Flames to announce plans to announce arena plans in the... future...

[Muta]

Originally Posted by Tyler

Not to detract from this thread, but this is a massive assumption. Not many cities of 1.3M have light rail all the way to their airports. I would be hard pressed for you to find any evidence of an overwhelming demand (in 2014) for this to be 'needed'

The train that goes from the Vancouver Airport to downtown is one of the most efficient trains I've ever had the pleasure of riding on. It has huge ridership, and it is expanding since the 2010 Olympics.

Not sure why Calgary has to wait for other cities to do it first. Having a train from the airport to the downtown core is HUGE. It will be absolutely essential to have in the future, if it isn't already. We have many business travelers coming here and tourism is growing. It makes complete sense.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by Muta

There are plans for the Glenbow. Be patient.

I don't know what drives me more crazy. The fact that it seems like you know things, or the fact that YOU CANT TELL PEOPLE THOSE THINGS.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Let me start by saying I have no inside information and this is pure speculation (don't go crazy, strombad).
Given that there seems to be hints that the announcement is "bigger" than just an arena, wouldn't it make sense that the plan includes hotel/convention centre/possibly Glenbow/entertainment district? If so, my money is on Stampede/Victoria Park.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by metroneck

I don't think you can underestimate the societal impact if having an NHL team. Apart from the $, there are a lot of positives. Hockey is one of the most important cultural events in this Country. Based on how many people 'consume' it, nothing else is even close.

True. But Canadians in Lethbridge, Halifax, and Saskatoon manage to 'consume' a lot of hockey - including NHL hockey - without subsidizing businesses owned by billionaires to do it.

[Joborule]

Of late, I would be more in favour of the venue being Victoria Park. In combination with the East Village development and Stampede Park future developments, that area potential in that area is fairly big. Flames ownership would have a better chance of fulfilling their vision south of the CPR railway tracks than trying to build a surrounding community from scratch in the West Village.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by strombad

I don't know what drives me more crazy. The fact that it seems like you know things, or the fact that YOU CANT TELL PEOPLE THOSE THINGS.

I can not say anything at all; I don't owe you anything.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by Muta

The train that goes from the Vancouver Airport to downtown is one of the most efficient trains I've ever had the pleasure of riding on. It has huge ridership, and it is expanding since the 2010 Olympics.

Not sure why Calgary has to wait for other cities to do it first. Having a train from the airport to the downtown core is HUGE. It will be absolutely essential to have in the future, if it isn't already. We have many business travelers coming here and tourism is growing. It makes complete sense.

That train was built with olympic money, was it not?

I think the city has bigger infrastructure needs than a train to the airport. Daily commuter legs are far more important IMO.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

That train was built with olympic money, was it not?

Yes, a portion of it was. It's still being expanded today without Olympic money, however.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

In this case.. the same scenario happens whether the owners get a new arena or they play in the Saddledome.

Just think of the recent lockout... did the Calgary economy suffer at all because of it? The arena was sitting empty for a long while and i doubt there was much impact. The bars/restaurants around the arena may have suffered, but most of the money that would have been spent there would have been spent in other areas of the city.

On the first point - I agree with you (sort of) for the time being. I agree, for now, replacing the Saddledome doens "have" to happen, especially from the hockey perspective. But eventually, the Flames will need a new arena to keep the team sustanable in the city, and when that happens (I won't bother to debate whether that time is now or 10 years from now, I won't pretend to know) if the city wants to continue to benefit from having such a facility and teams in town, it has some stake in the game is the point. What I will say, is on the concert front, the Saddledome is already missing out on opportunities as show's that used to come by, are not longer hitting Calgary (for reasons that have nothing to do with the buildings age, but design I know) and there for negatively impacting local business and therefore the city to some extent (the losses worth a new building at this point, likely not).

As for the lockout question, I don't know the answer definitevely, but I'd wager that it is Yes, the lockout did hurt the cities economy. I'm sure if you asked the businesses around the dome or in the city that leverage the NHL season or events at the dome to create the traffic that their business model depends on, they were hurt very badly during the lockout. All having impact on job creation and sustainability in the city.

Again, I don't know what a "reasonable" stake the city has in a project like this would be. Might not be very much. But I think it's hard to argue that benefit does not occure from having such a facility and NHL team to the city, one just needs to head down to a local licensed establishment within down town on a Saturday night on game night and compare the traffic those nights to non game Staruday nights............the difference in many establishments is stark. People spend more money in this city on event nights, which keep businesses and employees of those businesses up and running.

[Tyler]

Originally Posted by Muta

The train that goes from the Vancouver Airport to downtown is one of the most efficient trains I've ever had the pleasure of riding on. It has huge ridership, and it is expanding since the 2010 Olympics.

Not sure why Calgary has to wait for other cities to do it first. Having a train from the airport to the downtown core is HUGE. It will be absolutely essential to have in the future, if it isn't already. We have many business travelers coming here and tourism is growing. It makes complete sense.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be nice, but it's not as critical in a smaller city like Calgary.

As mentioned above, the Canada Line in Vancouver was built with Olympic money, and probably wouldn't have been completed had they not won the bid for the games. Toronto (a city 5 times bigger than Calgary) is only just getting rail to Pearson now.

