[Trade] Reto Berra to the Avs for a *2014 2nd round pick* - Page 23 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

saillias · 03-13-2014, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theoforever

While we are happy about getting a 2nd round pick for Berra. I'm convinced Berra will be an excellent goalie for years to come. If Roy believes in him it's a done deal.

I wonder if people said the same thing about Gretzky.

theoforever · 03-13-2014, 06:47 PM

Goalie position is very important.
If we can draft a top pair defenseman and Ortio becomes an excellent goalie than we have done well.
However, if Berra becomes a second coming of Roy, Ortio doesn't amount to much and we pick a dud...............
Either way lots of variables, and too early to judge.

theoforever · 03-13-2014, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saillias

I wonder if people said the same thing about Gretzky.

Roy was not given a coaching position he earned it and has done extremely well so far in NHL. Coach of the year for sure.

moon · 03-13-2014, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theoforever

While we are happy about getting a 2nd round pick for Berra. I'm convinced Berra will be an excellent goalie for years to come. If Roy believes in him it's a done deal.

Does Patrick Roy have a long (or any history?) of picking out top level NHL goalies?

Quote:

Originally Posted by theoforever

Goalie position is very important.
If we can draft a top pair defenseman and Ortio becomes an excellent goalie than we have done well.
However, if Berra becomes a second coming of Roy, Ortio doesn't amount to much and we pick a dud...............
Either way lots of variables, and too early to judge.

Sure but Berra has shown zero indication that he has what it takes to be an NHL starter let alone the second coming of Roy.

Seems a little silly to worry about a 27 year old goalie will take an insane jump in ability and play at a level he hasn't come close to showing he can.

strombad · 03-13-2014, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theoforever

Goalie position is very important.
If we can draft a top pair defenseman and Ortio becomes an excellent goalie than we have done well.
However, if Berra becomes a second coming of Roy, Ortio doesn't amount to much and we pick a dud...............
Either way lots of variables, and too early to judge.

Sure, if Berra becomes a hall of fame goaltender then we screwed up.

The chances of that happening are so incredibly insignificant, you're essentially worrying over nothing. Like people who don't want to go on a plane because it might crash. Yeah, it's POSSIBLE, but it's so incredibly unlikely.

theoforever · 03-13-2014, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moon

Does Patrick Roy have a long (or any history?) of picking out top level NHL goalies?

Sure but Berra has shown zero indication that he has what it takes to be an NHL starter let alone the second coming of Roy.

Seems a little silly to worry about a 27 year old goalie will take an insane jump in ability and play at a level he hasn't come close to showing he can.

Roy has done a good job with his goalies so far.
Berra has shown good movement, reflexes are good. Needs work in some areas.
Clearly second coming of Roy is just an expression.
I see Berra as a capable backup with a chance of being a starter.
Ortio should be better, he probably already is.
If we didn't have Ortio in the system I would stick with Berra.

strombad · 03-13-2014, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theoforever

Roy has done a good job with his goalies so far.
Berra has shown good movement, reflexes are good. Needs work in some areas.
Clearly second coming of Roy is just an expression.
I see Berra as a capable backup with a chance of being a starter.
Ortio should be better, he probably already is.
If we didn't have Ortio in the system I would stick with Berra.

Where? When?

kyuss275 · 03-13-2014, 07:03 PM

Maybe I am reading into some of the posts wrong, but some make it seem like the av's see him as a future starter. From everything I have read it seems with a bit of help from av's goalie coach, they see him as a competent back up. Not sure how some on CP think he will be a legit starter? Considering Roy and the goalie coach ( one of the best in the business ) see him as a backup, then we got a great deal getting a 2nd. If Burke or new GM don't believe in Ramo/Ortio going forward, I have no doubt in my mind that they could trade that 2nd round pick for a better goalie then Berra will ever be.

theoforever · 03-13-2014, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strombad

Where? When?

In NHL for one. Varlamov is doing rather well so is JSG.
In fact the entire team is doing well. Are you saying Roy hasn't had a positive impact on the team?

moon · 03-13-2014, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theoforever

Roy has done a good job with his goalies so far.
Berra has shown good movement, reflexes are good. Needs work in some areas.
Clearly second coming of Roy is just an expression.
I see Berra as a capable backup with a chance of being a starter.
Ortio should be better, he probably already is.
If we didn't have Ortio in the system I would stick with Berra.

