

Navigating through that was going to cause a few complications, for sure. I would have liked to get a lot more for Regehr and Kotalik taking off really can't be held against Feaster. Definitely an oopsies, but not something Feaster can be blamed for can he?

Again, I would have liked more for Bouw and O'Brien was a puzzler but every move not being a grand slam puts Feaster in the 'not great' category but most certainly not the 'travesty' category.

Wideman has been injured. Before that, I still love the acquisition and hope he can become a valuable part of our team.

Stajan, a Sutter acquisition, is an asset to this team and I'm glad he's still here.

David Jones was a gamble I'm glad we took. The potential was definitely worth the risk, and I still think he could become a valuable part of this team if he can work out his game.

I loved having Sarich and Tanguay here.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Split98

Hagman and Kotalik were one part of the mess. Half the team being on NMCs was another part of it, paired with being at the salary cap missing the playoffs. Not to mention we had little to no prospects to speak of.

Navigating through that was going to cause a few complications, for sure. I would have liked to get a lot more for Regehr and Kotalik taking off really can't be held against Feaster. Definitely an oopsies, but not something Feaster can be blamed for can he?

So would you define the "team is in a mess" to just be because of NTC/NMC?

Do you consider Doug Wilson (SJ), Dean Lombardi (LA) to have left their teams in a mess?

As for little to no prospects.... sure it wasn't as deep (thanks in large part to trading a franchise forward and franchise defenseman, and a early 1st round draft pick) but I don't believe that "no prospects" stuff to be true. Gio, Brodie, Backlund. But hey... thats the victim of being a playoff team. Look at LA, after Toffoli they don't have a ton of prospects. And drafting.... again I fail to give credit to a GM when the GM himself admits he never watched any of the games of the prospects he drafted... but similarly I cannot blame him for the Jankowski pick either.

Personally - I put him in the catagory of "terrible" more than travesty. I think if Brad Richards, and ROR fiasco (no mater what % of likeliness it would have occurred) came to fruition, then it would be a travesty. As of this time, just the catagory of "terrible." Glad he's gone.

[StrykerSteve]

Originally Posted by Thor

For us that missed this thread, can anyone link to that infamous thread?

The post that started it all.

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpos...&postcount=126

Enjoy, lol.

[Split98]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

So would you define the "team is in a mess" to just be because of NTC/NMC?

Do you consider Doug Wilson (SJ), Dean Lombardi (LA) to have left their teams in a mess?

As for little to no prospects.... sure it wasn't as deep (thanks in large part to trading a franchise forward and franchise defenseman, and a early 1st round draft pick) but I don't believe that "no prospects" stuff to be true. Gio, Brodie, Backlund. But hey... thats the victim of being a playoff team. Look at LA, after Toffoli they don't have a ton of prospects. And drafting.... again I fail to give credit to a GM when the GM himself admits he never watched any of the games of the prospects he drafted... but similarly I cannot blame him for the Jankowski pick either.

Bah, agree to disagree then.

[Hanna Sniper]

In only a short run he sure had a lot of screwup that "he can't be blamed for" and a whole lot of excuses for his action. Imagine if we kept him for 6 years. The amount of errors should be the sum total of a long success full career that allows you to look past it... with successes that are a much higher level than your biggest failure

- He made the origination look like idiots with how the Iginla trade happened (not talking return).
- ROR -brain fart
- Trading away Regehr, Iginla, Bouw and trying Kipper and only have hope to sell as your return. You don't have to win them all, hell maybe not even half but you need something other then future consideration (a unknown draft selection)
- Richards - the one issue he's credited with corrected is the one issues he would have screwed us over with if he had his way... thank Richards didn't want to be on his team for us not being in cap hell not Feaster

Sorry that's too much for such as small time period.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Split98

Just... no. To all of that... no.

Feaster didn't inherit a championship team and ruin it. Give me one example of that the current management group has done that is better than what Feaster had done.

Not sign Denis Wideman to a terrible long term deal and overpay. Not chase after Brad Richards in an attempt to cripple our franchise. Not trade away a first round pick for nothing. Not tell us one thing and do another. Actually sound like they know what their doing.

[Split98]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Not sign Denis Wideman to a terrible long term deal and overpay. Not chase after Brad Richards in an attempt to cripple our franchise. Not trade away a first round pick for nothing. Not tell us one thing and do another. Actually sound like they know what their doing.

I'm confused. So is an example of good hockey players "not Babe Ruth"?

[Hackey]

That makes two of us.

[Beatle17]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

So would you define the "team is in a mess" to just be because of NTC/NMC?

Do you consider Doug Wilson (SJ), Dean Lombardi (LA) to have left their teams in a mess?

As for little to no prospects.... sure it wasn't as deep (thanks in large part to trading a franchise forward and franchise defenseman, and a early 1st round draft pick) but I don't believe that "no prospects" stuff to be true. Gio, Brodie, Backlund. But hey... thats the victim of being a playoff team. Look at LA, after Toffoli they don't have a ton of prospects. And drafting.... again I fail to give credit to a GM when the GM himself admits he never watched any of the games of the prospects he drafted... but similarly I cannot blame him for the Jankowski pick either.

