[News] Weisbroad named VP player personnel in Vancouver

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Galakanokis

The STH meeting is tomorrow I will see if he is around. Decent place to introduce him I guess.

Interesting move, I don't really know what he did here in his time. One story says he was responsible for all the picks and the next one says just a few were his. Vancouver is in a tough spot. I imagine Benning and Weisbrod are gone before any of their picks make much of an impact.

Brian Burke didn't know either.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Geez, a lot of hate for a guy that did some good things in his time with the Flames. Is his crime being too closely tied to Feaster and his regime? Whatever his flaws, he seemed to understand that hockey IQ and character were ultimately the best traits for an NHL level prospect. I'm thankful that he helped rework our scouting focus so that we drafted some great players under his watch.

Some people's memories are so short.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I dislike Francis as much as the next guy but the guys on 960 kind of mirrored Francis the day he and Feaster were fired by Burke that Weisbrod was not well received in some NHL circles. It was really odd because nobody ever said anything bad about the guy and the moment he was fired the comments started coming out. I believe he wasn't even well liked within the Bruins organization.

Source? Clearly he was liked by someone in the Bruins organization…*cough* Benning *cough*.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

Geez, a lot of hate for a guy that did some good things in his time with the Flames. Is his crime being too closely tied to Feaster and his regime? Whatever his flaws, he seemed to understand that hockey IQ and character were ultimately the best traits for an NHL level prospect. I'm thankful that he helped rework our scouting focus so that we drafted some great players under his watch.

Some people's memories are so short.

Character and Hockey IQ were already a focus before Weisbrod (or Feaster) joined the Flames.

The one thing I know for certain that he did bring, however, was for the scouts to switch areas in the season so they could get more than one opinion on a number of players they were interested in. I think that is very important. However, IQ and character were DEFINITELY a focus that started under Darryl Sutter's tenure. I have no idea what other positives or negatives he brought to the Flames, however.

As for the Canucks hiring Weisbrod - obviously he was not disliked in the Bruins' organization, or Benning wouldn't have hired him on. I think we can claim that to be 'false'.

Wish him the best. He will (unfortunately) bring hockey IQ and character as important traits for that organization, which seems to have been lacking I think. However, I do think that it is generally a positive direction for the Canucks, as Benning does seem like a very intelligent and promising GM, and I am sure he made this hire knowing Weisbrod very well. They can't be any worse of a drafting team than when they were under Gillies I think.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

Geez, a lot of hate for a guy that did some good things in his time with the Flames. Is his crime being too closely tied to Feaster and his regime? Whatever his flaws, he seemed to understand that hockey IQ and character were ultimately the best traits for an NHL level prospect. I'm thankful that he helped rework our scouting focus so that we drafted some great players under his watch.

Some people's memories are so short.

Our drafting had been fine for a couple of years before he became involved.

[dustygoon]

Media kicked dirt on the guy when fired. But Feaster + Weisbrod was a funny relationship. A GM that had experience in a lot of areas except talent eval. So Weisbrod was leaned on heavily for that.

In the end.....i have a feeling that Button and Webbie if left alone with no GM influence could have drafted us some great teams.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

Geez, a lot of hate for a guy that did some good things in his time with the Flames. Is his crime being too closely tied to Feaster and his regime? Whatever his flaws, he seemed to understand that hockey IQ and character were ultimately the best traits for an NHL level prospect. I'm thankful that he helped rework our scouting focus so that we drafted some great players under his watch.

Some people's memories are so short.

well only cause you are speaking about short memories, in this very thread...

Originally Posted by the_only_turek_fan

I used to live in close proximity to a former NHL GM (the mods know who) and he told me that he called Chiarelli after Feaster hired Weisbrod and Chiarelli told this individual that Wesbrod scouted about 10 games for the Bruins and was nothing more than a big talker, and Chiarelli was happy to see John leave Boston. He said, the Bruins staff called him "Weisfraud".

He also had said Feaster went behind Dudley's back in Tampa and went straight to ownership and was telling ownership in Tampa that he is much better than Dudley and basically talked ownership into firing Dudley and hiring him.

Feaster was hired here in July of 2010. Darryl Sutter was fired in December of 2010. I wonder if history repeated itself.

I don't think either of these guys are well liked. I think that McGuire interview on 1040 is pretty accurate.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

Our drafting had been fine for a couple of years before he became involved.

