NHL 15 Thread

[Diemenz]

Originally Posted by AcGold

Aww but you are wrong here, the assumptions I made are because EA bid on the rights for the NFL franchise and the NFL2k5 game had better and more fluid movement than Madden 14. Also, try not to be so condescending when correcting someone as it's a fairly large character flaw to be so indignant (nobody's perfect)

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/sport...ory?id=1945691

First off nice ninja edit, your spin doctoring skills are top notch. I am glad however you changed your response because calling someone condescending while being condescending is laughable. Nice jab with the character flaw comment however that totally makes your point valid and lets everyone know your awesome, two birds with one stone! This new post is a much better attempt at trying to prove your point.

Lets jump back to your post and see how your assumptions came from the NFL exclusivity(in an NHL thread of course)

Originally Posted by AcGold

A long time ago when there were both Sega sports games and EA the games seemed to progress faster and ever since the NHL sold the sole rights the games seem to stagnate for long periods of time.

Nope no NFL there......you do however state that the games progress faster before EA had sole rights of the NHL game. Since EA does not have or did not have sole rights of the NHL how do you think that makes your argument look? You stated it as fact and I corrected you that it was wrong. Your whole arguement was based on the exclusivity of the NHL franchisee which doesn't exist, spin doctoring it to the NFL is a sad attempt at salvaging.

Originally Posted by AcGold

Makes me wonder if the NHL really makes more money have only 1 license for a mediocre franchise when they could have 2 licenses for 2 good franchises.

NFL there? Nope not there either.
NHL making more money? they do license to other game studios like THQ. Again for now the second time in one thread you are wrong this only further makes your argument baseless. Lets dig a bit further here.

NFL - Currently EA sole license, consistency voted and reviewed as of of the top sports games. 1 license 1 good franchise. 2k Sports did make a good football game.. for 1 year...back in 05.....and that's the hill you decide to die on?

NBA - Multiple Licenses, 1 good franchise in NBA2K and several mediocre franchises (EA's offerings are terrible as are THQ's)

MLB - EA and 2K had licenses at different times, 1 good franchise in The Show and several mediocre showings from 2K sports over the years.

NHL - NO LICENSE, 2K sports offerings were so bad that they stopped making the game. It had nothing to do with exclusivity. Bottom Line, 1 good franchise several mediocre (2K sports, THQ etc)

FIFA - EA holds the License and sets the bar with FIFA everyone else makes sad attempts. Outcome - 1 License, 1 good franchise, several mediocre.

Awww but I am wrong, Please explain? You do understand that I have absolutely no issues with being wrong right? I applaud people teaching me things I do not know which is why I specifically wrote "correct me if im wrong" in my post. I do know that there are millions of people on this earth who are more knowledgeable then myself on millions of topics. I am ok with that, your passive aggressive posts show you are not.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by Diemenz

NFL - Currently EA sole license, consistency voted and reviewed as of of the top sports games. 1 license 1 good franchise. 2k Sports did make a good football game.. for 1 year...back in 05.....and that's the hill you decide to die on?

It's easy to forget, and may not really count since it was unlicensed, as well may not have been intended to be an annual release but 2K did make another football game in 2008; All-Pro Football 2K8.

I find the argument that you need to have competition to make a good game a weak one. Sure, having it does give incentive to push out a better game, but when it's vacant doesn't mean that the game series isn't going to developed to the best of it's ability. When you look at franchises like MLB The Show, is 2K really their rival since The Show is only produced on one console? And considering how weak 2Ks offerings were, by this theory, MLB The Show didn't need to push the envelop since their competition was fairly weak, but yet they continued to do so.

On the other hand, 2K had no third party competitor, so they apparently were doing what so many feared, and that was produce bad games due to no incentive innovate, but that didn't work out for them since people weren't interested in buying a bad product. You still have to make a game that's progressed enough year-to-year in order to make sales. There is no benefit in resting on your exclusive licence if the games aren't worth buying. This is why exclusive licence or not, you need to make good games so you're maximizing your potential revenue.