Calgary will extend the NE line to the airport at some point in the future. Is it critical now or even in the next 5-10 years? I'm doubtful. Hell, we only got a direct downtown to the airport BRT shuttle a year or two ago. Walk before you run and all that..

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

That train was built with olympic money, was it not?

I think the city has bigger infrastructure needs than a train to the airport. Daily commuter legs are far more important IMO.

It was part of the overall Canada Line project, which had a fair amount of federal funding (associated with the Olympics). The Airport Authority in Vancouver also kicked in a big chunk of money to bring the skytrain there.

We have an airport rail link in our RouteAhead plan. The airport tunnel allows us to connect to the NE line. It may also connect west to the North Central line to create a cross-town route with the Airport connection anchoring the line in the middle.

As you state, as nice as an airport line is however, its ridership potential is minuscule compared to higher priority rapid transit lines like the Green Line, SW Transitway, 17th Ave SE Transitway and so forth (all of which now have at least first phase funding in place as of last Friday!!).

[nik-]

Originally Posted by strombad

I don't know what drives me more crazy. The fact that it seems like you know things, or the fact that YOU CANT TELL PEOPLE THOSE THINGS.

Definitely the latter.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by Muta

I can not say anything at all; I don't owe you anything.

What? You DON'T owe me anything?



I think I speak for a lot of people who are just excited, and the little bits of information only make it more interesting.

Thanks for what tidbits you are able to share.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by strombad

I don't know what drives me more crazy. The fact that it seems like you know things, or the fact that YOU CANT TELL PEOPLE THOSE THINGS.

I'm starting to think Muta is Ken King.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by strombad

What? You DON'T owe me anything?



I think I speak for a lot of people who are just excited, and the little bits of information only make it more interesting.

Thanks for what tidbits you are able to share.

Seriously... maybe you should tone down your hostility / condescending responses in your posts today then. I don't owe you anything, I don't owe this board anything. I'm contributing what I can and what I'm allowed to from my own goodwill towards CP. I don't mind sharing tidbits, but posters like you make me willingly want to go silent.

I can stop posting in this thread altogether, which, really, I have no problem doing. I can PM certain posters here that I trust and respect instead. I am not revealing details because I choose not to out of respect for the process. I haven't revealed anything confidential, but those who know me on this board will trust my opinion.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by Muta

Seriously... maybe you should tone down your hostility / condescending responses in your posts today then. I don't owe you anything, I don't owe this board anything. I'm contributing what I can and what I'm allowed to from my own goodwill towards CP. I don't mind sharing tidbits, but posters like you make me willingly want to go silent.

I can stop posting in this thread altogether, which, really, I have no problem doing. I can PM certain posters here that I trust and respect instead. I am not revealing details because I choose not to out of respect for the process. I haven't revealed anything confidential, but those who know me on this board will trust my opinion.

Guy, relax. I'm sorry.

I was only joking. Thought it was pretty clear, then you missed it, so I thought "Hey I'll throw up a nic cage gif! That diffuses every situation, nobody can stay mad at nic cage!" but clearly that didn't work.

There is absolutely ZERO hostility or intent to be condescending in any of my responses towards you or the process. I genuinely appreciate the tidbits, and I look forward to more. Again, I was only JOKING, so I apologise if it's actually upset you. I don't need or even ask of anything more than what you've provided, I understand it isn't your place to leak private information, I was simply expressing myself in jest.

If I post another nic cage gif you won't get even more upset will you? Ah hell, I'm doing it anyway.

[Jimmy Stang]

In fairness to strombad, I didn't detect hostility in the initial post. I just saw it as "Muta sure knows a lot about this stuff, but these tidbits of info leave me wanting more."

I feel the same way. I get excited because I believe your info to be credible and exciting, and although I wish you could tell us more, I completely understand why you can't.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I just saw it as "I wish you could tell us more!" and nothing else.

[nik-]

Come on Muta, you can see how it's annoying when someone posts that they know something and then tells you they can't say more. I'm not saying hostility is warranted, but that kind of "I know something you don't know" stuff has been annoying since kindergarten.

You do have a lot of other things you post that are very informative though.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by strombad

Guy, relax. I'm sorry.

I was only joking. Thought it was pretty clear, then you missed it, so I thought "Hey I'll throw up a nic cage gif! That diffuses every situation, nobody can stay mad at nic cage!" but clearly that didn't work.

There is absolutely ZERO hostility or intent to be condescending in any of my responses towards you or the process. I genuinely appreciate the tidbits, and I look forward to more. Again, I was only JOKING, so I apologise if it's actually upset you. I don't need or even ask of anything more than what you've provided, I understand it isn't your place to leak private information, I was simply expressing myself in jest.

If I post another nic cage gif you won't get even more upset will you? Ah hell, I'm doing it anyway.

Apology accepted. I looked at it again and I can see it probably wasn't as bad as it initially seemed. No worries.

But if you post one more pic of Nicolas Cage again, I'm going full Sundeep Malhi.

[Buff]

Hmmm, which is worth more... seeing another Sundeep incident, or getting tidbits of information.... you're really putting us in a bind here, Muta.