Yeah, I don't know if CFF is a new Flames fan or what.... the year before? Max Reinhart, Ramage, Bill Arnold.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

Geez, a lot of hate for a guy that did some good things in his time with the Flames. Is his crime being too closely tied to Feaster and his regime? Whatever his flaws, he seemed to understand that hockey IQ and character were ultimately the best traits for an NHL level prospect. I'm thankful that he helped rework our scouting focus so that we drafted some great players under his watch.

Some people's memories are so short.

He had nothing to do with the best draft the Flames have had in decades 2011 and his role was supposedly reduced for the next best one in 2013. Seems to me he is more talk than substance. I know some of us here were questioning what he was bringing outside of a good interview well before he got fired and stuff started filtering out.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Yeah, I don't know if CFF is a new Flames fan or what.... the year before? Max Reinhart, Ramage, Bill Arnold.

Yeah, he wasn't here yet for the 2011 draft either of Baerstchi, Granlund, Wotherspoon and Gaudreau. These were Button picks.

[icecube]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

Yeah, he wasn't here yet for the 2011 draft either of Baerstchi, Granlund, Wotherspoon and Gaudreau. These were Button picks.

Wrong. He was there somehow. He also drafted the Flames core that won the cup in 89. He was the architect to be exact.

[FAN]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I dislike Francis as much as the next guy but the guys on 960 kind of mirrored Francis the day he and Feaster were fired by Burke that Weisbrod was not well received in some NHL circles. It was really odd because nobody ever said anything bad about the guy and the moment he was fired the comments started coming out. I believe he wasn't even well liked within the Bruins organization.

The number of assassinations (character) going on here these days is staggering. First he was called Weisfraud by Turek fan now he's not well liked within the Bruins organization?

One thing I could believe is that Weisbrod was not well received in some NHL circles. Thing is Feaster relied on Weisbrod and Weisbrod probably walked around acting like he was GM. Reminds me of the story Feaster told of Brian Burke on his blog. when Feaster was first hired as AGM for the Lightning I quote: “Jaybird, you do what you want to do, but the seats at the table are reserved for the managers. See those seats back there against the wall? Those seats are for the assistant GMs. Now, you do what you want, but I will tell you this, if you stay at the table your colleagues are going to be pretty (expletive) sour with you.”

http://www.thehockeynews.com/article...ian-Burke.html

Now that was more than a decade ago, but it's possible that some attitudes have not changed. It's still an old boys club. If Weisbrod was acting like a GM, I could see why that didn't sit well with some NHL managers. As for Weisbrod being disliked within the Boston organization, the top guys (Chiarelli and Benning) obviously liked him. But Weisbrod did get promoted quickly and when you rise quickly within an organization there's always going to be some people who dislike you for it.

[sureLoss]

Wait.... Weisbrod managed to stay employed by the Bruins for 5 years, even getting promoted once, while supposedly earning the nickname "Weisfraud"?

Either Chiarelli is incompetent, or Weisbrod is the George Costanza of the NHL.

[DionTheDman]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

well either case the video is here:



I can't seem to watch it as it is buffering like mad for me

Pretty bad form when they mis-spelled Darcy Regier (spelled as Regehr in the video).

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Wait.... Weisbrod managed to stay employed by the Bruins for 5 years, even getting promoted once, while supposedly earning the nickname "Weisfraud"?

Either Chiarelli is incompetent, or Weisbrod is the George Costanza of the NHL.

Well when Brian Burke was asked about Weisbrod's dismissal, and his reply was "well I don't really know him, he was never really around" ...

This was followed by Peter Mahr first saying they weren't very well liked around the league, then Pierre Macguire then TOTF... I guess mods can back up if TOTF really does live by a former NHL GM.

[FAN]

I think posters who are trying to argue that a particular prospect is Button's pick rather than Weisbrod's in order to lessen Weisbrod's impact here are missing the point. Weisbrod's influence on the Calgary Flames before Burke arrived is undeniable and widely reported. It's been reported and confirmed by Weisbrod, Feaster, and I think even Button himself.

Button reported to Weisbrod. Weisbrod , in his capacity, had the power to tell and direct Button as to what the Calgary Flames are looking for in the draft eligible prospects. It has been reported that Weisbrod did exercise this power. Ultimately, it is the scouts who did the leg work, but if you belief that a GM can influence a draft then Weisbrod certainly influenced the drafts he was charged with overseeing.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by FAN

I think posters who are trying to argue that a particular prospect is Button's pick rather than Weisbrod's in order to lessen Weisbrod's impact here are missing the point. Weisbrod's influence on the Calgary Flames before Burke arrived is undeniable and widely reported. It's been reported and confirmed by Weisbrod, Feaster, and I think even Button himself.