The NBA games are another example of competition that's so one-sided, that did the present of the inferior product really make a difference? NBA 2K year in, year out performed well while NBA Live faltered behind. Took a year off to revamp, and faceplanted to the ground on their restart. Meanwhile NBA 2K remains on top, making enough progress from the previous iteration to encourage consumers to go out and buy the new game.

If a series isn't doing as well as people expect, I would blame that more on the direction of the development team, rather than the lack of a direct rival, because as shown, competition doesn't mean both games are going to be close on the quality spectrum. What happen to NHL 2K when NHL took over Gen 3? NBA Live once NBA 2K took over the reigns? Why weren't these two products unable to keep the pace?

[TjRhythmic]

Originally Posted by Joborule

It's easy to forget, and may not really count since it was unlicensed, as well may not have been intended to be an annual release but 2K did make another football game in 2008; All-Pro Football 2K8.

I find the argument that you need to have competition to make a good game a weak one. Sure, having it does give incentive to push out a better game, but when it's vacant doesn't mean that the game series isn't going to developed to the best of it's ability. When you look at franchises like MLB The Show, is 2K really their rival since The Show is only produced on one console? And considering how weak 2Ks offerings were, by this theory, MLB The Show didn't need to push the envelop since their competition was fairly weak, but yet they continued to do so.

On the other hand, 2K had no third party competitor, so they apparently were doing what so many feared, and that was produce bad games due to no incentive innovate, but that didn't work out for them since people weren't interested in buying a bad product. You still have to make a game that's progressed enough year-to-year in order to make sales. There is no benefit in resting on your exclusive licence if the games aren't worth buying. This is why exclusive licence or not, you need to make good games so you're maximizing your potential revenue.

The NBA games are another example of competition that's so one-sided, that did the present of the inferior product really make a difference? NBA 2K year in, year out performed well while NBA Live faltered behind. Took a year off to revamp, and faceplanted to the ground on their restart. Meanwhile NBA 2K remains on top, making enough progress from the previous iteration to encourage consumers to go out and buy the new game.

If a series isn't doing as well as people expect, I would blame that more on the direction of the development team, rather than the lack of a direct rival, because as shown, competition doesn't mean both games are going to be close on the quality spectrum. What happen to NHL 2K when NHL took over Gen 3? NBA Live once NBA 2K took over the reigns? Why weren't these two products unable to keep the pace?

This post isn't condescending enough...

[Diemenz]

Originally Posted by TjRhythmic

This post isn't condescending enough...

Jobo has always had an amazing ability to convey his message logically and without malice. That is a skill I do not always possess

[TjRhythmic]

IMO with regards to agreeing with Jobo in a way, but competition doesn't necessarily breed innovation. It might at first, but then it becomes a race of first to market. So you get games that are rushed, and just plain bad. 2k wanted to be first to market near the end of their cycle, they released their NHL game almost a month before EA. And each year the 2K series got worse and worse.

A company should just focus on putting out a good product, and push themselves.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by TjRhythmic

IMO with regards to agreeing with Jobo in a way, but competition doesn't necessarily breed innovation. It might at first, but then it becomes a race of first to market. So you get games that are rushed, and just plain bad. 2k wanted to be first to market near the end of their cycle, they released their NHL game almost a month before EA. And each year the 2K series got worse and worse.

A company should just focus on putting out a good product, and push themselves.

which is why I think it's insulting to release a new NHL game every year and charge the cost of a new game, when it is only an updated version of the same one, with generally only a few cosmetic changes and game play 'enhancements'.

In NHL 14, things like the Live the Life mode and Be A GM have huge defects in their basic gameplay, and the structure of them hasn't really changed since 09. Each year, EA pushes these as selling features of the game when they are clearly ancillary aspects of development. There are so many different 'modes' and menu clogging gameplay options that it's clear they've gone for quantity over quality of the experience.

Even support for the game through the year is lacklustre, with few roster changes to keep the game even close to accurate, with 'tuner' updates that often revert many of the game play improvements more inline with previous releases.

The game so clearly needs a 2 or even 3 year break for a full next gen development cycle to bring the game up to some sort of reasonable standard of quality.

