Well clearly people have different opinions and insights on these players. What is the point of running a poll if everyone viewed it the same way?
For example, PMM has watched Knight in Abbotsford and thinks he can be a top two line player. He isn't a bottom 6 player in everyone's eyes. With Ferland, some people don't see him as a 2nd line power forward (I personally lean towards seeing him as one though).
Just to clear that up a bit though, Ward himself said if Corban's going to make the NHL, it's going to be as a top 6 offensive player, not as a grinder/defensive specialist.
I just think Knight's skill is a little underrated on CP.
The general consensus around here seems to be that Knight is pretty much a surefire unexceptional NHLer. In my mind, where he goes in our rankings is the line where prospects ranked below him are not likely to be impact NHLers, or where a prospects upside stops being so exceptional that their risk is kind of accounted for. (Jankowski above the line, Roy is below)
Last year I was watching Horak for similar reasons. The Smid trade really illustrates just how valuable having a strong prospect pool is. We won that trade handily, but it goes to show that all of the prospects ranked above Corban Knight could return NHL players in a trade today.
It's hard to understate the importance of the influx of talent the Flames have been drafting recently.
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Last edited by TheDebaser; 07-25-2014 at 06:19 PM.
I voted for Kulak last time (or was it the poll before?), so I'm down for him again. Ferland's injury hurt his stock and I'd rather vote for what could be a top 4 defenseman over a guy who will likely play in the bottom six with all the talent projected at the top 6 forward ranks. We don't really have a dearth of top 4 D prospects like we have at forward, so Kulak is mu man here.
Ferland over Agostino makes zero sense. Aggo had a great NCAA career and has shown he's NHL ready. Ferland was barely a pro until he had a good camp last year and put up a decent AHL record.
Right now it should be Aggo, Knight or one of the defensemen (I choose Roy). Something weird is definitely going on here...
Ferland over Agostino makes zero sense. Aggo had a great NCAA career and has shown he's NHL ready. Ferland was barely a pro until he had a good camp last year and put up a decent AHL record.
Right now it should be Aggo, Knight or one of the defensemen (I choose Roy). Something weird is definitely going on here...
Can't speak for any one else that voted for Ferland, but for me, I think Ferland has a higher ceiling than Agostino which, in this case, pushed him higher than Agostino being closer to the NHL.
Ferland over Agostino makes zero sense. Aggo had a great NCAA career and has shown he's NHL ready. Ferland was barely a pro until he had a good camp last year and put up a decent AHL record.
Right now it should be Aggo, Knight or one of the defensemen (I choose Roy). Something weird is definitely going on here...
Ferland is a more interesting prospect than that.
He started out his year in Abby being pretty ineffective. After about 10 games though the points just started rolling in. These weren't bad points either, he wouldn't just be picking up the garbage, he was making plays. He scored at over a point per game until his injury. The fact that he is capable of doing that in the AHL is what makes him a good prospect.
In addition, he's a powerforward RW who can throw punches with the tough guys, which is exactly what the flames need sharing the wings with Baertschi or Gaudreau. If anyone comes knocking on Johnny Hockeys door, good ol' one-punch Ferland can answer the call.
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Last edited by TheDebaser; 07-25-2014 at 06:20 PM.
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Just to clear that up a bit though, Ward himself said if Corban's going to make the NHL, it's going to be as a top 6 offensive player, not as a grinder/defensive specialist.
I just think Knight's skill is a little underrated on CP.
While I have much respect for Wards opinion, he sure did not look like a kid with tools to be in the top 6 during his stint with the Flames. In fact he was probably the most underwhelming of the forwards called up. Of course we'll see with a little more development time but for a guy who's coming on 24 he's not looking like a player that's bound for a top six role. Bottom 6 is looking a lot more realistic at this point.
Ferland had a really nice finish to his season before the injury and Conroy had mentioned he was going to be called up. 17 pts in his last 12 games is a lot to ask for again obviously, but when you are a bruiser and fighter with offensive skills like that a floor of 2nd line power forward is not unreasonable to think. Just hope he continues to progress and it's not a case of small sample size fluke.