Button reported to Weisbrod. Weisbrod , in his capacity, had the power to tell and direct Button as to what the Calgary Flames are looking for in the draft eligible prospects. It has been reported that Weisbrod did exercise this power. Ultimately, it is the scouts who did the leg work, but you belief that a GM can influence a draft then Weisbrod certainly influenced the drafts he was charged with overseeing.

I don't

Usually, GM's may have say over who the 1st round pick will be. 95% of the credit goes to the head scout Tod Button) but even after the first 2-3 rounds, a lot of it goes down to who the scouts are fighting for, and credit (/blame) goes to the individuel scouts, not even Button.

We might like to think it was this big regime change that caused the Flames to turn the leaf on how they draft, and while it sounds romantic, do you think it was something that was not considered at all, and it took some genius work on Feaster/Weisbrod to bring this to the table? Because if it was, why was the emphasis on hockey sense ("hockey IQ" as CP likes to call it, kind of weird) and character thick though the draft before both Feaster/Weisbrod were hired?

And, Sven, Granund, Wotherspoon, and Johnny Gaudreau were all drafted BEFORE Weisbrod came to the organization?

If Weisbrod directed the draft, its 2012 and these are his "picks" (which I put neither credit nor blame, if you want to go through my post history)

Jankowski
Sieloff
Gillies
Kulak
Culkin
Gordon
DeBlow

Is there a huge emphasis on hockey sense ("hockey IQ") and character throughout that draft? Was this his big impact draft?

[PeteMoss]

He was an AGM... despite what fans think, we don't have much if any idea of what exactly was his call. For a long time people here thought he was a genius, now everyone think he is terrible. Very likely its somewhere in the middle

[FAN]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Usually, GM's may have say over who the 1st round pick will be. 95% of the credit goes to the head scout Tod Button) but even after the first 2-3 rounds, a lot of it goes down to who the scouts are fighting for, and credit (/blame) goes to the individuel scouts, not even Button.

We might like to think it was this big regime change that caused the Flames to turn the leaf on how they draft, and while it sounds romantic, do you think it was something that was not considered at all, and it took some genius work on Feaster/Weisbrod to bring this to the table?

Based on the behind the scenes videos I have seen, for most teams it's not even about the head scout but rather it's about reaching a consensus. But a regime change can bring changes to how a team drafts. It's not about being romantic. It might not even be better. But to dismiss the impact a new GM can have on a team's drafting would be foolish. Just think about it. There are so many draft eligible prospects out there and beyond the consensus top guys, how would anyone go about making a list if you don't have specific things you value more? I don't think Treliving is just going to pat Button on the back and go hey find me some good players. No. I think Treliving is going to sit down with Button and the scouts and tell him exactly the qualities he values in a player.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by FAN

Based on the behind the scenes videos I have seen, for most teams it's not even about the head scout but rather it's about reaching a consensus. But a regime change can bring changes to how a team drafts. It's not about being romantic. It might not even be better. But to dismiss the impact a new GM can have on a team's drafting would be foolish. Just think about it. There are so many draft eligible prospects out there and beyond the consensus top guys, how would anyone go about making a list if you don't have specific things you value more? I don't think Treliving is just going to pat Button on the back and go hey find me some good players. No. I think Treliving is going to sit down with Button and the scouts and tell him exactly the qualities he values in a player.

Which round?

For the first 2-3 rounds yes, but after that, you see a lot of pet projects. Look at ones like Adam Ollas-Mattsson, Tim Harrison, Alexander Deilert and Per Jonsson. There isn't one list that goes from 1-270 and they just pick them off according to the list all the time. Teams fight for their guys in the later round.

Weisbrod drafting a big hulking d-man in Rushan Rafikov, Darryl drafted a small skill forward in Mitch Wahl. I think the whole philosophy is without a doubt over dramatized. The 2 drafts with the most emphasis on "hockey IQ" was one with Darryl and one just after Jay Feaster took over. How about 2007? A hockey IQ guy in the 1st round pick, a hockey IQ and skating defenseman in the 2nd rounder... whats the difference between 2007 and 2011 or 2012?

If you go back through the records, even first round picks like Jankowski, Weisbrod goes on record to say he saw him late season, so how many games is that? Does that make him an expert?

I believe Treliving is a bit different, at least this draft, because the Coyotes were running a small business and a small budget, so he wore many different hats. I don't think you'll see Treliving acting as that much of a scout though... likely the big tournaments and local games, but I think its a little foolish to think a GM really has that big of a influence.