I understand why EA won't/can't do that, but it doesn't make it any less true.

[Igottago]

Its just nice to have a good alternative sometimes. I remember in the PS2/Xbox era -- games like 2Khockey and Pro Evolution Soccer were absolute revelations, and IMO far better offerings than EA's counterparts. It wasn't until the following generation that EA shifted focus to authenticity and started to turn the tables.

I still maintain hope that somehow 2K hockey can return and put out a quality product, but I think its pretty hard to take on an established EA franchise these days. Not many people are willing to buy 2 hockey games per year, and fewer still will buy the unproven alternative over the known franchise.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

which is why I think it's insulting to release a new NHL game every year and charge the cost of a new game, when it is only an updated version of the same one, with generally only a few cosmetic changes and game play 'enhancements'.

In NHL 14, things like the Live the Life mode and Be A GM have huge defects in their basic gameplay, and the structure of them hasn't really changed since 09. Each year, EA pushes these as selling features of the game when they are clearly ancillary aspects of development. There are so many different 'modes' and menu clogging gameplay options that it's clear they've gone for quantity over quality of the experience.

Even support for the game through the year is lacklustre, with few roster changes to keep the game even close to accurate, with 'tuner' updates that often revert many of the game play improvements more inline with previous releases.

The game so clearly needs a 2 or even 3 year break for a full next gen development cycle to bring the game up to some sort of reasonable standard of quality.

I understand why EA won't/can't do that, but it doesn't make it any less true.

There was a good point about being condescending, and I fall into that sometimes unfortunately, so this quotation has no pretext to it.


How is that insulting? Don't buy it if it isn't better, no?

If the reason is that updated rosters and higher multiplayer participation isn't worth the money, then don't buy it. They aren't insulting IMO

[AcGold]

Originally Posted by Diemenz

First off nice ninja edit, your spin doctoring skills are top notch. I am glad however you changed your response because calling someone condescending while being condescending is laughable. Nice jab with the character flaw comment however that totally makes your point valid and lets everyone know your awesome, two birds with one stone! This new post is a much better attempt at trying to prove your point..

Actually it was constructive criticism. You should calm down and take a look at yourself here, starting arguments and getting hyper-sensitive then throwing out rhetoric to make me look bad. I was trying to help you, if someone makes a mistake don't act like a complete tool about it, no one will respect you. And it wasn't a ninja edit, I like to use correct words to properly present what I'm thinking. Telling me I'm spin doctoring is ridiculous, it's called a conversation.

What you are doing is similar to someone saying something incorrectly during a real conversation and one person going out of their way to make sure everyone around knows it happened, rather large character flaw.

[Diemenz]

Originally Posted by AcGold

Actually it was constructive criticism. You should calm down and take a look at yourself here, starting arguments and getting hyper-sensitive then throwing out rhetoric to make me look bad. I was trying to help you, if someone makes a mistake don't act like a complete tool about it, no one will respect you. And it wasn't a ninja edit, I like to use correct words to properly present what I'm thinking. Telling me I'm spin doctoring is ridiculous, it's called a conversation.

What you are doing is similar to someone saying something incorrectly during a real conversation and one person going out of their way to make sure everyone around knows it happened, rather large character flaw.

Again with your ninja editing. Let me explain something to you.
I merely corrected you when you were wrong, then you again repeated the same wrong information and decided within that post to call me condescending (and in a condescending way at that), attack me personally by saying i have character flaws then call me a tool in this post. Seems like maybe you got that hypersensitive thing mixed up. My intention is not to make you look bad just provide the right information to people reading the thread, your intention on the other hand is quite obvious.
I am not going to attack you personally like you feel you have to do to me. I do however suggest that if your going to go around saying people have character flaws you might want to look in the mirror.

If you want to continue to attack me personally take it to PM's people do not need this thread cluttered up with your backpedaling and name calling.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

which is why I think it's insulting to release a new NHL game every year and charge the cost of a new game, when it is only an updated version of the same one, with generally only a few cosmetic changes and game play 'enhancements'.

