Province short teachers to mark diploma exams.....

[The Big Chill]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Some whiny losers are complaining about not wanting to do it. But with 70% of positions filled, about 650 teachers have decided - a month early, no less - that it is fair remuneration. Publice/private is irrelevant to this portion of the argument. There is, in fact, no problem here. It's just the union and some dummies flapping their gums about a problem that doesn't exist. There will be enough teachers to mark the exams because it's a sweet deal. An extra $100 to $200 per day on top of an already professional-level salary. Some great pocket money just in time for two months off during the warmest weather our country sees.

The discussion was based on a shortage of teachers to grade tests, as the title suggests. If we're assuming that's not the case, then this whole thread is pointless.

[Reaper]

All I have to say is that one's position is often degraded when they insist on name calling in the presentation of their argument.

[WinnipegFan]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Maybe the government can bring in some TFW's. This is exactly the situation that the program was established for. They can't find qualified Canadian candidates to do the job so they should bring in outside help.

They did outsource it to University students and it was horrible the discrepency rates were so bad that they had to remark every exam again with the teachers. The insult here was they paid the University student 100 dollars a day more than they did the teachers. However, teachers once again answered the call as it is in the best interest of students.

The cut here happened when a decision was made arbitrarily to save money and cut at this spot particularly because there was no one there to represent the exam. Now they are hoping that the teachers will show up again in the best interest of the students. However, given the landscape of cuts to education the teachers are withdrawing there services. There are 7/10 spots filled with teachers who are worried about the kids or are new markers and this is an avenue to try and find work. It went poorly in January and it will be impossible to finish on time in June.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Some whiny losers are complaining about not wanting to do it. But with 70% of positions filled, about 650 teachers have decided - a month early, no less - that it is fair remuneration. Publice/private is irrelevant to this portion of the argument. There is, in fact, no problem here. It's just the union and some dummies flapping their gums about a problem that doesn't exist. There will be enough teachers to mark the exams because it's a sweet deal. An extra $100 to $200 per day on top of an already professional-level salary. Some great pocket money just in time for two months off during the warmest weather our country sees.

But you're acting like it's simply show up and get paid, so don't complain about whether its $100 or $200, it's easy money. Well no, its not easy money. It is very difficult and time consuming to mark these exams. Most exams will take 15-25 minutes each to mark, with literally tens of thousands of exams to mark. Exams have to be marked in Edmonton too, so unless the teacher leaves in Edmonton and area there is an inconvenience involved. If there are some who feel that the remuneration now is not good enough, they’re entitled to feel that way and can voice their opinion by not doing it. Simple enough

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by WinnipegFan

They did outsource it to University students and it was horrible the discrepency rates were so bad that they had to remark every exam again with the teachers. The insult here was they paid the University student 100 dollars a day more than they did the teachers. However, teachers once again answered the call as it is in the best interest of students.

The cut here happened when a decision was made arbitrarily to save money and cut at this spot particularly because there was no one there to represent the exam. Now they are hoping that the teachers will show up again in the best interest of the students. However, given the landscape of cuts to education the teachers are withdrawing there services. There are 7/10 spots filled with teachers who are worried about the kids or are new markers and this is an avenue to try and find work. It went poorly in January and it will be impossible to finish on time in June.

They can target well educated, Masters or PhD degree holders for the TFWs. They can probably do better than the students they previously used.

Or the government can just adopt the grading system one of my professors told me about. You take the papers/exams to the top of a staircase. Drop them down the stairs and rank them based on landing position. Best marks for the highest up and lowest marks for the papers that made it down furthest.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Did I go to university for four years to become a writer so I could stay late five nights in a row putting marketing message stickers on water bottles? Of course not, but after my day job is done I am occasionally required to help in other areas of our business so the company as a whole accomplishes what it needs to do. You have completely lost sight of the bigger picture of what is required of you and, frankly, it's ridiculous.

Just curious, but what kind of writer are you that you are doing all this manual labour at work and also firing people?

[flamingreen]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

Just curious, but what kind of writer are you that you are doing all this manual labour at work and also firing people?

Fiction.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by fotze

I would have thought the prove would say ah data it and jack the pay back up, but didn't read about the uni students, yikes.

Scabs, basically.

Every parent with a child in grade 12 should be up in arms about this.

This could be the difference between thousands of dollars in student loans and scholarships, or being able to get into a university at all.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

Just curious, but what kind of writer are you that you are doing all this manual labour at work and also firing people?

Writer in a marketing department for five years. Been running my own manufacturing company for nine years.

[saskflames69]

Originally Posted by WinnipegFan

http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/al...749/story.html



This is an issue for any of you with grade twelve students. Some of the alternatives are seriously scary. For example:

Only multiple choice for the ELA exam
Mandating teachers to mark - this sounds like a quick fix but will result in chaos
Outsourcing the marking - they did htis once then had to hire the teachers back to remark them. They used university students and paid them MORE than they did the teachers and then had to pay the teacehrs anyways.

You say that like it's a bad thing!

[Coys1882]

Unions.

[WinnipegFan]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

Unions.