Doing a good job coaching goalies already on the roster and already established is far different from identifying a guy with very raw skills and mediocre to poor numbers and thinking that guy can turn into an excellent goalie.

Sure Berra could be a capable back-up with starter potential but it is far from a done deal because Patrick Roy is with the Avs and back-up goalies are a dime a dozen so if you get a 2nd round pick for that you take it and run.

Passe La Puck · 03-13-2014, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theoforever

In NHL for one. Varlamov is doing rather well so is JSG.
In fact the entire team is doing well. Are you saying Roy hasn't had a positive impact on the team?

How well players do under Roy is irrelevant to the Flames though, and Roy didn't scout nor draft those players so it's moot.

strombad · 03-13-2014, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theoforever

In NHL for one. Varlamov is doing rather well so is JSG.
In fact the entire team is doing well. Are you saying Roy hasn't had a positive impact on the team?

That's because they're good goalies. It's not like either are putting up career best numbers, so what exactly has Roy done in relation to either of those guys that suggests what you suggest?

LGA · 03-13-2014, 07:25 PM

Sounds like the Avs have re-upped him for 3 years.

From an Avs fan perspective, if Berra can become a solid backup and provide the team with confidence to give Varlamov a couple more nights off I'm pretty happy with the move. I think Allaire sees that potential in him, and I'm okay with taking a gamble.

Fire · 03-13-2014, 07:26 PM

3 year extension? That's a bonehead move by the Avalanche. They will probably be hiding him in the minors by the end of next season.

theoforever · 03-13-2014, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strombad

That's because they're good goalies. It's not like either are putting up career best numbers, so what exactly has Roy done in relation to either of those guys that suggests what you suggest?

If you check the stats they are doing better than last year.
JSG is old so clearly his stats will not be his top stats, but everyone has said he is having a resurgence.

Varlamov on the other hand is having his best year ever and playing more games than ever before. So, yeah Roy has had a positive impact.

theoforever · 03-13-2014, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Passe La Puck

How well players do under Roy is irrelevant to the Flames though, and Roy didn't scout nor draft those players so it's moot.

Irrelevant if he drafted them. They are playing better under his coaching.
So, if anyone can help Berra, Roy could be the guy.

As for how it affects the Flames, if he goes somewhere else and does well he would be just another player to do so from countless parade of players that have done so.

Vinny01 · 03-13-2014, 07:45 PM

It is widely known Feaster was fleeced in the Brad Richards deal. He did acquire Mike Smith who eventually developed into a top goalie only not with Tampa. Feaster talked big about Berra in the Bouwmeester trade and at this time it looks like Feaster was totally fleeced. If Berra does become a stud it won't be in Calgary.

Still love the trade though with Ortio coming up

strombad · 03-13-2014, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theoforever

If you check the stats they are doing better than last year.
JSG is old so clearly his stats will not be his top stats, but everyone has said he is having a resurgence.

Varlamov on the other hand is having his best year ever and playing more games than ever before. So, yeah Roy has had a positive impact.

I think you're just totally ignorant concerning Roy's impact on the goaltenders.

The whole team was awful last year, they're much better this year. A goaltender is naturally going to have better stats during periods where the entire team is doing better.

You're talking like Roy is some sort of goaltending development guru, he hasn't proven that at all. JS had worse stats last year, sure, but the year before that he was better than this year, so there's no "resurgence" going on.

Roy's effect in Berra will likely be negligible. Nothing has suggested otherwise.

Alberta_Beef · 03-13-2014, 07:55 PM

Good for Berra on getting an extension. I wish him the best and hope he proves some of the naysayers wrong.

theoforever · 03-13-2014, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strombad

I think you're just totally ignorant concerning Roy's impact on the goaltenders.

The whole team was awful last year, they're much better this year. A goaltender is naturally going to have better stats during periods where the entire team is doing better.

You're talking like Roy is some sort of goaltending development guru, he hasn't proven that at all. JS had worse stats last year, sure, but the year before that he was better than this year, so there's no "resurgence" going on.

Roy's effect in Berra will likely be negligible. Nothing has suggested otherwise.

The only ignorance was that of stats, since you didn't know those.
There is zero supporting evidence that Roy would not have positive effect on Berra. The evidence is sparse but is there to point to contrary to your opinion.

JSG resurgence was reported by radio/tv guys, stats prove it.
You can go one more year back with JSG stats too.

No argument about Varlamov's numbers?

The team is doing better because Roy is doing a good job coaching, goalies are doing better for the same reason. What's the problem?