Personally - I put him in the catagory of "terrible" more than travesty. I think if Brad Richards, and ROR fiasco (no mater what % of likeliness it would have occurred) came to fruition, then it would be a travesty. As of this time, just the catagory of "terrible." Glad he's gone.

So how much are the Flames paying these guys, oh I see "If" it had happened it would have been brutal. But what "if" they both happened and turned out to be 70 point players. Then he wouldn't have had to trade Iggy, Tanguay, Bouwmeester and the Flames "could" have been a playoff team. Let it go, neither thing happened and did not effect the Flames, it gets tired reading all of the "what if's" and bashing someone for what "didn't" happen. If my uncle had boobs he'd be my aunt.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Beatle17

So how much are the Flames paying these guys, oh I see "If" it had happened it would have been brutal. But what "if" they both happened and turned out to be 70 point players. Then he wouldn't have had to trade Iggy, Tanguay, Bouwmeester and the Flames "could" have been a playoff team. Let it go, neither thing happened and did not effect the Flames, it gets tired reading all of the "what if's" and bashing someone for what "didn't" happen. If my uncle had boobs he'd be my aunt.

Both moves helped cement the flames as a joke around the league by media/fans etc. one of the reasons Burke canned Feaster and Weisbroad was due to their reputation among their peers. Both of those terrible attempts at avoiding the rebuild contributed to the reputation

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Split98

Treliving and Burke don't have to deal with the mess Feaster had to sort out, so they don't have an Iginla and Regehr to try and get value for. They have a clean slate to build off of, no gigantic NMCs to navigate around and a prospect pool to work with... thanks to Feaster.

And yes, all of it is short sighted and I don't hate any of their moves yet and I am jacked having Burke, Treliving and Conroy at the helm. I'm just addressing the 'Feaster sucked, Treliving is great!' idea. I'm thankful for what Feaster did to get us to the point where the current crew can keep building a fun team.

So this mess Feaster sorted out was getting 4 mediocre prospects and 2 late fist rounders for our 2 most expensive assets and our goalie retired who had the 4th largest cap hit on the team at the time.

Dennis Wideman is a worse contract than Feaster ever inherited with a full NMC. However since Treliving inherited a team at the bottom (partially due to how Feaster handled the team) the contract won't really impact him.

Feaster slowly killed the team for 3 years I don't see how that is something to be thankful for?

Honestly reading people defend Feaster is making me dislike what we did here even more. Like I said in an earlier post. Feaster inherited a team tat made the playoffs 5 out of the previous 6 seasons so yeah the prospect pool was weak. He missed the playoffs all 3 years he ran the team and finally traded vets for futures so yeah Treliving inherited a nice prospect pool but shouldn't that be expected?

[Beatle17]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Both moves helped cement the flames as a joke around the league by media/fans etc. one of the reasons Burke canned Feaster and Weisbroad was due to their reputation among their peers. Both of those terrible attempts at avoiding the rebuild contributed to the reputation

Show one quote from a reputable hockey person that says the Flames are considered a joke around the league please. The hyperbole you continue to use is actually quite funny.

[Tinordi]

Wow if you think it was Feaster who ruined the flames. Sure he didn't help prolong the run of mediocrity that defined this era but the decline was baked in well before he took the reigns.

He took over a cap team who hasn't made the playoffs in the years, that had zero elite prospects, and was being run to with every transaction made to win the next game and squeak into eighth.

[EYE_Overstand]

Feaster wasn't as bad as some think... And at the same time, he wasn't as good as people think

[Rhubarb]

Since when did Wideman become the worst defencemen in the history of the NHL with a budget ripping contract for just under a century to boot. He didn't have a great year last year but this persistent viewpoint from some that this is the worst handicapping and unprecedentedly horrible contract in the history of the team is ridiculous. Is he a little overpaid, maybe, but hardly a terrible defenceman.

The Feaster rippers I think seem to forget what a mess this team was when he took over. Wideman, worst contract and worst defencemen ever, hardly. Jones, nowhere near as bad as some seem to think. SOB, not great to be sure, but do people remember the last few months of Alex T here, I do, and I will still take Jones.

Feaster may not have gotten the best out of some of the trades, but he wasn't dealing from a position of strength, everyone in the league, and their dogs, new that Calgary had to rebuild. You really want to lay blame for Feasters lack of wins, put it on the doorstep of ownership, who forced him to keep players, not just past their prime trading window, but to the point of making it glaringly obvious to the entire league and the chl and the ahl that players had to go from Calgary.

[Scoreface]

Ridiculous that some use the playoffs as a benchmark for Feaster's tenure. They'd be the same ones choked more than they believe their team choked if futures were traded to attempt to attain their lofty goal of 8th place.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

...one of the reasons Burke canned Feaster and Weisbroad was due to their reputation among their peers...

That's news to me. When did he say this? I think he might have implied as much about Weisbrod, but Feaster?

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Not sign Denis Wideman to a terrible long term deal and overpay. Not chase after Brad Richards in an attempt to cripple our franchise. Not trade away a first round pick for nothing. Not tell us one thing and do another. Actually sound like they know what their doing.

The only time Feaster traded a first-round pick was to pick up a second in exchange for moving down in round one. That is most certainly not "nothing."