Wrong, dead wrong. In fact our union is against the diploma exam and the union's stance is they prefer we don't go marking. It is an independent contract between the government and the teacher.

[RougeUnderoos]

Independent contracts.

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by WinnipegFan

Wrong, dead wrong. In fact our union is against the diploma exam and the union's stance is they prefer we don't go marking. It is an independent contract between the government and the teacher.

I know this is a very general statement and that I don't know the education system well enough as to it's finer details but if there's a union involved - it's bogging things down. They always do.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by WinnipegFan

They did outsource it to University students and it was horrible the discrepency rates were so bad that they had to remark every exam again with the teachers. The insult here was they paid the University student 100 dollars a day more than they did the teachers. However, teachers once again answered the call as it is in the best interest of students.

lol, dude, there is no insult here. How much does a teacher get paid per day? Say they make $90K per year for their nine months of work, that would be about 195 work days, which equates to $461 per day. Plus the $100 per-day bonus. That puts the teachers at $561 per day to mark. You're telling me students were being paid $661 per day!? I highly doubt it.

Originally Posted by WinnipegFan

The cut here happened when a decision was made arbitrarily to save money and cut at this spot particularly because there was no one there to represent the exam. Now they are hoping that the teachers will show up again in the best interest of the students. However, given the landscape of cuts to education the teachers are withdrawing there services. There are 7/10 spots filled with teachers who are worried about the kids or are new markers and this is an avenue to try and find work. It went poorly in January and it will be impossible to finish on time in June.

They seem to have made a good decision since almost three quarters of the positions were filled at the time of the article with a month to fill the remaining three out of 10 spots.

Here's a genuine question I'd like you to answer: Is it possible the $200 per day on top of their regular salary was too high and $100 is more fair? Would you have been just as mad if it was dropped to $150? Why is $200 the magic number that makes all this fair? Is their a number that you think is fair, but is less than $200?

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Sliver

lol, dude, there is no insult here. How much does a teacher get paid per day? Say they make $90K per year for their nine months of work, that would be about 195 work days, which equates to $461 per day. Plus the $100 per-day bonus. That puts the teachers at $561 per day to mark. You're telling me students were being paid $661 per day!? I highly doubt it.



They seem to have made a good decision since almost three quarters of the positions were filled at the time of the article with a month to fill the remaining three out of 10 spots.

Here's a genuine question I'd like you to answer: Is it possible the $200 per day on top of their regular salary was too high and $100 is more fair? Would you have been just as mad if it was dropped to $150? Why is $200 the magic number that makes all this fair? Is their a number that you think is fair, but is less than $200?

why do you believe this is on top of their regular salary.


These are two separate contracts. They do not get out of work by doing the marking. They still have to complete the terms of there existing contract with the CBE.

I do agree that if they can get enough teachers at $100 per day than they shouldn't pay more but if they are short at the end than they should increase the rate. I don't think its insulting its just trying to optimize cost for the work done.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

I know this is a very general statement and that I don't know the education system well enough as to it's finer details but if there's a union involved - it's bogging things down. They always do.

"I don't have time for facts. I have uninformed opinions to post!"

[terminator]

Originally Posted by Sliver

lol, dude, there is no insult here. How much does a teacher get paid per day? Say they make $90K per year for their nine months of work, that would be about 195 work days, which equates to $461 per day. Plus the $100 per-day bonus. That puts the teachers at $561 per day to mark. You're telling me students were being paid $661 per day!? I highly doubt it.



They seem to have made a good decision since almost three quarters of the positions were filled at the time of the article with a month to fill the remaining three out of 10 spots.

Here's a genuine question I'd like you to answer: Is it possible the $200 per day on top of their regular salary was too high and $100 is more fair? Would you have been just as mad if it was dropped to $150? Why is $200 the magic number that makes all this fair? Is their a number that you think is fair, but is less than $200?

Teachers can only make $90k after 6-years of service plus they must have a 6-years of university or 2-degrees.

Further, the extra $100 should not count towards their total pay since its definitley not part of their job description... see their CBA.

Also, each school should have a gaurd dog protecting the exams from theft.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by GGG

why do you believe this is on top of their regular salary.


These are two separate contracts. They do not get out of work by doing the marking. They still have to complete the terms of there existing contract with the CBE.

I do agree that if they can get enough teachers at $100 per day than they shouldn't pay more but if they are short at the end than they should increase the rate. I don't think its insulting its just trying to optimize cost for the work done.

They're still getting paid by CBE, but classes are out so they aren't teaching. They have the time and availability to do this. It's a sweet gig and hundreds of teachers seem to agree evidenced by the fact they have filled the vast majority of these positions and they still have a month to fill the remaining few.

[terminator]

Originally Posted by Sliver

They're still getting paid by CBE, but classes are out so they aren't teaching. They have the time and availability to do this. It's a sweet gig and hundreds of teachers seem to agree evidenced by the fact they have filled the vast majority of these positions and they still have a month to fill the remaining few.

$100/day is not a sweet gig, I'd like to see stats on how many of the teachers who accepted those positoins are subsitutes?