He started out his year in Abby being pretty ineffective. After about 10 games though the points just started rolling in. These weren't bad points either, he wouldn't just be picking up the garbage, he was making plays. He scored at over a point per game until his injury. The fact that he is capable of doing that in the AHL is what makes him a good prospect.
In addition, he's a powerforward RW who can throw punches with the tough guys, which is exactly what the flames need sharing the wings with Baertschi or Gaudreau. If anyone comes knocking on Johnny Hockeys door, good ol' one-punch Ferland can answer the call.
Nailed it.
I recommend watching some of his fight videos. About one or two in you'll change your outlook on Ferland, he is an absolute beast and could impact games through big plays (has great hands and shot) and dropping the gloves (one of the best young fighters I've seen). Barring any more bad luck - and he's had enough of it lately - he could come out and surprise a LOT of people this fall.
Yeah, big power forward with nice hands, can skate, and likes to fight is a big for me. Sure could use that in the top six. I want to see how he bounces back from his injury though. Small sample size, so can't rate him higher than Kulak tho.
Question. Does organizational need at this point (top 4 D upside in Kulak) outweigh a guy like Ferland (injury perhaps notwithstanding) since we seem to have a glut of forwards we're pencilling in at that level?
Ferland definitely brings another element to the equation though, which did make me think twice about him. Sucks he got hurt..
He started out his year in Abby being pretty ineffective. After about 10 games though the points just started rolling in. These weren't bad points either, he wouldn't just be picking up the garbage, he was making plays. He scored at over a point per game until his injury. The fact that he is capable of doing that in the AHL is what makes him a good prospect.
In addition, he's a powerforward RW who can throw punches with the tough guys, which is exactly what the flames need sharing the wings with Baertschi or Gaudreau. If anyone comes knocking on Johnny Hockeys door, good ol' one-punch Ferland can answer the call.
For those who don't know
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I never included Ferland, because he only played 25 games. If I had though, here's his line:
Ferland - .72 ppg - 21 yo
Again, it's important to understand that he spent around 10 of his 25 games warming up to the league. If he didn't get injured I guarantee that number would be higher.
While I have much respect for Wards opinion, he sure did not look like a kid with tools to be in the top 6 during his stint with the Flames. In fact he was probably the most underwhelming of the forwards called up. Of course we'll see with a little more development time but for a guy who's coming on 24 he's not looking like a player that's bound for a top six role. Bottom 6 is looking a lot more realistic at this point.
Even if Ferland doesn't make it as a top 6 winger, he's got really good chance to be an excellent 3rd line guy who fights, scores and hits. Very unique to our system. Interesting to see people go with Knight who's ceiling is probably 3rd liner at best. Not really seeing where he fits in long term either. The only things going his way are size and RH shot, seems like a good guy though, maybe he becomes a character player with intangibles... After this I'm looking at some combination of Kulak/Culkin/Smith/McDonald, haven't sorted it out yet. Almost forgot, can't forget about Agostino... he's right in that mix too. We sure have a lot of good young players!
I decided to look at the best rookies over the last 10 years, along with their ages, just out of curiosity:
Boyd - .91 ppg - 20 yo
Granlund - .88 ppg - 20 yo Moss - .76 ppg - 24 yo Taratukhin - .75 ppg - 23 yo Knight - .63 ppg - 23 yo
Backlund - .59 ppg - 20 yo Van Der Gulik - .54 ppg - 23 yo Sylvester - .53 ppg - 22 yo
Horak - .51 ppg - 21 yo
Nemisz - .49 ppg - 20 yo
Bolded the guys who's rookie seasons were at a similar age as Knight's.
Hopefully his career path follows Moss' and not Van Der Gulik's.
Granlund's name right beside Boyd's gives me pause, noticed it right away. Same age, same size, same PPG, similar type of player... hopefully different result
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