In NHL 14, things like the Live the Life mode and Be A GM have huge defects in their basic gameplay, and the structure of them hasn't really changed since 09. Each year, EA pushes these as selling features of the game when they are clearly ancillary aspects of development. There are so many different 'modes' and menu clogging gameplay options that it's clear they've gone for quantity over quality of the experience.

Even support for the game through the year is lacklustre, with few roster changes to keep the game even close to accurate, with 'tuner' updates that often revert many of the game play improvements more inline with previous releases.

The game so clearly needs a 2 or even 3 year break for a full next gen development cycle to bring the game up to some sort of reasonable standard of quality.

I understand why EA won't/can't do that, but it doesn't make it any less true.

It's not insulting - it's the way the business works.

If EA had to take years off in-between games to ensure higher quality through longer dev cycles, they wouldn't be able to make the game at all. Hell, the NHL wouldn't allow them to make the game if they wanted to do that. They'd terminate the licensing deal due to inactivity and we'd be SOL when it comes to hockey games.

They need the yearly kick to keep the studio working on the game operating. Financially, it's not a realistic option for them to take 2 or even 3 years off.

It still blows my mind that so many people simply do not understand the business of the industry while lambasting the product so heavily. It's ignorant, and insulting to everyone who works in the game industry. If you truly understand why they can't do it - then why the hate? It makes very little sense.

[Brannigans Law]

What I don't and can't understand is why we can't hold EA accountable to make a better madden and nhl experience. so much doesn't change. the series has stagnated. maybe things will improve with the new set of XB1 and PS4 games.. but I doubt it.

FIFA is pretty decent tho I'll give it that

[TjRhythmic]

Originally Posted by Brannigans Law

What I don't and can't understand is why we can't hold EA accountable to make a better madden and nhl experience. so much doesn't change. the series has stagnated. maybe things will improve with the new set of XB1 and PS4 games.. but I doubt it.

FIFA is pretty decent tho I'll give it that

At least your going in with an open mind. That is step 1

[AcGold]

Originally Posted by Diemenz

Again with your ninja editing. Let me explain something to you.
I merely corrected you when you were wrong, then you again repeated the same wrong information and decided within that post to call me condescending (and in a condescending way at that), attack me personally by saying i have character flaws then call me a tool in this post. Seems like maybe you got that hypersensitive thing mixed up. My intention is not to make you look bad just provide the right information to people reading the thread, your intention on the other hand is quite obvious.
I am not going to attack you personally like you feel you have to do to me. I do however suggest that if your going to go around saying people have character flaws you might want to look in the mirror.

If you want to continue to attack me personally take it to PM's people do not need this thread cluttered up with your backpedaling and name calling.

Back peddling? Are you freaking serious? You have issues, I acknowledged EA didn't get the NHL rights and you lost your mind and started just started making things up. Back peddling, what joke, seek help

By the way, not letting something go when someone admitted a mistake is a huge character flaw, whatever way you want to skew it in your crazy mind

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by AcGold

Back peddling? Are you freaking serious? You have issues, I acknowledged EA didn't get the NHL rights and you lost your mind and started just started making things up. Back peddling, what joke, seek help

By the way, not letting something go when someone admitted a mistake is a huge character flaw, whatever way you want to skew it in your crazy mind

Holy eff...It's been a week, let it die or take it to PM.

[Diemenz]

Originally Posted by AcGold

Back peddling? Are you freaking serious? You have issues, I acknowledged EA didn't get the NHL rights and you lost your mind and started just started making things up. Back peddling, what joke, seek help

By the way, not letting something go when someone admitted a mistake is a huge character flaw, whatever way you want to skew it in your crazy mind

Again with the personal attacks. Are you able to have a conversation without them or is it just par for the course with you?

[TjRhythmic]

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

Holy eff...It's been a week, let it die or take it to PM.

Speak for yourself... this is my favorite show so far this summer

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Diemenz

Again with the personal attacks. Are you able to have a conversation without them or is it just par for the course with you?

He is like that in every thread.


Try poking around the immunization thread(s).....

[Flash Walken]

So, any news on this game?

[Russic]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

So, any news on this game?

Shut your f*&#*ing mouth.


Am I doing this right?